I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
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Originally posted by RayRay99
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
Nice back tracking there. His regular season performance is lacking except for being the only returner to win all 6 first place individual trophies in the same season (probably the only to win them all for a career) and despite the fact that he has the most 1st place individual golds of any returner in WL history. Other than that, his regular season performance is lacking.
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
Nice back tracking there. His regular season performance is lacking except for being the only returner to win all 6 first place individual trophies in the same season (probably the only to win them all for a career) and despite the fact that he has the most 1st place individual golds of any returner in WL history. Other than that, his regular season performance is lacking.
And newflash: playoffs matter more. His performance is second-to-none in the WL playoffs. In the two conference championships he played where his team was eliminated he had 3 TDs and 0 fumbles. To say the lack of a trophy means those stats don't matter is laughable.
Bernie Kosar passed for 489 yds in a playoff game.
Daryle Lamonica threw for 6 TD passes in a playoff game.
Lamar Smith rushed for 209 yds in a playoff game.
Kenneth Davis rushed for 5 TDs in a playoff game.
Eric Moulds had 240 yds receiving in a playoff game.
David Givens caught a TD in 7 consecutive playoff games.
YMX had 3 return TDs in a playoff game.
What is the common theme here? Nobody cares, and nobody is mistaking them for HOFers.
Daryle Lamonica threw for 6 TD passes in a playoff game.
Lamar Smith rushed for 209 yds in a playoff game.
Kenneth Davis rushed for 5 TDs in a playoff game.
Eric Moulds had 240 yds receiving in a playoff game.
David Givens caught a TD in 7 consecutive playoff games.
YMX had 3 return TDs in a playoff game.
What is the common theme here? Nobody cares, and nobody is mistaking them for HOFers.
Originally posted by RayRay99
Bernie Kosar passed for 489 yds in a playoff game.
Daryle Lamonica threw for 6 TD passes in a playoff game.
Lamar Smith rushed for 209 yds in a playoff game.
Kenneth Davis rushed for 5 TDs in a playoff game.
Eric Moulds had 240 yds receiving in a playoff game.
David Givens caught a TD in 7 consecutive playoff games.
YMX had 3 return TDs in a playoff game.
What is the common theme here? Nobody cares, and nobody is mistaking them for HOFers.
Dude, the dots you're arguing for had one season in WL,
Bernie Kosar passed for 489 yds in a playoff game.
Daryle Lamonica threw for 6 TD passes in a playoff game.
Lamar Smith rushed for 209 yds in a playoff game.
Kenneth Davis rushed for 5 TDs in a playoff game.
Eric Moulds had 240 yds receiving in a playoff game.
David Givens caught a TD in 7 consecutive playoff games.
YMX had 3 return TDs in a playoff game.
What is the common theme here? Nobody cares, and nobody is mistaking them for HOFers.
Dude, the dots you're arguing for had one season in WL,
Time Trial
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Originally posted by RayRay99
What lolGLB does now in a weak, watered down EPL is not even the same ballpark as Toya playing in the seasons 21-29 in USAPL. It is a different generation.
YMX played 4 seasons in WL. He was never the best returner in his conference, thus no MVPs. Half of those seasons he had 1 return TD total in the regular season, and averaged 3 TDs total in 4 seasons. How does averaging 2 KR TDs and 1 PR TD per season make him the GOAT? Talking about arbitrary stats, your "playoff prowess" is based on 6 games in Season 26 and Season 29 where he did well. In Seasons 27 and 28 he played 4 playoffs games and had 1 TD total. Congrats on having 2 good playoff performances in WL. YMX didn't ever lead his team to a WL conference championship, never won WL MVP, and his stats at every other level are lacking the others.
By your definition, YMX is GLB's version of Ed Podolak, Vernon Perry, or Frank Reich: Guys who had memorable playoff performances, but in the grand scheme of things are an afterthought to the greats of the game.
Well, to be fair, everyone knows that Bort made STs far more difficult starting in S25 or S26 when they made holding blocks far more difficult. That's why the dots who continued to have success did so on the strength of solid returner builds. Before that, all you needed was enough speed to get to the outside and beat one man for the TD. After the change, you needed to beat three or five dots to score against solid teams.
What lolGLB does now in a weak, watered down EPL is not even the same ballpark as Toya playing in the seasons 21-29 in USAPL. It is a different generation.
