Warrior General Games

LOL at you being a major player in it.

Private messaging a team you're on, and offering them a high level CB for an inactive HB (which is what the trade was, you need to be honest about the fact that Ray Day is inactive, and has been for awhile) is CHEATING.

Colluding by definition, hell it's collusion even by your errant definition. You depleted Spinner's team with out his consent (you had the power to do it but not the consent), and a team you're on benefited.

There isn't an way around it. It IS collusion.

At the very minimum Billy should be punished and the player removed from the Bandits.

It doesn't matter if the player is a backup or starter, it doesn't matter if it was only one player...

...you did it, it was wrong, end of story.

Originally posted by Ballbright
Originally posted by drifter


His first post was rational. When he was banned from the forum for it, he instantly resorted to getting into a pissing contest and making threats. If he had said, "Wait a minute, I didn't mean anything by posting it in the public forum" it would have blown over. He chose not to use that tactic.


So what you're saying is JOE is irrational for responding angrily when he was irrationally banned for doing the right thing?

Don't you think that statement is a little, oh I don't know, ...irrational?



Responding irrationally to someone else being irrational rarely gets results. Making threats from a position of inferior leverage is also not a great tactic.

Originally posted by drifter
Posted in Joe's other thread in the general forum as well:

A lot of misinformation here.

Joe's post in the team forum was viewed as not being very team like by the owner. He thought that if Joe had an issue with Billy Vassi, he should have brought it up private with Billy and/or the owner.

I can see how it might be viewed as un-teamlike and I think the actions taken against Joe (banning him from the forum) might have been a little too strong without any discussion first.

Regardless, Joe responded by threatening to sabotage the team. NOT the best way to open a rational discussion. At that point, the owner felt that Joe had shown his true colors as not being a team guy and benched him. That action, I feel, was entirely deserved. If a player is threatening sabotage he is done as far as I'm concerned.


That's the story, plain and true. There's no hidden conspiracies or anything else going on.

WOW WOW WOW!! I did not threaten to sabotage the team. After I was banned I wrote Catspaw. He said I was benched. After I was told I was benched I said I would not put any points into my player. AFTER!! I have the PM's stating this.

Talk about spreading mis-information.

I PMed this but I'll just post it here.

If I need to be thrown under the bus or suspended/banned, that's fine, but to state that it has anything to do with the Bandits is rather off base. Like I said, I PMed catspaw and offered him a player, and he traded an equal level guy for him. He didn't know anything about a 'gutting' and accepted what he thought was a perfectly legit trade.

So if you need to throw me under the bus and rail against me and have me banned, I can accept that. But to call it a "Bandit" issue is way way way off base.

Originally posted by billyvassi
Originally posted by Ballbright

Yeah, after the original billyvassi controversy I did some research and saw that they had acquired players from that team. While I had originally tried to defend Billy, I am now of the opinion that he does need to be suspended/banned for collusion, as well as any team owner he colluded with.


Explain how trading a level 12 HB for a level 12 CB is collusion? Collusion is depleting one team to build up another team.

Inactive player was traded. That is the issue!!!

Originally posted by joemalaka
Originally posted by billyvassi

Originally posted by Ballbright


Yeah, after the original billyvassi controversy I did some research and saw that they had acquired players from that team. While I had originally tried to defend Billy, I am now of the opinion that he does need to be suspended/banned for collusion, as well as any team owner he colluded with.


Explain how trading a level 12 HB for a level 12 CB is collusion? Collusion is depleting one team to build up another team.

Inactive player was traded. That is the issue!!!

Inactive player traded to an inactive team.

Originally posted by joemalaka

WOW WOW WOW!! I did not threaten to sabotage the team. After I was banned I wrote Catspaw. He said I was benched. After I was told I was benched I said I would not put any points into my player. AFTER!! I have the PM's stating this.

Talk about spreading mis-information.

I reached out to you in a PM and tried to clear this up. I was against you being forum-banned or benched, and I told cats that. I went out of my way to try to answer any questions you had and address any of your concerns. I really don't understand what you're doing right now.

Originally posted by Ballbright
Originally posted by drifter

Originally posted by Ballbright


..and by the way, congrats to Joe for doing the right thing, even in the face of enmity from his teammates, who will surely try to spin this another way.

Edit: they already are starting, see above...

Doing the right thing equals threatening to sabotage a team instead of have a rational discussion?

Okay

He aired the gripes in a private team forum first...that is the right thing to do. Then rather than discuss it with him you banned him? The bandits look more and more guilty with every sentence typed...

Thank you. Great points over and over. These guys are trying to cover their trail.

Trade inactives and say it is the right thing. Claim I threatened to sabotage the team when I did not. Lies over and over.

Originally posted by drifter

Responding irrationally to someone else being irrational rarely gets results. Making threats from a position of inferior leverage is also not a great tactic.

I get that, and as pointed out above, said it isn't my preferred tactic.

But trying to paint Joe in the light your team is trying to paint him here is just wrong. The guy tried to do the right thing, and you guys fucked him.

It's his right to respond any which way he wants, we still have free speech laws here in America (barely). The Bandits, and especially BillyVassi, were wrong in this on sooo many levels.

