Warrior General Games

Originally posted by El Kabong
increased quantity doesn't automatically increase parity, especially not when the quantity is dependent on inactive agents coming back and having to play catch up on builds and AIs.

It depends on what you can build with the i79s. You assume that an i79 would have the same ALGs and training points as a fully developed dot. I think that going through something like the player builder for a ton of dots would be pretty nasty.

Instead, you would probably shift it so that archetypes started you out at level 79 with some attributes already preassigned for you. Then you would just get a ton of SPs and BTs to spend to round out the build. You could still buy SPs with BTs. The only thing that would need to change is the store... you shouldn't be able to just retire and rebuild an i79 to roll the perfect gear.

Without ALGs you would be better able to balance the playing field. You still get the choice of spending your SPs on SAs, spending points way over the 8:1 cap, choosing four or three AEQ (if you wanted a complete set of perfect AEQ, you would have much less SP to spend).

There's a lot of ways to make I79 dots fun, quick, and balancing to the game without sacrificing the strategy and player building aspects that made this game.

The game is still about team strategy and individual player builds as part of the strategy, but with a tad more parity and with over a year and a half cut off the development time to get a dot from rookie to Pro.

Originally posted by haole
the idea that insta-79s are going to cause some huge deluge of returning agents is a head-scratcher to me. Will a few people come back because of it? Probably. And some people will still continue to trickle out every season, and some people who return will take a look and say nah, already kicked that addiction.

I just haven't seen any arguments that make sense as to why this will be some huge GLB lifesaver

Because the big kick in the nuts about trying to come back to this game is the over a year it takes for your new idea for a dot to actually become a dot.

Originally posted by tpaterniti
I have thought for some time that introducing dots at different tiers would be good. Level 1, Level 40, Level 79. It would create some cool meta-games.

At some point Bort posted in my "Level 40 Pee Wee" suggestion (must have been something like four years ago) that he would love to see something like that introduced.

Then someone put him back in his Bortcave and he was never heard from in the suggestions forum again.

Originally posted by chief c
This is the definition of anecdotal but jbrowning checked in last off season looking for a rookie team to build for after being out since s40. He had something like 60K in flex laying around. We pm'd and insta-chatted each other for a day or two but he went dormant again and I haven't heard from him since. Anyway insta-dots would have got him going again. Again, its only anecdotal but I'm sure it would be true for a lot of inactives.

And when an agent is back in he eventually runs out of flex and buys more. Its really as simple as that.

Myself, I follow bhall and wiseivian's OC forum religiously. There's been many times when somethings discussed like Pummel and Aura on the OL being a powerful method to making a team competitive, that I would have bought and built a whole offensive line my self instantly on the spot just to check it out. There's also been many times I'm just one or two players short of having a perfect roster just to sign some crap dot that my OC then uses to claim as the reason we didn't win one.

So, If we want a game where more guys come back. A game where new blood can get engaged right away. A game where independent outfits like mine can stop making excuses and be competitive with the top teams. Then we need a game where nothing changes, absolutely nothing except insta-dots, built from a greasemonkey like VPB, is an option.



Yep, and again I agree with all of this. And again, I still don't see this causing a big influx of people.

To say that people might trickle back in, see we have instant dots now, and decide to stick around is one thing. And it's a likely outcome, particularly if the pricing structure is something that makes a little more sense. I like getting 70% flex back on retirement, but it does require quite an upfront investment from either a new agent or one returning from a hiatus who is out of flex. Lowering the cost while lowering the flex refund makes sense to me.

I'm just taking issue with some of the arguments that seem to be predicated on the faulty logic that the day after GLB implements instadots, we'll be back in some Season 5 utopia with all the old names you'd forgotten about flocking back in droves. Any increased activity we see is likely going to be a slow trickle in (which is still a big change from the steady slow trickle out) and a gradual rebuilding of the player pool.

Long story short, this is not going to solve all of GLBs ills, and it's certainly not going to do it overnight. GLB still needs to find ways to keep people engaged in the community and in the game. It still needs to show at least a small amount of lip service to its customers to demonstrate that it hasn't completely abandoned them. It still needs to stop treating the people who line its pockets with operating capital like an aggravating nuisance.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Because the big kick in the nuts about trying to come back to this game is the over a year it takes for your new idea for a dot to actually become a dot.

I'm not arguing against the benefits

the problem is if you dont take into consideration the ALG's you are going to have to reset the game and start everyone equal...

Originally posted by gbororats
the problem is if you dont take into consideration the ALG's you are going to have to reset the game and start everyone equal...

they didnt reset the game for archetypes, so there's zero chance that they would reset the game under any circumstances.

Yeah, I wouldn't hold my breath about an Insta-builder that takes into account the ALGs unless it's something they've been working on for the past several months or they're just going to flat-out steal the coding from the VPB

Originally posted by gbororats
the problem is if you dont take into consideration the ALG's you are going to have to reset the game and start everyone equal...

Which is why I think that rather than 'instant' dots, it'd be 'quicker' dots through doubling down on everything. That'd cut dot build time in half which would be kinda cool. No new math needed... just everything doubled.

i'm hoping that no one would expect instadots to be as good as slow built players. if not, then algs arent really a factor. altho the easy implementation would be to make a level 1 player, and give them x number of trainings, and 30 boosts. it wont be instadot, but you could quickly build a dot.

Originally posted by gbororats
the problem is if you dont take into consideration the ALG's you are going to have to reset the game and start everyone equal...

Remember what they did with accelerated growth? They will probably do something similar.

Or they might just wipe every dot in existence for a full refund, that way every dot will be built under the new system.

Or they might wipe all dots that are five season or younger.

Or they might just make it so that old dots have a place to play for a few seasons, but all new dots created will be I79s.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Remember what they did with accelerated growth? They will probably do something similar.

Or they might just wipe every dot in existence for a full refund, that way every dot will be built under the new system.

Or they might wipe all dots that are five season or younger.

Or they might just make it so that old dots have a place to play for a few seasons, but all new dots created will be I79s.

All of these options seem reasonable answers.

Originally posted by Dr. E
All of these options seem reasonable answers.

I waited over a year to get these shitty dots into WL. That ain't reasonable

Originally posted by ProfessionalKop
I waited over a year to get these shitty dots into WL. That ain't reasonable

If insta 79's were introduced, you would still have Dots for WL, except maybe they wouldn't be "shitty".

Originally posted by Time Trial
It depends on what you can build with the i79s. You assume that an i79 would have the same ALGs and training points as a fully developed dot. I think that going through something like the player builder for a ton of dots would be pretty nasty.

Instead, you would probably shift it so that archetypes started you out at level 79 with some attributes already preassigned for you. Then you would just get a ton of SPs and BTs to spend to round out the build. You could still buy SPs with BTs. The only thing that would need to change is the store... you shouldn't be able to just retire and rebuild an i79 to roll the perfect gear.
.

There's a lot of ways to make I79 dots fun, quick, and balancing to the game without sacrificing the strategy and player building aspects that made this game.



Good point about the changes, I like those suggestions.

The other suggestion I've read in here, about doubling the speed instead of insta, that would still mean over half of a year to build a dot, which I don't think will bring back many people and still is too long to satisfy the current users. If you are going that route, it would be better to increase the accelerated growth to where you build for 2 seasons and boost to 79 at the start of the 3rd season. That would be a span of 4 months including preseason days. I think Time Trial's on the right path with how to implement I79s.