Warrior General Games

I'm someone who a lot of people steer newbies toward, and if there's one thing I've noticed about people getting involved in the game is that the longer someone has to wait to feel involved and learning - the more likely they will be to just walk away from the game.

Not many are going to want to spend on it unless they can get a feel for what the game involves, a good taste of games and an ability to see progress on a daily basis.

I think the strongest way to achieve this is to promote pickup players to new users.

They can play multiple games a day, can give users a consequence-free way to dabble in the building process, and let people get engaged as much as they want to up front to get a feel for what the game can be.

To that extent, I think the site needs to lead users to pickup players naturally, highly recommend new users start off by making pickup players to get a feel for the game, and give players a fully boosted free pickup to use so they can get a feel for the weight and difference that boosting will give them on their players.



I have seen more than a few users get involved, and then just turn off when they realize that to build to the meta they are going to have to learn a bunch of new stuff immediately, that they can fail really hard up front in a game they are spending money on just to play in the first place, and if they dive in with a new team often it can feel like a real rip-off to have spent that money blindly with no hope of success without having to trash the whole thing and spend even more.


I think a key reason we have retention problems lies within the fact that people who want to get more involved have to either climb a giant wall of learning with limited interaction along the way or jump into competition blindly.




Rainbow 6 siege requires players to hit level 50 by playing in unranked rooms before they can even play in ranked - because shit is serious in ranked and they don't want noobies getting smacked hard in a game that is difficult to learn the ins and outs of. It's a good way of doing things and we already have a pickup system in place. It'd be a great way to let players get involved on their own terms and then spend more comfortably on real players and boosting when they learn a little bit more.

I guess the only thing they can do is steer them towards pick up players. They can already create a free pick up player with max boosting right from the start...I think.

Originally posted by Cybertron
I guess the only thing they can do is steer them towards pick up players. They can already create a free pick up player with max boosting right from the start...I think.

Boosts on pickup players cost flex, even if it's a free pickup player

Originally posted by bmg_3
Boosts on pickup players cost flex, even if it's a free pickup player
This is why I made the suggestion that boosts should be free for Pick-up Players. Then, if they get converted to a standard player, charge all the appropriate flex at that point.

Originally posted by Ace of Spades 7

This is why I made the suggestion that boosts should be free for Pick-up Players. Then, if they get converted to a standard player, charge all the appropriate flex at that point.

Might be a good idea to give them at least one that can boost all the way and one that can't - so they can get a feel for the difference in how much boosting will effect their player. I'd say at least one fully free and boosted and then 2 unboosted. Maybe make boosting cheaper for pickups and then build in the extra cost for a conversion, anything that lets users feel the weight of boosting and get a feel for things before investing a bunch into the game.

It's a pretty steep wall to get competitive in this game, and even after getting a little more acquainted with building there is still a crap-ton for users to learn, but this kind of thing could help to at least get them basic building blocks of knowledge to make that wall a little easier to tackle and let them get addicted before having to spend too much

This is honestly such a perfect mindset and approach to new player retention. Having been a new player recently, this echoes my experience exactly.

tell ya what else would help less off days should be like 3gms on then off day then 3 more spd up seasons a bit an more people may hang around too

I mean, there's a lot of issues with new user retention, pick up players were created to help that issue a little bit, but it's still a pretty far cry from being that great at retention.

Even with pickup players, you spend your points, then the game is like "cool, come back in 30 minutes to an hour". Which, in comparison to most games nowadays, is pretty much met with a "no thanks". Freemium mobile games, for instance, tend to give you a few solid hours of steady interaction before being like "come back later, or pay money". The nature of this game, however, doesn't lend itself to on-demand play, sims take a long time and a lot of processing to finish, so you're inevitably going to be sat twiddling your thumbs.

The other, and really probably insurmountable issue that would require a complete rework of the foundation of the game...is that players aren't particularly interesting to build. It takes months to see them make progress, and people can make few decisions or interact with the sim in any meaningful way. Ownership is where most of the meat is. The problem with that, though, is that more teams means more sims, and with most of the income so loaded into players with teams being cheap, giving new players a team instead isn't a practical and sustainable solution.

I've pitched and discussed ideas with Bort to make the game potentially more team centric and have income more linked to that, with less focus on player building, but really at that point we're talking about a completely different game.

Why don't you update and give more tactics to each position? I've been saying this for a long time. Tactics are the most underutilized and biggest potential to get involved, game to game, with player building.

EX: Make a tactic for blocking. If a player wants to run block better in game, give him some tactic that give +5 to run block tech and -5 to run block power...or vice versa...or +5 to run block power. Players could have several tactics that are useful and can change each game, depending on the game plan. WRs could have blocking, running, catching, etc... There is so much potential with tactics, I cannot believe you have not updated them since season 1, I don't think. And you even have some positions with only 1 tactic, and that tactic is useless. The only tactic a center has is carry style...really??? Come on man!

Originally posted by Cybertron
Why don't you update and give more tactics to each position? I've been saying this for a long time. Tactics are the most underutilized and biggest potential to get involved, game to game, with player building.

EX: Make a tactic for blocking. If a player wants to run block better in game, give him some tactic that give +5 to run block tech and -5 to run block power...or vice versa...or +5 to run block power.

Cool, so a tactic you set once and forget about that serves no other purpose than to further empower one dimensional teams and builds. Super engaging.

Originally posted by Corndog
Cool, so a tactic you set once and forget about that serves no other purpose than to further empower one dimensional teams and builds. Super engaging.

Hmmm....maybe you are correct. It wouldn't give them enough additional SPs to warrant a significant change in their game plan, which is where I was headed. But maybe you can add tactics that change, not only the SPs, but how the player plays. Like with running the ball...that literally changes how they run, not just SPs. Or how defensive players blitz. I still think the "play action" one I suggested in the other thread would be a good example. Try to find how each position plays, and see if you can add a tactic. Maybe pulling guards, pull closer to the line or further down field? QB lofts the ball or bullets the ball down field?

I mean, I guess, but basically everything turns into "set it once and forget it". Even the interesting carrying style choices are "figure out the best then forget about it". If you're looking for interesting on demand player engagement, you're not even in the right forest, let alone barking up the right tree with player tactics.

Frankly, people aren't stumbling into this expecting a mobile game - but that doesn't mean we can let days pass before they can make progress. I'm not saying we need a huge rework, just something to give people a reason to check in more often up front- and also a way to dabble more with the basic building blocks before investing a ton.

You say player building isn't all that fun, but it's literally the reason I'm still here. If people were given a better platform to test new builds in, you might even see more diversity creep into build styles as people are less inclined to stick to guides and templates.

And then what happens when those people use the platform to test out builds, find all the broken stuff, and burn out after a month?

Originally posted by Corndog
And then what happens when those people use the platform to test out builds, find all the broken stuff, and burn out after a month?

If it really comes down to people finding exploits, the fact more people will be testing it means the problems will become visible sooner and give you more time to figure out ways to counteract that before teams just suddenly show up in vet smashing face on exploits.

I mean we're 53 seasons in and I'm still pushing builds around and rejecting meta - I don't think making it a little easier for players will suddenly cause people to get done what I've spent a career messing around with in a month, and I don't think this game is as simple as one best build for any team.