YMX played 4 seasons in WL. He was never the best returner in his conference, thus no MVPs. Half of those seasons he had 1 return TD total in the regular season, and averaged 3 TDs total in 4 seasons. How does averaging 2 KR TDs and 1 PR TD per season make him the GOAT? Talking about arbitrary stats, your "playoff prowess" is based on 6 games in Season 26 and Season 29 where he did well. In Seasons 27 and 28 he played 4 playoffs games and had 1 TD total. Congrats on having 2 good playoff performances in WL. YMX didn't ever lead his team to a WL conference championship, never won WL MVP, and his stats at every other level are lacking the others.
By your definition, YMX is GLB's version of Ed Podolak, Vernon Perry, or Frank Reich: Guys who had memorable playoff performances, but in the grand scheme of things are an afterthought to the greats of the game.
Well, to be fair, everyone knows that Bort made STs far more difficult starting in S25 or S26 when they made holding blocks far more difficult. That's why the dots who continued to have success did so on the strength of solid returner builds. Before that, all you needed was enough speed to get to the outside and beat one man for the TD. After the change, you needed to beat three or five dots to score against solid teams.
Time Trial
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Originally posted by lemdog
All I see is 1 WL season between 2 return dots, I'm sorry but you're not even in consideration. You guys can argue all day long but we all know the only consistent competition left in this game is in WL
Well, to be fair, my last dot played three seasons in the WL, had two KR TDs, and never fumbled once.
There's a new generation of WL STs... the FF Gunners are so much better now than they used to be. I'd rather help my team by getting three fewer yard per carry, but never once dropping the ball.
You lose a fumble on STs and the other side is starting with near RZ field position.
All I see is 1 WL season between 2 return dots, I'm sorry but you're not even in consideration. You guys can argue all day long but we all know the only consistent competition left in this game is in WL
Well, to be fair, my last dot played three seasons in the WL, had two KR TDs, and never fumbled once.
There's a new generation of WL STs... the FF Gunners are so much better now than they used to be. I'd rather help my team by getting three fewer yard per carry, but never once dropping the ball.
You lose a fumble on STs and the other side is starting with near RZ field position.
Time Trial
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Originally posted by RayRay99
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
Originally posted by Time Trial
Well, to be fair, my last dot played three seasons in the WL, had two KR TDs, and never fumbled once.
There's a new generation of WL STs... the FF Gunners are so much better now than they used to be. I'd rather help my team by getting three fewer yard per carry, but never once dropping the ball.
You lose a fumble on STs and the other side is starting with near RZ field position.
You don't see near the same amount of fumbles on returns. I respect your point because we did the same thing back in the day where fumbles were a lot more common unless you had the right build.
Well, to be fair, my last dot played three seasons in the WL, had two KR TDs, and never fumbled once.
There's a new generation of WL STs... the FF Gunners are so much better now than they used to be. I'd rather help my team by getting three fewer yard per carry, but never once dropping the ball.
You lose a fumble on STs and the other side is starting with near RZ field position.
You don't see near the same amount of fumbles on returns. I respect your point because we did the same thing back in the day where fumbles were a lot more common unless you had the right build.
Originally posted by Time Trial
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
I'm not sure how well it works to call someone out if you yourself haven't been able to do it.
Everyone wants to win WL, few teams do
Everyone wants success in WL but few teams do and some (in this thread) can't even make it there
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
I'm not sure how well it works to call someone out if you yourself haven't been able to do it.
Everyone wants to win WL, few teams do
Everyone wants success in WL but few teams do and some (in this thread) can't even make it there
Time Trial
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Originally posted by lemdog
You don't see near the same amount of fumbles on returns. I respect your point because we did the same thing back in the day where fumbles were a lot more common unless you had the right build.
Well, I just look at the STs MVP for WL and five of them are FF dots. I don't remember any other time before maybe five seasons ago where there were anything but STs returners on the STs MVP list. A really top FF dot might have made the list, but it was rare to see anything other than returners. Now, 15/20 are still returners, but five games into the season it was closer to 10/20 on the list.
I also remember in the last ten seasons there being a WL playoff game that was decided because of a STs fumble. Probably a lot more than you've seen decided by a STs big return. That's why I built my last two returners as possession over yards... they aren't going to score very often, but they will get you good field position by making one or two dots miss and best of all, they don't EVER drop the ball.