The fact that they had an otherwise untarnished season makes it worse. What was once a respectable team (with some retarded players yes DAMAN I'm talking about you...) has been tarnished.

I'm a firm believer in punishing to the full extent, and making an example so others don't follow...

..for the Bandit's sake you'd better hope Bort isn't...

Originally posted by billyvassi
Originally posted by joemalaka


WOW WOW WOW!! I did not threaten to sabotage the team. After I was banned I wrote Catspaw. He said I was benched. After I was told I was benched I said I would not put any points into my player. AFTER!! I have the PM's stating this.

Talk about spreading mis-information.

I reached out to you in a PM and tried to clear this up. I was against you being forum-banned or benched, and I told cats that. I went out of my way to try to answer any questions you had and address any of your concerns. I really don't understand what you're doing right now.

Of course you don't understand..doing the right thing seems to be a foreign concept to you...

Originally posted by billyvassi
Originally posted by Ballbright

[

You depleted the prior team to build the bandits....plain and simple..

So I traded an entire team, to about 30 different teams around the league, ALLLL as a way to trade 1 CB to the Bandits? (as part of a fair trade)

LOL.

What about the team that your players and the other GM ended up on (same team)?

What about the players not traded and left on a gutted team? Fair for them?

What about trading two players to The Bandits, one of them being a CB that the Bandits stated they needed for the playoffs?
Was that the first offer you got (your forum post stated you traded players to the first team you got an offer from)?
Was Catspaw given a heads up on what was happening before anyone else?

Originally posted by Ballbright
Originally posted by billyvassi

Originally posted by Ballbright




Billy exploited a situation he shouldn't have for his team's personal gain.

Period, end of story.



Which has nothing to do with the Bandits. I IMed catspaw and asked if he would like that CB, he said yes and offered a fair trade for him of equal levels. He didn't even know I was gutting a team.



It has everything to do with the Bandits you moron...you have just admitted to collusion. You IM'd a team you are on in an attempt to trade them a player (without putting him on the market, thus giving the Bandits an exclusive shot at him) in an effort to better them.

That IS COLLUSION...by definition...continue trying your weak little justifications all you want, you're wrong and you just make yourself look even more like you were trying to cheat from the get go...

DING DING DING!! Winner winner winner!

Originally posted by drifter
Originally posted by Ballbright

Originally posted by drifter


Originally posted by Ballbright



Originally posted by drifter




Originally posted by Ballbright





..and by the way, congrats to Joe for doing the right thing, even in the face of enmity from his teammates, who will surely try to spin this another way.

Edit: they already are starting, see above...

Doing the right thing equals threatening to sabotage a team instead of have a rational discussion?

Okay

He aired the gripes in a private team forum first...that is the right thing to do. Then rather than discuss it with him you banned him? The bandits look more and more guilty with every sentence typed...


I have already stated that I thought banning him after the post was in error, but it wasn't my decision. After it was done, Joe should have tried to discuss it rationally instead of making threats.


The reports are he tried to have a rational discussion, bringing it up internally, and he was banned for it. I don't blame him for making threats (not my preferred tactic), it's usually one of the only effective tactics left after that.


Either way the Bandits made a huge error in judgment here, and they're going to be embarrassed for it.



His first post was rational. When he was banned from the forum for it, he instantly resorted to getting into a pissing contest and making threats. If he had said, "Wait a minute, I didn't mean anything by posting it in the public forum" it would have blown over. He chose not to use that tactic.


Again a lie. I wrote catspaw asking why I was banned. No threats. I explained why I did it. His response was the attack back, thus I began my attack back. No attacks by me until Catspaw did.

I will post the PM's, if needed.

Originally posted by Ballbright
Originally posted by drifter


Responding irrationally to someone else being irrational rarely gets results. Making threats from a position of inferior leverage is also not a great tactic.

I get that, and as pointed out above, said it isn't my preferred tactic.

But trying to paint Joe in the light your team is trying to paint him here is just wrong. The guy tried to do the right thing, and you guys fucked him.

It's his right to respond any which way he wants, we still have free speech laws here in America (barely). The Bandits, and especially BillyVassi, were wrong in this on sooo many levels.

The fact that they had an otherwise untarnished season makes it worse. What was once a respectable team (with some retarded players yes DAMAN I'm talking about you...) has been tarnished.

I'm a firm believer in punishing to the full extent, and making an example so others don't follow...

..for the Bandit's sake you'd better hope Bort isn't...


First off, Free Speech as granted by the 1st Amendment has nothing to do with posting on a forum. I hate when people try and make that point.

How is what Joe did by posting in the forum, "The Right Thing". I don't necessarily think it was "The Wrong Thing", but it certainly wasn't some great and noble intention, either.

He can and did respond any way he wanted, but just because you can does not mean you should - especially if actually want to achieve your desired result.

Nothing is tarnished by this. The trade for 1 player was hardly of great impact to anything and if true collusion was going on, there would have been many players traded. You have a chip on your shoulder against the bandits and it is either clouding your judgment, or you are willfully taking advantage of the situation to push your own agenda.