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Forum > FAQ's, Player Guides and Newbie Help > I need help understanding training better.
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It's not so much getting started, or multi training, or using BTs for enhancement, or training as close to 99% till I am ready to train over.

I will try to explain this the best I can. I know somewhere there is a red and green color chart that shows the worse times to train an attribute.

For example, once an attribute reaches 33, you don't want to train it again until you have reached the first cap by adding SPs (48.06)

Here is the attribute caps and the SP values needed as I understand it.

00.00 <---[ 1:1]---> 48.06
48.07 <---[ 2:1]---> 60.51
60.52 <---[ 3:1]---> 67.97
67.98 <---[ 4:1]---> 73.24
73.25 <---[ 5:1]---> 77.28
77.29 <---[ 6:1]---> 80.53
80.54 <---[ 7:1]---> 83.25
83.26 <---[ 8:1]---> 85.58
85.59 <---[ 9:1]---> 87.60
87.61 <---[10:1]---> 89.40
89.41 <---[11:1]---> 91.01
91.02 <---[12:1]---> 92.46
92.47 <---[13:1]---> 93.79
93.80 <---[14:1]---> 95.00
95.01 <---[15:1]---> 96.13
96.14 <---[16:1]---> 97.18
97.19 <---[17:1]---> 98.15
98.16 <---[18:1]---> 99.06
99.07 <---[19:1]---> 99.99
100.0 <---[20:1]---> etc.

Well if 33 is the point where you stop training before the first cap. What are the other numbers between the other caps to pay attention to? Are there any? Is it half way between? Does it even matter after 33?
 
palsager
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is this what you are looking for - https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots
 
dsl20
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https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots

Training hotspot graph by mandyross
 
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Originally posted by palsager
is this what you are looking for - https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots


Originally posted by dsl20
https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots

Training hotspot graph by mandyross


THANK YOU!

Yes, Do you know how to interpret this? I get that the closer you get to the cap, the lower the value of the training, but where are the tipping points that constitute the limit to train or not to train? Is it the halfway point between caps?
Edited by F00tballJunkie on Feb 26, 2023 09:54:26
 
GroupOh
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the numbers on the left represent sp value per train.... how much skill point are you getting for each training point spent. ideally you want the higher number on the left....
 
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Originally posted by GroupOh
the numbers on the left represent sp value per train.... how much skill point are you getting for each training point spent. ideally you want the higher number on the left....


If I am Multi-training 4 way at 30% then I just follow the 0.7 line and that is the tipping point?

 
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https://6029598a-a-62cb3a1a-s-sites.googlegroups.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots/multi4_sp2.gif?attachauth=ANoY7cpyKikV56qOYvMDhGVXuKmqIaBA9P0RZAcCmm3hrv6XRbgR57FvZ6jmZ2aVU4dfXt7ui7vA0hdUnVWpMe4TKOWHI1Y91-E-Cg8cNoaw9Vu15dt_f68LzVxWSTFB4hCA7nEYxl2eMgCpe62ecvluMDaxg-rc3VsnQRYX-eTZNXRWrr2j0nTdyCjytmmd8JqLO8gcyzx-WGe9CoyAM6zbKwAY5Fqj632OCWhEIW-1Rmwq1EJxaqo%3D&attredirects=0
 
GroupOh
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Originally posted by F00tballJunkie
If I am Multi-training 4 way at 30% then I just follow the 0.7 line and that is the tipping point?



if you use this you would look at the orange curve, around 32-33, the value dips below the value training at 48.

basically you want to train on the peaks as much as possible and train else where during the values...
 
Theo Wizzago
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So... crazy boy here done left those (guides) in the dirt quite a while back. My brain likes things simple. Here's what I've been doing without any issues or troubles. Simple stuff but it works (done one cap at a time).

Hard rule;
Never let your training push you TOO close to the next cap, especially early on. Otherwise a xp level up could push you past it. Later you almost have to let it get close. but that's ok because XP gains slow down the higher you dot level.

1st cap (48.06); Cost to raise = 1sp per point. Cap as soon as you can. Max ALG benefits.

2nd cap; Cost to raise = 2sp per point. Cap as soon as you can. Max ALG benefits.

3rd cap; Cost to raise = 3sp per point. At this point, the cost in SP's is worth paying attention to. As a general rule I try to get a skill closer to the cap when the higher the SP cost, per point raised, happens. 3 points per point is where this starts for me. 64 or 65 gets me closer so SP cost is lower. No closer than 66.

4th cap; 70 at least. No closer than 72.

5th cap; 76 preferred... 75 is ok.

6th cap; It's time to pay attention to the little things.. like the entire number. In this case target is 80.53 so I'm watching close now... 78.54 to 79.52 is my range.

7th cap; 82.26 to 83.24

8th cap; 84.59 to 85.57

9th cap; From here on I'm waiting until I am JUST before the next cap. I only want One SP boost to push it over because the cost per skill point is getting high.

10th and beyond; Same as above. Likely not for most builds as I won't spend those SP's here but I do occasionally if really pushing a primary skill and player is still below level 55. After 55 I wait until Plateau boosts for any thing else and, more likely I'll have trained my skill right up to rollover so I can get a free skill bump.

