Warrior General Games

Originally posted by reddogrw
the higher levels in the same age group go into elite - your alignment doesn't make sense at all

lol... you're right. I accidentally reversed the ages. I updated the post.

This thread is terrible.

I posted this in another forum.... It provides a place for non-boosters in the game again without ruining the experience for those who are doing it the right way and want to be competitive as well as a thought for improving competition/recruiting/etc in the upper leagues.

Things that Bort needs to do, imo...

- When a Reg Pro/Nat Pro/WL team goes CPU the teams should be frozen... no one should be able to purchase... at seasons end it should be forced down to the bottom of the game. If no one purchases team then it should be removed from the game... all bottom level teams that go a season unpurchased should be removed from the game until interest/need builds back up for it.

- Bort should allow nonboosters back into the game as they were before but he should restrict them, at the very least, from the elite leagues. Those that are doing the process appropriately and trying to be competitive in the elite minors should not have to deal with minor teams stacked with old non-boosters. I would even argue disallowing teams with non-boosters to play in the GLB sponsored tournament... a very small price to pay to be able to complete the roster and be competitive in regular season play. Basically, it preserves the integrity of elite minors and the tournaments but allows a place for non-boosters and helps teams struggling to learn the system be more competitive.

Originally posted by beenlurken

- Bort should allow nonboosters back into the game as they were before but he should restrict them, at the very least, from the elite leagues.


That's essentially would having a level requirement would do.

- Full boosters (or close to full boosters) end up mostly in the elite leagues.
- Partial boosters end up mostly in the competitive leagues.
- Non-boosters (or those that boost only a couple times) end up mostly in the normal leagues.

Originally posted by juane414
Originally posted by beenlurken


- Bort should allow nonboosters back into the game as they were before but he should restrict them, at the very least, from the elite leagues.


That's essentially would having a level requirement would do.

- Full boosters (or close to full boosters) end up in the mostly elite leagues.
- Partial boosters end up mostly in the competitive leagues.
- Non-boosters (or those that boost only a couple times) end up mostly in the normal leagues.



No you are making it such that the base level is a non-booster league only (excluding boosters from it). That is a terrible idea... not only does it encourage non-boosting but it does nothing to help out with recruiting.

My suggestion involves allowing older non-boosting dots to play with the low levels again with the condition that they do not taint the Elite leagues and the Tournaments.

I like this suggestion. +1

I've been a non-booster "freeloader" since I created my first player in season 1.

I just don't have a lot of extra play money on had at the moment to be spending on a beta game.

I have enjoyed playing the game and my way of contributing to the success GLB has been to suggest it to my friends and co-workers and promote it on my facebook page.

I have also written bugs for free on this title, (normally I get paid to do this function or train staff on how to write bugs and maintain a data base).

My point is that I agree that all level of players are of value, (even players that don't buy flex points)
so adjusting the competition at all levels is a sound business strategy.

It's not much fun to be in a league on a team with all non-boosted players, and the majority of the opposition having triple boosted players they created on day 40 of the previous season.

Well except for the victories against the mixed middle of road teams that are not 100% boosted that we defeat.

As it stands I feel that a lot of first time players that where clueless to boosting and the drastic advantage that buying flex points creates will get discouraged and quit or not return for another season.

Originally posted by beenlurken
No you are making it such that the base level is a non-booster league only (excluding boosters from it). That is a terrible idea... not only does it encourage non-boosting but it does nothing to help out with recruiting.

My suggestion involves allowing older non-boosting dots to play with the low levels again with the condition that they do not taint the Elite leagues and the Tournaments.

I don't think you're understanding my suggestion correctly. Some boosting would be allowed in the "normal" leagues. Also, if a little overlap is allowed, players would have the option to stay in the "normal" league as a higher level player, or move up to a competitive league as a lower level player. However, if a player boosts a lot they will get to the point where they have no choice to stay in the "normal" league but will be forced into a competitive league.

I really believe that this will be better for the game because it will create competition in all three tiers of the leagues (normal, competitive, elite). For example, a player could boost a few levels and choose to stay in a normal league as a top player, but at the end of the season that player will be bumped up to a competitive league where he will need to boost more to continue being competitive. The non-boosters and max-boosters will be unaffected by this, but the partial boosters will benefit greatly and will be encouraged to continue boosting even if they can't max-boost.

Your suggestion would most likely hurt competition. If older players were allowed to drop back to younger leagues then there would be no reason for them (or any player) to boost. If you had the choice of moving up to a higher league and have to boost to stay competitive, or moving down to a lower league where you will automatically be competitive without boosting, it seems obvious that you would choose to be demoted. Keep older players with the other older players. If they don't boost, then they will most likely be a backup. If they want to be a starter then they will need to boost to compete with other players in their age group.

