Warrior General Games

This is loosely based on being an improvement on the 174 speed RB I made previously.

END BUILD:
Strength: 22.26
Speed: 117.10 + 58 = 175.10
Agility: 80.10
Stamina: 61.26
Vision: 64.10
Confidence: 22.26
Catching: 22.26
Carrying: 66.10

SA's:
Quick Cut = 8+6+1 = 15
Head Fake = 2+1 = 3
First Step = 4+1=5
Juke = 8+6+1 = 15
Open Field Fake = 8

25.5% Fake Chance (2x AE + 1x CE)


Build plan is super easy:

-Basically 5x enhance training speed as quick as possible, and throw all SP's into speed until you 20-cap it at 100 base speed (will ALG to 112 and 4x train rollover to 117)

-Train speed on NORMAL his whole career (except the very end when you know you won't be able to roll-over speed one more time.

-4-cap agility with SP's (73 will ALG to 80)

Calculated that I'll need 68 SP's for SA's...
SA = 8-2-4-8-0 top tree & 8 Bonus SA
SP = 20+2+6+20+0 & 20
Which is final 20 SP bonus plus 48/6 = 8 levels of SP. So all SP from LVL72+ is spoken for

-2cap carrying (61)
-2cap vision (61)

-Last half season switch to normal training stamina

-2cap stamina (61)

-Train strength for 2 days

0000000hb_elusive_back09001030790256500711587000000000001601000001000000000000000000022.260117.10080.1000006061.260064.1022.26000006000008022.260066.100000800000800000808020408000000000000082810050000000000000000000000000ffffffffffffff200-1000000

Could be dirty in the screen game, other than that idk.

This was one of my best ever returners. EHB build but I would say 90% or more of what the build is would be the same for most EHB builds... give or take some numbers on some skills.

Retired Player (Lv. 79 HB)
Ht/Wt: 5'10", 181lbs


Attributes
Physical Attributes
Strength: 51.36
Speed: 158 (+52)
Agility: 97.1 (+3)
Jumping: 14
Stamina: 52.16
Vision: 73.1
Confidence: 40.26

Football Skills
Blocking: 6.1
Catching: 22.26
Tackling: 8
Throwing: 8
Carrying: 94.1
Kicking: 8
Punting: 8

Special Abilities
Elusive Back Abilities
Quick Cut: 11
Head Fake: 7
First Step: 3
Juke: 5
Spin: 11

Power Back Abilities
Cover Up: 2
Lower the Shoulder: 0
Stiff Arm: 0
Power Through: 0
Dive for Yardage: 0

Additional Abilities
Return Specialist: 10
Veteran Abilities
Quick: 10
Steady Grip: 15
Track Star: 15
Quick Feet: 15
Return Man: 15
Special Teamer: 15

Current Bonuses/Penalties
Speed: +4.77
Agility: +2.82
Carrying: +7.06
Spin chance: +30%
Head Fake chance: +30%
Hurdle chance: +30%
Juke chance: +30%
Break tackle chance: +15%
Not fumble chance: +12%
Fake chance: +15%

---------------------awards below---------------
https://glb.warriorgeneral.com/game/player_awards.pl?player_id=4728959

Realize that some VA"s and SA's would be different if built only as an EHB style HB and some of the secondary skills would be a little different. I likely would have a little less vision and use those SP's on SA's like Juke or some similar idea with another skill (more agility maybe?)... but he sure was hell on wheels as a returner.

Never tried an elusive build with this strength/carrying combination. He's relying on fakes but if doesn't fake his oppponent, a simple gust of wind can cause a fumble.

Originally posted by Kenshinzen
Never tried an elusive build with this strength/carrying combination. He's relying on fakes but if doesn't fake his oppponent, a simple gust of wind can cause a fumble.

Is this true? Is general accepted practice that non-BT dots need soft capped strength on offense?

WR's mostly have 20 strength (or less). I don't think 20/60 wr's cause a fumbling pandemic?

All of WL last season only had 35 fumbles lost. That's about 3 per team per season. Obv 90 carrying RB's will fumble less though.


The 1.0 version had 49/73 as I was trying to break tackles as well (which is something that wasn't worth the resource allocation for WL) and averaged 3 fumbles lost in WL seasons. So perhaps the concern is legitimate.

Do you recommend 1-capping vision and using the free SP to softcap strength, or something different?

interesting, i'd like to try something like that

Welcome back Wise! Worth a shot to try. Maybe a little more in agility, quick cut and juke only to 13?

Originally posted by WiSeIVIaN

WR's mostly have 20 strength (or less). I don't think 20/60 wr's cause a fumbling pandemic?


Yes because system count them as knocked loose (thank Borf). When a HB runs outside with a ball in his hands don't know if a LB or safety hit him what can happen. Still never tried a build like that and can't be sure, he needs just a fake and is gone like flash!

