Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Catch22
Any significant change that has been made has been announced. Way more so than in the past. What change have I not announced?

Was there a Q & A session before I came on? That's better communication.

Was there a Test Server Discussions Forum before I came on? That's better communication.

Was there a Game Changes Discussion Forum before I came on? That's better communication.

Was there a searchable Wiki on Q & A and Bort quotes before I came on? That's better communication.

There are still things I need to work on and improve but to say that communication hasn't gotten better is to be blunt... ridiculous.

not everyone has time to search and go look at the forums every single day.
Liked it the way before when there was a change or something new coming to the game it was annnounced.
thats the way it should be.
+1 to more announcements

Can we at least get the missing SAs such as hands in AE?

Originally posted by griffin8r
Would be the most elegant solution, tbh.

Zone Specialist, once it got nerfed into the ground (stops working as soon as the ball is thrown) was only functional in conjunction with Ball Hawk anyway. Now you're telling me I have to spend 55 SP on it to make it 2/3's as nonfunctional as it was? Or is Bort going to take the nerf back off of this now that it's an SA, so that it's at least equal to SDC?

Seriously, Catch. 3 seasons and thousands of flexies are tied up into my Tampa-2 experiment, and you guys have pounded away with the nerf hammer on the zone each offseason since we started it up.

If you pick man CB, you have a chance to roll SDC. If you pick zone, you have a chance to roll ZS, and if you pick hard hitter, you have a chance to roll JH. Seems like a highly elegant solution to a problem of Bort's own making.



Would like some sort of response here, Catch, even if it's merely transparent patronization.

Fwiw, 5+5+4+4+3+3+2+2+1+1 = 30 SP's to get a SA to 10.

My gut says something is keeping the coder from updating the list of AE. It seems like a lot has gone into avoiding this section of code.

Originally posted by WiSeIVIaN
Fwiw, 5+5+4+4+3+3+2+2+1+1 = 30 SP's to get a SA to 10.

Depends on where it's positioned.

We have little to no info on that.

Regardless, 30 SP to get something 2/3's as effective as it was when it was a VA, and that being half as effective as it was prior to the S14 offseason, is still too high a price to pay.

Originally posted by AngryDragon
My gut says something is keeping the coder from updating the list of AE. It seems like a lot has gone into avoiding this section of code.

All they need to do is add a check in the "roller" - if SDC comes up, it checks whether the player is a Zone or a Hard Hitter. If the answer is yes to either of those, +1 SDC is automatically changed to +1 ZS or +1 JH, as appropriate. Simple elegant solutions.

Originally posted by griffin8r
All they need to do is add a check in the "roller" - if SDC comes up, it checks whether the player is a Zone or a Hard Hitter. If the answer is yes to either of those, +1 SDC is automatically changed to +1 ZS or +1 JH, as appropriate. Simple elegant solutions.

My point is because there are still missing SAs that are not new to the game that are not available in AE. Unless hands and strong arm have been added and I am just not aware of it.

Originally posted by AngryDragon
My point is because there are still missing SAs that are not new to the game that are not available in AE. Unless hands and strong arm have been added and I am just not aware of it.

I agree that if an SA exists, it is inherently unfair when it is not available in AE, regardless of the reason.

However, I feel like ZS/JH vs. SDC is a much bigger issue, again, because they are the hallmark SA's of their respective archetypes. SDC is useless on a zone specialist, and ZS is useless on a man specialist. JH can be useful on any player, and that may be the motivating factor on keeping it out of the AE realm - but don't punish the ZS for that.

I like it that they are not available. SA AEQ makes SAs like VAs--not a permanent part of your build (in the case of VAs, it's because of resets). If you want an archetype-specific SA I think it's good that you have to spend SP on it.

It does put a lot of onus on the test team though to make sure these new SAs have more balance than the old SAs did.

Originally posted by griffin8r
Depends on where it's positioned.

We have little to no info on that.

Regardless, 30 SP to get something 2/3's as effective as it was when it was a VA, and that being half as effective as it was prior to the S14 offseason, is still too high a price to pay.

I believe it was announced that it is a 'special' SA position so it is not in one of your normal SA trees and I believe it was also announced it was a 1/2/3/4/5 progression.

Originally posted by griffin8r
Originally posted by WiSeIVIaN

Fwiw, 5+5+4+4+3+3+2+2+1+1 = 30 SP's to get a SA to 10.

Depends on where it's positioned.

We have little to no info on that.

Regardless, 30 SP to get something 2/3's as effective as it was when it was a VA, and that being half as effective as it was prior to the S14 offseason, is still too high a price to pay.

Originally posted by Enkidu98
Originally posted by griffin8r

Depends on where it's positioned.

We have little to no info on that.

Regardless, 30 SP to get something 2/3's as effective as it was when it was a VA, and that being half as effective as it was prior to the S14 offseason, is still too high a price to pay.

I believe it was announced that it is a 'special' SA position so it is not in one of your normal SA trees and I believe it was also announced it was a 1/2/3/4/5 progression.

The 'Button' SA is chosen by the player when they select a new archetype. If they choose one of the old VAs to be their SA, they will have access to it and the cost to increase it will be:

1-1, 2-1, 3-2, 4-2, 5-3, 6-3, 7-4, 8-4, 9-5, 10-5 = 30 just as stated.

Originally posted by griffin8r
I agree that if an SA exists, it is inherently unfair when it is not available in AE, regardless of the reason.

However, I feel like ZS/JH vs. SDC is a much bigger issue, again, because they are the hallmark SA's of their respective archetypes. SDC is useless on a zone specialist, and ZS is useless on a man specialist. JH can be useful on any player, and that may be the motivating factor on keeping it out of the AE realm - but don't punish the ZS for that.

That is a great point but think about this.

* SDC is the 5th SA in its tree
* The new SAs should be the only or first SA in their tree if I understand correct.
* SDC costs 1 SP for the first 3 SAs then 2 SP for the 4th SA then 10 SP to take to 4 points. So that is a total of 15 SP but you will need a level 56 upgraded AE item to take it to 9 and CE that costs 900 Flex to take to 10.
* The new SAs will cost 30 SP to take to 10.

So, it is not exactly even but it is not as big of a gap.

Fully upgrading 3 AE items is very hard. Many agents go with 2 fully upgraded items. So for the sake of argument. Lets pretend that the new SAs are available. If I choose to use one of my two fully upgraded items for a new SA. I do not get help from AE so I still have to take it to 5 costing me 9 SP since it is in the first slot. Still that means I will have to use one of my two fully upgraded AE itmes. I can't use it for anything else so there still is strategy I guess.

By the way, I do not care either way. That is why my points are so contradicting. I just want hands to be AE. lol

AD - you don't quite follow me here.

If the new SAs are not available on AE, the vast majority of folk on this site will pass on those archetypes, because they won't truly be effective until near end-game build, when it's actually time to start investing in SAs. All corners and safeties will be built as man coverage defenders, because that is where the advantages lie in AE, especially now that %AE is being nerfed as well.

This really feels like an effort to destroy any kind of defense other than man.