Warrior General Games

Originally posted by bhall43
woofta...sounds like it was a good day to take off from GLB.

way the server is backed up, I'm guessing catch is getting a lot of messages from guys taking advantage of the flex refund.

Originally posted by Dr. E
way the server is backed up, I'm guessing catch is getting a lot of messages from guys taking advantage of the flex refund.

im thinkin as many dot games as I have watched over the last 2 weeks I should just let everyone else fix up the game and come back on day -8.

In the games I have been watching it is still very easy to complete a long pass in single coverage since the defensive dot the vast majority of the time just keeps on moving when the offensive dot stops to catch the ball. The QB is throwing short on purpose I guess to get this type of reaction. The other thing I see happening on long passes is the defensive dot is sitting in perfect position in the short position and still no play to be made.

I understand completions will happen but a long pass should only be completed 40% if the DB is covering well.

I would also like to thank all the testers and GLB users who have been submitted stuff for possible changes.

Originally posted by voegma
In the games I have been watching it is still very easy to complete a long pass in single coverage since the defensive dot the vast majority of the time just keeps on moving when the offensive dot stops to catch the ball. The QB is throwing short on purpose I guess to get this type of reaction. The other thing I see happening on long passes is the defensive dot is sitting in perfect position in the short position and still no play to be made.

I understand completions will happen but a long pass should only be completed 40% if the DB is covering well.

I would also like to thank all the testers and GLB users who have been submitted stuff for possible changes.

voe - you should collect and provide links for all this stuff. its the only way things will get addressed

Originally posted by voegma
In the games I have been watching it is still very easy to complete a long pass in single coverage since the defensive dot the vast majority of the time just keeps on moving when the offensive dot stops to catch the ball. The QB is throwing short on purpose I guess to get this type of reaction. The other thing I see happening on long passes is the defensive dot is sitting in perfect position in the short position and still no play to be made.

I understand completions will happen but a long pass should only be completed 40% if the DB is covering well.

I would also like to thank all the testers and GLB users who have been submitted stuff for possible changes.

qb sees 1 on 1 deep he goes for it all day every day. Not sure what the complaint is about. It's not an automatic catch, nothing so far is automatic and the DBs make a play as much as the WRs do. There are only a handful of shutdown cbs in the NFL and most can't stop a WR 1 on 1. The wr always has the advantage.

also voe, the issue isn't so much the passing in 1 on 1s, it's the fact the D line is getting no pressure which allows the qb to look through all his progressions every pass play if need be and find the 1 on 1. If the D line could generate a pass rush at times then this would allow it to work more "realistically"

Evil, the problem is all the games were private

I agree JT. The main problem is the Dline is so under powered it is ridic.

I know these type of things happen in football and a completion is made. I just don't like seeing over and over again. I just want to see realistic things happen. When a CB is in perfect position a play on the ball is normally made. This is the some of the things I am talking about.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10869288 CB stops to allow WR to run his route?
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10869710 perfect position no play
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10869732 perfect position no play
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870080 CB in perfect position and then runs past the ball
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870097 This play makes sense. Throws it to the sideline shoulder for a catch
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870215 great play by CB as should be since ball is underthrown and he is right there
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870506 impressive catch
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870536 perfect position by CB for this throw
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870589 INT made through perfect position by FS
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870811 INT made due to poorly underthrown ball
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870911 perfect CB positioning and long catch made
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2059270&pbp_id=10870926 next play and another long pass completion, CB pulls himself at of position

Originally posted by Mike Rogers
Jun 10, 2012
- Fixed/adjusted QB lead target math to fix a couple issues with passes thrown to bad or unintended spots
- Reduced long pass quality penalty back a little bit to approximately an uppper-middle-ground point

Just quoting because the scrims I set up today are intended to test this and hurry pressure. Scrim #1 today:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=2060228

QB 14/45 - I'm not disclosing QB build since it's not my guy but pass quality%, confidence, throwing.... are all up to par.

Hurried passes -
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021546
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021893
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11022072
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11022211

Hurried (bad) passes -
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021388
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021482
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021488
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021553
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021611
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021807
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021923
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11022059
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11022229


Bad pass for the hell of it -
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021605
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11021850 ?
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2060228&pbp_id=11022329 - not noted as a hurry but appears to be

Box score shows 16 hurries so I may have missed a few.

So roughly 2/3 of hurries result in bad passes medium/long range. Is this what we're shooting for? At this point I'm not even looking for changes, I'm just looking for an answer of what to expect.

Here's a game against the same team 1 day prior to the changes above:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=2059896

I'm not gonna list all of the hurries but the ratio is roughly the same, 2/3 of hurries result in bad passes. I thin this,combined with the long pass penalty (which appears to hit medium passes too), and the increased pressure to pass rush (as well as the time based bonus to strength/agility differential) is destroying anything but quick hits and rushing for 3/4+ of the game.

