Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Tigerbait0307
Has anyone else noticed that the CBs will sometimes just keep backpedaling when the ball is thrown to there WR. Basically letting the WR catch the ball. I have seen it when the WR is covered by a FS and CB. Both defenders just keep backpedaling and don't even go for the ball.

CB1 when the ball is thrown he just keeps running almost out the back of the endzone. He has 70Vision and is playing on Close/Semi

That's your answer. If you play semi , CBs back off and allow the catch too often. That's why any decent CB plays aggressive...until this season. But, you do bring up another piece of the puzzle. Those of us who felt semi was wonky due to allowing too many easy catches didn't complain because we just "fixed our builds" so we could play aggressive. If aggressive is somehow part of this new problem, then this basic fault with semi needs to be addressed as well (probably should be addressed regardless...has existed ever since semi was first introduced).

Originally posted by ijg
Originally posted by Tigerbait0307

Has anyone else noticed that the CBs will sometimes just keep backpedaling when the ball is thrown to there WR. Basically letting the WR catch the ball. I have seen it when the WR is covered by a FS and CB. Both defenders just keep backpedaling and don't even go for the ball.

CB1 when the ball is thrown he just keeps running almost out the back of the endzone. He has 70Vision and is playing on Close/Semi

That's your answer. If you play semi , CBs back off and allow the catch too often. That's why any decent CB plays aggressive...until this season. But, you do bring up another piece of the puzzle. Those of us who felt semi was wonky due to allowing too many easy catches didn't complain because we just "fixed our builds" so we could play aggressive. If aggressive is somehow part of this new problem, then this basic fault with semi needs to be addressed as well (probably should be addressed regardless...has existed ever since semi was first introduced).


bolded for emphasis.

Ok guys, sorry to post it then leave you hanging, but I do work a full time job as well

I'm back at it now. I'm going to just churn out the tests as fast as I can and get the links posted, then I'll go back and dig through the results. If anyone is bored and wants to help watch film and pull out some examples of the CB jumping the routes, both successes AND whiffs, feel free Just post the links here and we can make this a team effort.

What are the LB's set to? They seem to not over jump the pass like the CB's to in game 1. There are too many examples of the CB jumping the pass too far; first offensive play it actually happens.

I stopped being lazy so here are a few links:

CB's over jumping the route:
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238865
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238870
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238893
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238918
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238965


LB in coverage not over jumping the route:
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238872
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238901

There are tons more examples but this should help

i will be lazy and wait for you guys to go through this and give some number totals. to much else to do, if im going to watch dots they would have to at least be my players or scouting for my teams next game.

That first game had some of the worst close coverage I've ever seen, not to mention the LOLB coverage of the TE, which I know is broken, but damn.

Ok, was pulled away once again for a short while. Next set coming up soon.

Originally posted by islander1
Originally posted by ijg

Originally posted by Tigerbait0307


Has anyone else noticed that the CBs will sometimes just keep backpedaling when the ball is thrown to there WR. Basically letting the WR catch the ball. I have seen it when the WR is covered by a FS and CB. Both defenders just keep backpedaling and don't even go for the ball.

CB1 when the ball is thrown he just keeps running almost out the back of the endzone. He has 70Vision and is playing on Close/Semi

That's your answer. If you play semi , CBs back off and allow the catch too often. That's why any decent CB plays aggressive...until this season. But, you do bring up another piece of the puzzle. Those of us who felt semi was wonky due to allowing too many easy catches didn't complain because we just "fixed our builds" so we could play aggressive. If aggressive is somehow part of this new problem, then this basic fault with semi needs to be addressed as well (probably should be addressed regardless...has existed ever since semi was first introduced).


bolded for emphasis.




That's funny, my CB plays in the same league as Tigerbait's team (LSP) and I have no problems at all with close/semi-aggressive. My CB constantly makes wonderful plays and doesn't have this issue at all.

Few quick answers to questions that came up in this topic.

#1 If it's determined that we need to run a second set of similar tests where every CB has Ball Hawk, then we will.

#2 All LBs are set on Medium/Medium for coverage.

#3 Both sides are just using Basic tactics. 100% pass 100% pass focus, 90% man 10% zone. 33/34/33 Short/Med/Long for both passing and pass defense.

r8, Also another thing to take into consideration are the First Step and Change of Direction SA's. They can definately have an effect on how quickly a CB moves when he reacts to a pass.

Originally posted by Modok
r8, Also another thing to take into consideration are the First Step and Change of Direction SA's. They can definately have an effect on how quickly a CB moves when he reacts to a pass.

Yeah, I had thought about that. Let's see if running it the way I am reproduce the results. If it does, then we're fine, but if not, that will be one of the things I'll modify to try to get to the results we want.