You don't see near the same amount of fumbles on returns. I respect your point because we did the same thing back in the day where fumbles were a lot more common unless you had the right build.
Well, I just look at the STs MVP for WL and five of them are FF dots. I don't remember any other time before maybe five seasons ago where there were anything but STs returners on the STs MVP list. A really top FF dot might have made the list, but it was rare to see anything other than returners. Now, 15/20 are still returners, but five games into the season it was closer to 10/20 on the list.
I also remember in the last ten seasons there being a WL playoff game that was decided because of a STs fumble. Probably a lot more than you've seen decided by a STs big return. That's why I built my last two returners as possession over yards... they aren't going to score very often, but they will get you good field position by making one or two dots miss and best of all, they don't EVER drop the ball.
Originally posted by Time Trial
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
Learn to read, scrub. I didn't bring championships into the conversation, RayRay did. I just pointed out that if championships are a requirement of the GOAT discussion then Rerturning tha Ball has GOAT status. Do you get it now or do I need to write it in Canadian, eh?
LHF - Championships matter.
LHF - lolGLB is the #1 returner in the game.
Total number of lolGLB WL champion .gifs for lolGLB anybody? Bueller?
ITT: so much goalpost moving, if and when it suits LHF.
Learn to read, scrub. I didn't bring championships into the conversation, RayRay did. I just pointed out that if championships are a requirement of the GOAT discussion then Rerturning tha Ball has GOAT status. Do you get it now or do I need to write it in Canadian, eh?
Dub J
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Originally posted by RayRay99
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
I never said that championships are the requirement, but you keep spouting off hyperbole about YMX's playoff performances and all of it amounted to 0 gifs. You can't argue his regular season performance because it is lacking, so you argue that 2 good playoff seasons makes him the best ever. The argument is paper thin and full of holes.
Time Trial
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Originally posted by lemdog
I'm not sure how well it works to call someone out if you yourself haven't been able to do it.
Everyone wants to win WL, few teams do
Everyone wants success in WL but few teams do and some (in this thread) can't even make it there
Of course not. I was lucky enough to have my QB picked to play for the ultimate winner... I'm not a top 25 coordinator in this game, so when I was building 100% of my dots, I was never going to get to a championship with them. I did get a WL ST MVP trophy, but it takes a team to win the WL... claiming that a returner is great or isn't great because they won the WL isn't enough. You need to have clutch returns, good ball control, and the ability to make defenders miss enough times to get you decent field position.
Again, since Bort crushed STs returns at the highest level of the game in S25 or 27, the winner of WL games rarely comes down to a STs return, but more often it can be decided by a STs turnover.
I mean... does anyone remember the threads from the post-STs nerf about how after 300+ games had simmed there had been only one return for a TD? I think Ben Linus' average kick return pre-nerf in Elite and NatPro had been between 40 and 50 yards per attempt and the next season it dropped to 30.
And that was the bigger problem... it made STs pretty bland. 90% of the teams were within five yards of each other... the returner with the most return attempts got the gold trophy. The number of TDs was usually decided by one or two, whereas in the past there would have been a 10 TD difference between the top ranked STs and the rest of the pack.
I'm not sure how well it works to call someone out if you yourself haven't been able to do it.
Everyone wants to win WL, few teams do
Everyone wants success in WL but few teams do and some (in this thread) can't even make it there
Of course not. I was lucky enough to have my QB picked to play for the ultimate winner... I'm not a top 25 coordinator in this game, so when I was building 100% of my dots, I was never going to get to a championship with them. I did get a WL ST MVP trophy, but it takes a team to win the WL... claiming that a returner is great or isn't great because they won the WL isn't enough. You need to have clutch returns, good ball control, and the ability to make defenders miss enough times to get you decent field position.
Again, since Bort crushed STs returns at the highest level of the game in S25 or 27, the winner of WL games rarely comes down to a STs return, but more often it can be decided by a STs turnover.
I mean... does anyone remember the threads from the post-STs nerf about how after 300+ games had simmed there had been only one return for a TD? I think Ben Linus' average kick return pre-nerf in Elite and NatPro had been between 40 and 50 yards per attempt and the next season it dropped to 30.
And that was the bigger problem... it made STs pretty bland. 90% of the teams were within five yards of each other... the returner with the most return attempts got the gold trophy. The number of TDs was usually decided by one or two, whereas in the past there would have been a 10 TD difference between the top ranked STs and the rest of the pack.
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