Edited by Theo Wizzago on Feb 26, 2023 10:17:18
Edited by Theo Wizzago on Feb 26, 2023 10:15:29
 
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Originally posted by Theo Wizzago
So... crazy boy here done left those in the dirt quite a while back. Here's what I've been doing without any issues or troubles. Simple stuff but it works (done one cap at a time).

Hard rule;
Never let your training push you TOO close to the next cap... otherwise a xp level up could push you past it.

1st cap (48.06); Cost to raise = 1sp per point. Cap as soon as you can. Max ALG benefits.

2nd cap; Cost to raise = 2sp per point. Cap as soon as you can. Max ALG benefits.

3rd cap; Cost to raise = 3sp per point. At this point, the cost in SP's is worth paying attention to. As a general rule I try to get a skill closer to the cap when the higher the SP cost, per point raised, happens. 3 points per point is where this starts for me. 64 or 65 gets me closer so SP cost is lower. No closer than 66.

4th cap; 70 at least. No closer than 72.

5th cap; 76 preferred... 75 is ok.

6th cap; It's time to pay attention to the little things.. like the entire number. In this case target is 80.53 so I'm watching close now... 78.54 to 79.52 is my range.

7th cap; 82.26 to 83.24

8th cap; 84.59 to 85.57

9th cap; From here on I'm waiting until I am JUST before the next cap. I only want One SP boost to push it over because the cost per skill point is getting high.

10th and beyond; Same as above. Likely not for most builds as I won't spend those SP's here but I do occasionally if really pushing a primary skill and player is still below level 55. After 55 I wait until Plateau boosts for any thing else and, more likely I'll have trained my skill right up to rollover so I can get a free skill bump.





This I understand. Thank you Theo, I think this is exactly what I was looking for.
 
zz man
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Also take this into consideration especially if you are building a very high 1st 2nd Primary type of dot. ALGs are one part of the equation but also you may have invested heavily in BTs enhancing a Prime and the best way to maximise that is to train at higher values. so sometimes you might apply SPs while still in a "good training zone"... So depending on your build plan you need to keep an eye on multi or single training your primary to hit the next point of level training
 
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Originally posted by zz man
Also take this into consideration especially if you are building a very high 1st 2nd Primary type of dot. ALGs are one part of the equation but also you may have invested heavily in BTs enhancing a Prime and the best way to maximise that is to train at higher values. so sometimes you might apply SPs while still in a "good training zone"... So depending on your build plan you need to keep an eye on multi or single training your primary to hit the next point of level training


I am kinda doing that hap hazzard now, but I think I have a much better understanding, thank you!
 
TJ Spikes
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fwiw.. I drew some lines

https://postimg.cc/3dh8CrWG

The general gist is the peaks represent caps. so the 1-cap is 48. So for 30%, you draw the black line from the orange at 48, towards the left. All training below that line is "less optimal" than hitting the next cap. Then you draw the purple line down. It's right around that 32/33 mark. That means you want to spend about 15 SPs to cap from 33 to 48.

The next cap is 60. So using the lines again every training after 52ish is less optimal than capping, so about 16 SPs. The 3rd cap is 68, and basically from then on out, all training is "less optimal" than just saving the SPs to cap.

After the first cap, it's all mental masturbation anyway. It's not like you're going to shut off your training because it's less optimal. As long as you're capping as fast as possible, and not sitting on more than 20 SPs, you're doing it right. You have to train, even when it's not optimal.

I think this is most relevant at the end of a build when you're working on those last couple attributes and getting your BTs saved up. If you're going to 2 cap something, like Stamina, for example, train it to 33, cap it, train it to 52 and 2-cap it.

If you're mixing in Light training, for extra BTs, look at that chart and pick out the best attribute/s to do that with.
Edited by TJ Spikes on Feb 27, 2023 11:40:21
Edited by TJ Spikes on Feb 26, 2023 20:26:41
Edited by TJ Spikes on Feb 26, 2023 20:24:07
 
Theo Wizzago
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Good call, TJ. I do that a lot (Switching to light training so I don't train through a cap) at the start. Not so much later as it's easier to plan out. The thing that kills is those 'Training Breakthroughs'... most of which come early in the build so that's where you really gotta mind how close you get to the cap because you're gaining HUGE chunks of gains early. Later, once the skill is up a few notches, the gains become smaller so easier to plan ahead.
 
Buckeyed
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Originally posted by TJ Spikes
fwiw.. I drew some lines

https://postimg.cc/3dh8CrWG

The general gist is the peaks represent caps. so the 1-cap is 48. So for 30%, you draw the black line from the orange at 48, towards the left. All training below that line is "less optimal" than hitting the next cap. Then you draw the purple line down. It's right around that 32/33 mark. That means you want to spend about 15 SPs to cap from 33 to 48.

The next cap is 60. So using the lines again every training after 52ish is less optimal than capping, so about 16 SPs. The 3rd cap is 68, and basically from then on out, all training is "less optimal" than just saving the SPs to cap.

After the first cap, it's all mental masturbation anyway. It's not like you're going to shut off your training because it's less optimal. As long as you're capping as fast as possible, and not sitting on more than 20 SPs, you're doing it right. You have to train, even when it's not optimal.

I think this is most relevant at the end of a build when you're working on those last couple attributes and getting your BTs saved up. If you're going to 2 cap something, like Stamina, for example, train it to 33, cap it, train it to 52 and 2-cap it.

If you're mixing in Light training, for extra BTs, look at that chart and pick out the best attribute/s to do that with.


This is money.
 


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