No one likes elusiveness anymore

\Originally posted by ewinter43
interesting, i'd like to try something like that

Go ahead, training blueprint is in the OP . Maybe CB blitzer's and RB/FB are the main ones I'd suggest trying it on. Make strength on a DT to see if you can do fun rev-cake stuff with the str>agi break block VA thing. WR/TE can't get as high though due to stupid 5 majors, which is sad...

https://glb.warriorgeneral.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2565319 was my past 174 spd dot for reference.

Originally posted by Kenshinzen
Yes because system count them as knocked loose (thank Borf). When a HB runs outside with a ball in his hands don't know if a LB or safety hit him what can happen. Still never tried a build like that and can't be sure, he needs just a fake and is gone like flash!

Ya, this dot was focused less on faking and instead had a ton in BT's which broke tackles in natty pro but not WL.

But seeing a dot turn the corner and pull away from 160 spd DB's is a thing of beauty!

https://glb.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2456143&pbp_id=1613613

https://glb.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2456143&pbp_id=1614048

https://glb.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay.pl?game_id=2456143&pbp_id=1614161

Originally posted by WiSeIVIaN
Is this true? Is general accepted practice that non-BT dots need soft capped strength on offense?

WR's mostly have 20 strength (or less). I don't think 20/60 wr's cause a fumbling pandemic?

All of WL last season only had 35 fumbles lost. That's about 3 per team per season. Obv 90 carrying RB's will fumble less though.


The 1.0 version had 49/73 as I was trying to break tackles as well (which is something that wasn't worth the resource allocation for WL) and averaged 3 fumbles lost in WL seasons. So perhaps the concern is legitimate.

Do you recommend 1-capping vision and using the free SP to softcap strength, or something different?


I think you see less fumbles from WR's because most high quality DB's covering them are less than, or equal to, in size and strength as well as the fact that they have fewer 'head-on' collisions. One reason Returners need high carrying (and strength and, if possible, body size) is because they have a LOT of head-on collisions. These types of collisions generally cause the most fumbles and Bort confirmed that in his old Q&A sessions (it's in my notes... would be some doing to find it now). Body weight and size + inertia at impact (read head on collisions) + Strength and Carrying, along with all VA's and SA's that impact/defend against/cause fumbles are what determines the outcome. Many HHLB's made to force fumbles on returners are built big, fast, and strong to take advantage of those facts. WR's tend to get tackled by little DB's and from behind. HB's tend to run into more head-on style tackles and against big LB's and D-linemen. That's where your fumbles happen most.

Since my dot was a returner, yes... I had very high carrying and more than1st cap strength. If built as a pure rusher I would likely still want 1st cap strength and very good carrying. Besides... carrying is the skill that helps Juke and Spin and other elusive SA's fire (as well as PHB SA's too) so I'd want no less than 80 carrying for any rushing dot. WR's can get by with a lot less. As an OC I do sometimes use our Scatbacks, occasionally, to run the ball (very little, but it's useful sometimes). When they fumble it's generally on those rushing plays... not as receivers. Maybe there's a 'Borf' to passing fumbles since KL's are just fumbles that aren't stat'd as fumbles maybe it's not different. Would need to pry into Bort's mind to get those answers. Perhaps he'd submit to a Vulcan Mind-Meld?

As for Vision, I went high because... again... returner. And it seemed to really help him know WHERE to run. He made the least mistakes on choosing where to run than any other returner I had built so far. As a EHB, I would think you want more than 1st cap vision. Maybe 2nd cap (60's) would be ok? I mean, 174 speed looks awesome but, TBH, my 158 guy... with all his bonuses and such... hardly ever got caught from behind once he broke into the clear. Hope this gives you some things to think on.

It's an interesting concept, but I think it's different than it used to be, or maybe I just didn't realize before.

There's a ton of games that are won, due to one big play.

I wouldn't approach this dot looking for statistical dominance. I'd get this dot 5-10 plays per game, and hope for a "lucky" play.

I think I'd like this dot better as a Scat, and 1-cap Vision and spend the savings on Catching. You'd be giving up the Green on Juke, but gaining another thing for the defense to guard against. Juke is already stacked to death, does it need the Green bonus?

Originally posted by TJ Spikes
It's an interesting concept, but I think it's different than it used to be, or maybe I just didn't realize before.

There's a ton of games that are won, due to one big play.

I wouldn't approach this dot looking for statistical dominance. I'd get this dot 5-10 plays per game, and hope for a "lucky" play.

I think I'd like this dot better as a Scat, and 1-cap Vision and spend the savings on Catching. You'd be giving up the Green on Juke, but gaining another thing for the defense to guard against. Juke is already stacked to death, does it need the Green bonus?



Good thoughts. Ya I was planning to make a superspeed elusive rb, scat rb, and scat fb actually. I feel confident quick cut can help the spd+agi gap pretty well.

But agreed maybe even this dot, softcapped catching makes him usable in that role. Appreciated.