Originally posted by hexone
What are the LB's set to? They seem to not over jump the pass like the CB's to in game 1. There are too many examples of the CB jumping the pass too far; first offensive play it actually happens.

I stopped being lazy so here are a few links:

CB's over jumping the route:
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238865
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238870
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238893
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238918
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238965


LB in coverage not over jumping the route:
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238872
http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=1057&pbp_id=238901

There are tons more examples but this should help

Yeah i agree, the LBs i've DC'd dont do it. CB coverage has been fucked ever since that change to tactics a few seasons back, the worst part about it is it was suposed to help CBs. If i remember right that whole change got rolling with almost the exact same complaints we are hearing now.

Originally posted by MorsDraconis
Originally posted by islander1

Originally posted by ijg


Originally posted by Tigerbait0307



Has anyone else noticed that the CBs will sometimes just keep backpedaling when the ball is thrown to there WR. Basically letting the WR catch the ball. I have seen it when the WR is covered by a FS and CB. Both defenders just keep backpedaling and don't even go for the ball.

CB1 when the ball is thrown he just keeps running almost out the back of the endzone. He has 70Vision and is playing on Close/Semi

That's your answer. If you play semi , CBs back off and allow the catch too often. That's why any decent CB plays aggressive...until this season. But, you do bring up another piece of the puzzle. Those of us who felt semi was wonky due to allowing too many easy catches didn't complain because we just "fixed our builds" so we could play aggressive. If aggressive is somehow part of this new problem, then this basic fault with semi needs to be addressed as well (probably should be addressed regardless...has existed ever since semi was first introduced).


bolded for emphasis.




That's funny, my CB plays in the same league as Tigerbait's team (LSP) and I have no problems at all with close/semi-aggressive. My CB constantly makes wonderful plays and doesn't have this issue at all.

I didn't have problems with close/semi until this season. My CB's never had glamorous stats on close/semi, but they didn't allow gimmie catches either like they were doing this season. I moved my CB to aggressive recently since close/semi had was giving up too much of a cushion.

r8, we should also probably test passing styles at some point. I hadn't focused on it previously, but it looks like lofty may be part of the issue. Perhaps it's related to the new slider??? Look at this play.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=474081&pbp_id=8234998

Looks like lofty throw or at least medium. CB should be smart enough to know that on a lofty pass (that isn't underthrown) that there is no way he can jump high enough to knock it down 5 yds ahead of the WR. Even on bullet, it's kind of ridiculous, but no way on lofty. He should only jump lofty if the ball appears to be thrown short of the WR.

Here's another from that game.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=474081&pbp_id=8237099

Here's a mini version of it. These are a much more realistic target for a jump action that I think would be an acceptable risk for CBs. He only goes a yard or so in front so he gets burned if he's wrong, but still has a shot to make the tackle at least. Still, I don't think he should be jumping the route for a lofty pass that's on target as the chance of a PD is low.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=474081&pbp_id=8236297
http://goallineblitz.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=474081&pbp_id=8236322 note this one says it's a PD but it's caught anyway. None of the other PD/INT were from jumping route

The two CBs you see here had a ton of problems in this game and actually hadn't had as many as the other CBs on this team before this game. You may want to watch the rest of it to see if you can pick up anything as I only showed you a few examples. I'd say there were at least 10 total on 50 pass plays.

I'm pretty sure they were on close/aggressive. One has 5 ball hawk, the other 7. Confidence is solid. Plenty high agility and vision, 50+ jump. SAs are what you expect. They're prototype high level CBs with nothing unusual in the builds.

Originally posted by islander1
Originally posted by ijg

Originally posted by Tigerbait0307


Has anyone else noticed that the CBs will sometimes just keep backpedaling when the ball is thrown to there WR. Basically letting the WR catch the ball. I have seen it when the WR is covered by a FS and CB. Both defenders just keep backpedaling and don't even go for the ball.

CB1 when the ball is thrown he just keeps running almost out the back of the endzone. He has 70Vision and is playing on Close/Semi

That's your answer. If you play semi , CBs back off and allow the catch too often. That's why any decent CB plays aggressive...until this season. But, you do bring up another piece of the puzzle. Those of us who felt semi was wonky due to allowing too many easy catches didn't complain because we just "fixed our builds" so we could play aggressive. If aggressive is somehow part of this new problem, then this basic fault with semi needs to be addressed as well (probably should be addressed regardless...has existed ever since semi was first introduced).


bolded for emphasis.




If this is true than thats a problem. You either have to choose a coverage setting that makes you jump the route every time or one that will just let the WR catch the ball with no attempt to bat it down. I really hope that not true.