Originally posted by beenlurken
No you are making it such that the base level is a non-booster league only (excluding boosters from it). That is a terrible idea... not only does it encourage non-boosting but it does nothing to help out with recruiting.

Juane, what part of that did you not understand?

The more we restrict which dots may play in a league the harder it is for teams to recruit. This has been proven over and over again. It is hard enough now for the average team (or worse) to recruit with the restrictions now... placing even more restrictions within each level on the elite/comp/normal will only make matters worse. Not to mention that by restricting the Normal level only to non-boosters you are effectively creating a non-booster only league. Your selfish motives blind you from seeing this. Again, non-boosters only leagues are terrible for the game... Bort/DD wont allow it. The game will lose out on earnings with such a league where we can get the max experience without having to pay. Its is the reason it has been NGTH since it was first suggested over 3 years ago, well before you got here.



Also, lets get one thing straight... all of levels and all of the leagues will NEVER be competitive. It is just NOT possible. GLB should strive to make the WL, Nat Pro and all of the Elite Minor league levels super competitive... they should strive to get the Competitive Minors somewhat competitive and the Normal leagues will always be a shitstorm of crap.

That said, I would argue they are close to achieving that now. WL is super competitive. Nat Pro sucks... this will never be fixed until they realize that a hemisphere-type league is absolutely necessary (or they bring in a giant flux of new players). From what I have seen the Elite Minor leagues have been very competitive as well.

The problem that GLB should be looking to address is that they removed a huge support system to Minor leagues when they killed non-boosters. There are way too many teams for the current player base. If they continue to ignore this and are adamant about keeping non-boosters out of the game then they need to start removing hoards of CPU teams. With recruiting so bad it is impossible to buy a new team that is midway through the process and make it competitive. Owners that do this get frustrated after a season or two and that team ends up right back on the CPU market.

If they are determined to keep all of these teams here then they must allow non-booster back into the game as they once were. Does it allow for the potential for all non-booster teams to dominate... sure. But, this is the reason why I suggest they restrict them from the Elite level and GLB sponsored tournament play. The #1 reason why most teams are not competitive at the Competitive and especially the Normal levels is because they simply cannot fill a roster. Allow the shitty built day 300 lvl 35 dots to play in those lower leagues again and those teams struggling just to fill a roster will be able to do so and not have to use CPU dots as 1/3 of the team. Its really the only way.

With all that in mind, again... they need to remove CPU teams, especially those at the Nat Pro and Reg Pro levels. Those CPU should never be open for purchase unless an existing gm wants to take over the team. And also, they need to allow non-boosters back into the minor leagues so that the excess of teams can fill out their rosters and be somewhat competitive.

Originally posted by beenlurken
Juane, what part of that did you not understand?.

I actually understood you completely. But again, it seems that you do not fully understand my suggestion. My suggestion does not exclude boosters from the normal leagues as you claim, nor does it create a non-boosting only league. My suggestion merely excludes max boosters from lower leagues and non-boosters from higher leagues so that each league is made up of players with similar levels.

Please don't accuse me of being selfish. I could care less about myself in all of this. I've considered leaving this game a number of times. The only reason why I haven't so far is because I've purchased a bunch of flex that I don't want to go to waste. I really don't have a lot of time or money to sink into this game right now because I'm a full-time graduate student.

My goal is simply to make sure that the people who can only afford $20 or no dollars in flex still get to enjoy the game. Restricting non-boosters or partial boosters to backup spots (if even that) just because they don't have $1,000 to spend is simply un-American. I don't think Bort planned for the game to turn out this way, but it's gravitating toward that because of the way the leagues are currently structured.

Originally posted by juane414
I actually understood you completely. But again, it seems that you do not fully understand my suggestion. My suggestion does not exclude boosters from the normal leagues as you claim, nor does it create a non-boosting only league. My suggestion merely excludes max boosters from lower leagues and non-boosters from higher leagues so that each league is made up of players with similar levels.

That is a fucking lie and you know it...

I understand this perfectly clear.... maybe you dont understand what you are saying?

Originally posted by juane414
I really believe that this will be better for the game because it will create competition in all three tiers of the leagues (normal, competitive, elite). For example, a player could boost a few levels and choose to stay in a normal league as a top player, but at the end of the season that player will be bumped up to a competitive league where he will need to boost more to continue being competitive. The non-boosters and max-boosters will be unaffected by this, but the partial boosters will benefit greatly and will be encouraged to continue boosting even if they can't max-boost.