Like I said, just reporting what I see, what I think is happening, and the result. If this is intended, great. If not, plz fix. I'm fine running whatever works well and abandoning the other crap for emergency situations.

His build is open.. But its not just the QB build that goes into this... there are so many terrible OCs in this game its mind blowing. The kind of routes you run is huge. Not every team can run the same route. Certain teams can run some plays better than others.. LIke HHWC runs so many plays that i would never run because of the WRs we have compared to the WRs they have. We are both very pass heavy teams but 2 completely different styles of passing because of the WRs we have. If i ran the plays they ran we would have worse #s for sure.


If you are getting that many hurries, then try shorter routes, quicker progressions.. Im not going to look through your links but i have seen other peoples links with similar probelms. fuck with the QB tactics too. they are huge, i know this much.

I appreciate your input but I'm intentionally not changing any plays (for the most part) to do a side by side comparison with teh same teams we played yesterday. I'm welcoming hurries. What I'm logging is hurries to bad passes. If this ratio is what bort/catch want to see, I'm fine running different routes, short routes, rushing.... My focus isn't the amount of hurries but their effect on pass quality.

And let me clarify a little as well. I'm not saying what you're saying is wrong. It's actually amazingly competent and accurate for VDA (that's a joke )

What I'm saying is I have a random selection of plays loaded up, no scouting, minimal tagging, as a basis to test the changes over the past few days. This may only be my feeling, but it seems we're taking a step back from the original changes on the test server. What I'm hoping to see is something similar to the passing game we tested and not the bastard child of code manipulation we have today, based on limited (but loud and whiny) feedback after 1 game.

It could be I'm chasing this up the wrong tree and O-Line/D-Line interaction needs to be addressed instead of bad passes, lead target vectors, and pass quality modifiers. Maybe this is exactly what GLB wants. I couldn't care less 1 way or the other as long as this is what GLB needs to grow, hire, expand, and make the game even more enjoyable. I just want to know what I'm dealing with, point out what might be a potential problem, and carry on with the changes however GLB sees fit.

So... I'm showing the ratio of bad passes to competent passes based on a hurry situation.

Originally posted by HOODjelly
And let me clarify a little as well. I'm not saying what you're saying is wrong. It's actually amazingly competent and accurate for VDA (that's a joke )

What I'm saying is I have a random selection of plays loaded up, no scouting, minimal tagging, as a basis to test the changes over the past few days. This may only be my feeling, but it seems we're taking a step back from the original changes on the test server. What I'm hoping to see is something similar to the passing game we tested and not the bastard child of code manipulation we have today, based on limited (but loud and whiny) feedback after 1 game.

It could be I'm chasing this up the wrong tree and O-Line/D-Line interaction needs to be addressed instead of bad passes, lead target vectors, and pass quality modifiers. Maybe this is exactly what GLB wants. I couldn't care less 1 way or the other as long as this is what GLB needs to grow, hire, expand, and make the game even more enjoyable. I just want to know what I'm dealing with, point out what might be a potential problem, and carry on with the changes however GLB sees fit.

So... I'm showing the ratio of bad passes to competent passes based on a hurry situation.

But by doing random plays you arent really giving the offense the best chance of getting postive results. Atleast if you run plays you know your team is good at running. then we can see a problem or not. But a random selection of plays is part of the problem because we dont know if your team is good at running those plays or not. I kept my same passing packages from last season so I would see a difference from this sim and the last sim. You have to compare apples to apples. and I know what i did last season worked very well. thats all im saying. if all of a sudden what worked last season didnt work at all this sim, then i could point to why. but you just have some random plays and shit game to game, that part of the tests shouldnt be a question mark, it should be a constant.

Let me rephrase that. These are plays set on 05/26 for playoffs and they haven't been changed since. There's a plethora of games to compare against where this shit worked. What I meant by random is these are left in (with the occasional progression or play adjustment) but entirely random compared to what I would normally run based on scouting. If someone's blitzing trips or quad, I'm sacked. I haven't even looked to see what the normal action is for these teams.

I realize there's a huge roster swap since 5/26 but there's also enough games to show that that plays continued to work, despite roster, and only recently had immense bad pass calls.

I agree with your above statement though, which is why I targeted 7 teams we've played in the past 2 days for today's scrims and left the OAI 90% untouched.

Originally posted by JT_HOOD
also voe, the issue isn't so much the passing in 1 on 1s, it's the fact the D line is getting no pressure which allows the qb to look through all his progressions every pass play if need be and find the 1 on 1. If the D line could generate a pass rush at times then this would allow it to work more "realistically"

ALso only a handful of great DE's who can get pressure without a blitz. Saying that all dlines should create pressure is gonna lead to an F'd up sim. Already 3 buffs this offseason