What you describe here is an elite league that is composed of boosters... a competitive league composed of boosters and partial boosters... and a normal league composed of STRICTLY non-boosters. Just because a player/team can choose to boost his/their player in the normal/non-booster league to exploit the system to win a championship and be done with the normal/non-booster level FOREVER does not make the normal league anything more than just a non-boost only league.

Again, you continue to ignore how that would make the game even more restrictive by limiting the normal level teams to only recruiting players that have not boosted. It does nothing to help the teams that need the most help.


Originally posted by juane414
Please don't accuse me of being selfish. I could care less about myself in all of this. I've considered leaving this game a number of times. The only reason why I haven't so far is because I've purchased a bunch of flex that I don't want to go to waste. I really don't have a lot of time or money to sink into this game right now because I'm a full-time graduate student.

So you say you arent being selfish but then give examples of how this new system would satisfy your selfish needs (ie: not wanting to spend anymore money on this game but still get the max out of it).


Originally posted by juane414
My goal is simply to make sure that the people who can only afford $20 or no dollars in flex still get to enjoy the game. Restricting non-boosters or partial boosters to backup spots (if even that) just because they don't have $1,000 to spend is simply un-American. I don't think Bort planned for the game to turn out this way, but it's gravitating toward that because of the way the leagues are currently structured.

I am sorry you miserably fail to see how selfish that is. Your goal is to make sure people that cant afford the game (yourself include since you are a poor grad student) can still have all the benefits of those who can. It is very difficult for non or partial boosters to even get a backup spot with the league structure as it is now... the only way they are staying alive is the ULU leagues. Instead of selfishly creating a non-booster league (dont fucking lie and say that that is not what you are suggesting because anyone with half a brain can see that you are) is much better to allow them back into the game via an approach like I have suggested here. Non or partial booster should be happy with a backup role... with the way this game works there really is not much difference from being a starter or a backup (except for maybe a few positions like wr).

Lastly LOL at you for thinking you need to spend 1000 on this game to enjoy it at its max capacity. I have been playing this game for 3 years and have spent around $250-300 over that period of time (may still seem like a lot but its not your grossly exaggerated 1000). I have boosted all of my dots and am on my third wave of end-game dots now. I could have easily spent a lot less and built fewer dots and still enjoyed this game and still had boosting dots capable of starting for teams at the highest levels. Playing for good teams and starting has everything to do with how well you build dots... not how much you spend. There are plenty of max boosters (paying customers) that build gawd awful shitty dots that can only get backup roles.

The way I understand Juane to be explaining it, and I agree completely with, is as follows:

This "normal" league, would consist of non-boosters being the lowest level players, with those that boosted to lvl 4 to start their players career, and players that boost a max of once per season being the top end of that league.
The "competitive" league, would have the players that boosted to lvl 4, and once a season boosters being the lower end of the league, and high end players would consist of players that boost up to twice a season.
And lastly, the "elite" leagues would have the twice a season boosters as their low end, and full boosters being at the top.

This way, it still is advantageous for people to buy flex and boost to be the most competitive players in their desired level of competition, without making it 'all or nothing' for deciding whether to boost players. Some agents wish to have a team full of their own players, but cant afford to max boost everyone each season in order to make the team as competitive as others, thus, discouraging boosting because it will be a waste of money if they can never win anything. If they have the opportunity to be competitive in a league for 1-2 time a season boosters, they will be a lot more willing to spend money on the game.

I think many more veterans of the game will be willing to stay, and more new agents will want to stick around longer, if you open up equal competitiveness for all types of players. It is frustrating to sign a player into a league where the suggested levels say your player is an 'appropriate fit' for, and should be competitive, only to have a team or two of max boosters join and eliminate any chance of winning for others. There is no pride in dominating people not even in the same class as you, they should be seeking to play with people at the same caliber their players are if they want something to brag about.

Beenlurken - I agree, there are too many CPU teams, which does hurt the fun of competition, and the problem of recruiting. I feel it would help if many CPU teams were eliminated to help fill up the human teams- less teams to choose from at your competition level = better chance of signing human players.

Just my thoughts though.

Originally posted by juicejohnson44
The way I understand Juane to be explaining it, and I agree completely with, is as follows:

This "normal" league, would consist of non-boosters being the lowest level players, with those that boosted to lvl 4 to start their players career, and players that boost a max of once per season being the top end of that league.
The "competitive" league, would have the players that boosted to lvl 4, and once a season boosters being the lower end of the league, and high end players would consist of players that boost up to twice a season.
And lastly, the "elite" leagues would have the twice a season boosters as their low end, and full boosters being at the top.



LOL you just spun what juane said in attempt to try an make it look better yet it is still every bit as flawed.

That said, where does a dot go that boosts once a season most seasons but sometimes boosts twice? What about a max boosting dot that is terribly built and no elite team wants him (are you saying he should be forced to retire... even when a competitive or normal level team could use him)? This type of vision is so shortsighted it is ridiculous. Why do you guys continue to refuse to listen that by making the level requirements even more strict that you are alienating dots and making recruiting a x1000 more difficult than it should be?

Again, it is IMPOSSIBLE to make all three elite, competitive, and normal leagues very competitive.

Originally posted by juicejohnson44


This "normal" league, would consist of non-boosters being the lowest level players, with those that boosted to lvl 4 to start their players career, and players that boost a max of once per season being the top end of that league.
The "competitive" league, would have the players that boosted to lvl 4, and once a season boosters being the lower end of the league, and high end players would consist of players that boost up to twice a season.
And lastly, the "elite" leagues would have the twice a season boosters as their low end, and full boosters being at the top.




Originally posted by beenlurken
:

That said, where does a dot go that boosts once a season most seasons but sometimes boosts twice?



...read FAIL ...

Originally posted by beenlurken
That is a fucking lie and you know it...
Interesting statement. How does the F-bomb help your point, or the overall discussion for that matter?

Originally posted by beenlurken
and a normal league composed of STRICTLY non-boosters.
This is precisely where you continue to misunderstand my suggestion.

Originally posted by beenlurken
Just because a player/team can choose to boost his/their player in the normal/non-booster league to exploit the system to win a championship and be done with the normal/non-booster level FOREVER does not make the normal league anything more than just a non-boost only league.
You yourself are talking about players boosting in the normal leagues, but yet you continue to insist that the normal leagues will be non-boost only leagues. Do you realize the sharp contradiction in what you're saying? If you have players boosting in the normal leagues how can you call them non-boosting leagues?

Originally posted by beenlurken
Again, you continue to ignore how that would make the game even more restrictive by limiting the normal level teams to only recruiting players that have not boosted. It does nothing to help the teams that need the most help.
The only reason why there are teams that need so much help is because there is such a huge gap between the teams that only have a few boosters and the teams that have rosters full of boosters. If you put the teams with 50 max boosted players into the elite leagues, then the teams in the normal leagues won't be so far behind and in such great need of help. Besides, what is so fun about buying talent to make your team better? What about improving strategy? On a side note... are you a Yankees fan?

Originally posted by beenlurken
I am sorry you miserably fail to see how selfish that is. Your goal is to make sure people that cant afford the game (yourself include since you are a poor grad student) can still have all the benefits of those who can. It is very difficult for non or partial boosters to even get a backup spot with the league structure as it is now... the only way they are staying alive is the ULU leagues. Instead of selfishly creating a non-booster league (dont fucking lie and say that that is not what you are suggesting because anyone with half a brain can see that you are) is much better to allow them back into the game via an approach like I have suggested here. Non or partial booster should be happy with a backup role... with the way this game works there really is not much difference from being a starter or a backup (except for maybe a few positions like wr).
And I am sorry that you feel the need to continue dropping the F-bomb. BTW... you do realize that Bort said that he has considered this idea, right? Are you suggesting that Bort only has half a brain? You are making this so much more dramatic than it needs to be!!! I'm not asking for an entire overhaul of the league structure, I'm asking for one minor change. At any rate, I'm not asking that non-boosters get all the benefits that booster get. I'm just asking for more fairness and competition. Boosters will still get all the stats, fame, trophies, etc...

Originally posted by J55Porter
Originally posted by juicejohnson44



This "normal" league, would consist of non-boosters being the lowest level players, with those that boosted to lvl 4 to start their players career, and players that boost a max of once per season being the top end of that league.
The "competitive" league, would have the players that boosted to lvl 4, and once a season boosters being the lower end of the league, and high end players would consist of players that boost up to twice a season.
And lastly, the "elite" leagues would have the twice a season boosters as their low end, and full boosters being at the top.




Originally posted by beenlurken

:

That said, where does a dot go that boosts once a season most seasons but sometimes boosts twice?



...read FAIL ...



So because a dot boosts once every season but one season he boosted twice they are excluding him from the normal league... that is point I am making



It really is no coincidence that all non-boosters are defending juane... it really is no coincidence that you guys understand the working of this game the least.