Warrior General Games

So traits were supposed to provide a random element to this game but of course those were easily gamed from the beginning. At this point some people are worried that there isn't really much the game is doing to separate builds from one another. And while I do believe that builds can be separated a decent amount through the SP's and traits, there still is a part of me sitting on some of my players right now that thinks man I am beginning to force myself to put points into balanced areas because im hitting the caps on all my builds. So I threw this idea at Corndog earlier and just wanted to see what other people think, maybe add on to the idea or whatever.
So once we hit veteran league a lot of players will have relatively similar skills and be a bit balanced out so it would be nice to keep players going into their respective skill sets as specialized guys. In steps Random VA Boost. Now this boost wouldn't be available till Vet league because in the rest of the leagues you are still maturing and have skill points to spend to specialize all you want. This boost just sends you into more specialization. Maybe even offered seasonally? I dunno I haven't gotten that far. The point however is that the boost, while offering boosts to your specialized skill set, is totally random.

Example:

Let's say you were building a scat back. So you would select your boost as Scat Back VA. This is all you would know about this VA.

This VA might give you +10 Sprinting/Quickness
This VA might give you +10 Receiving Hands/Receiving Grip
This VA might give you +10 Power Running/Carrying Awareness
etc...

Those are just rough example numbers, but you get the point. They boost an unknown aspect of your receiving game which may or may not coincide with your ultimate build plan, but still is helpful either way.

Thoughts?

I'm not a fan of random. If I were building a scat back, and I got Receiving Hands, I'd be pissed. My scat back won't be as good as another who just got lucky on a roll.

Instead, let agents pick the larger boost that their player gets (those +10's), but make them dependent on having spent enough in the skill already. That keeps with your desire for more specialized since all an agent can do is improve things his guy already has at high levels, but doesn't leave things to chance.

sounds like cap boosts to me without having to spend the sp's?

Originally posted by Xavori
I'm not a fan of random. If I were building a scat back, and I got Receiving Hands, I'd be pissed. My scat back won't be as good as another who just got lucky on a roll.

Instead, let agents pick the larger boost that their player gets (those +10's), but make them dependent on having spent enough in the skill already. That keeps with your desire for more specialized since all an agent can do is improve things his guy already has at high levels, but doesn't leave things to chance.

You wouldn't know what boost you got. You would just know that it helped something to your receiving build. If you can just pick what you get it really is worthless because everyone picks the same thing obviously.

Originally posted by Mordaloch
sounds like cap boosts to me without having to spend the sp's?

Kinda though cap boosts are just +5 each to an attribute up to 15 total. This would specialize your general build idea a bit more in a random way. Kinda a way to randomly make players special in a different way than just saying hey SUPERSTAR.

Originally posted by bhall43
You wouldn't know what boost you got. You would just know that it helped something to your receiving build. If you can just pick what you get it really is worthless because everyone picks the same thing obviously.

That's worse. Not only random, but I don't even know what new skills my guy might have, and hence, can't actually include those skills in my gameplanning?

As for worthless because everyone picks the same thing...nope. I guarantee you'll find people making their speedsters faster or their scat backs more elusive or the power backs stronger which is what you said you wanted to begin with: specializing.

What you're proposing is dumbing down the game to even more blind luck, literally.

Originally posted by Xavori
That's worse. Not only random, but I don't even know what new skills my guy might have, and hence, can't actually include those skills in my gameplanning?

As for worthless because everyone picks the same thing...nope. I guarantee you'll find people making their speedsters faster or their scat backs more elusive or the power backs stronger which is what you said you wanted to begin with: specializing.

What you're proposing is dumbing down the game to even more blind luck, literally.

Naw it would just come down to the same things. Speed and strength. To which point there is no need to bother.

And you aren't going to change your gameplan based on this bonus. Your gameplan already exists because of what the guy already is made to be and picked.

Originally posted by bhall43
Naw it would just come down to the same things. Speed and strength. To which point there is no need to bother.

And you aren't going to change your gameplan based on this bonus. Your gameplan already exists because of what the guy already is made to be and picked.

Uh...which aspects of Speed and Strength? Do I want better acceleration? Higher top speed? Better conditioning to stay at top speed longer? And strength; do I want Power Running? Balance? Carrying Awareness? What about QB's? What about CB's?

I can make good arguments for boosting 5-6 skills for each position, and I'm sure other people have their own ideas.

And you're right. I wouldn't change my gameplan. I'd just be getting lucky sometimes because I had a secret bonus to some of my dice rolls. That's what I dislike the most. I don't want more luck. I want more skill and strategy.

You wouldn't change your gameplan even if you knew what the bonus was.

And good luck trying to argue quickness over sprinting to me in vet league.

Awesome idea,

but I think your ultimate goal,

Originally posted by bhall43
separate builds from one another.

Which is very legitimate imo,

can also be accomplished far more easily by reducing # of SPs allowed in our careers.

Less SPs, more thought goes into where those SPs go.
Ofc. this brings about the fact there will be more ppl trying to make round builds and ultimately sucking but hey......

lost my train of thought so im stopping here.

Well you aren't gonna get sp limitation anymore. The game is already out of the bag. Plus SP limitation has already been done a couple times via making attributes more spendy and through traits.

Oh true.

X-factor already exists. You're just proposing we give the player agent some amount of control over it?

Originally posted by bhall43
So traits were supposed to provide a random element to this game but of course those were easily gamed from the beginning. At this point some people are worried that there isn't really much the game is doing to separate builds from one another. And while I do believe that builds can be separated a decent amount through the SP's and traits, there still is a part of me sitting on some of my players right now that thinks man I am beginning to force myself to put points into balanced areas because im hitting the caps on all my builds. So I threw this idea at Corndog earlier and just wanted to see what other people think, maybe add on to the idea or whatever.
So once we hit veteran league a lot of players will have relatively similar skills and be a bit balanced out so it would be nice to keep players going into their respective skill sets as specialized guys. In steps Random VA Boost. Now this boost wouldn't be available till Vet league because in the rest of the leagues you are still maturing and have skill points to spend to specialize all you want. This boost just sends you into more specialization. Maybe even offered seasonally? I dunno I haven't gotten that far. The point however is that the boost, while offering boosts to your specialized skill set, is totally random.

Example:

Let's say you were building a scat back. So you would select your boost as Scat Back VA. This is all you would know about this VA.

This VA might give you +10 Sprinting/Quickness
This VA might give you +10 Receiving Hands/Receiving Grip
This VA might give you +10 Power Running/Carrying Awareness
etc...

Those are just rough example numbers, but you get the point. They boost an unknown aspect of your receiving game which may or may not coincide with your ultimate build plan, but still is helpful either way.

Thoughts?
Sorry... I missed this one earlier.

I actually wouldn't mind some randomness in vet leagues when we've stopped assigning points but I think some rare firing hidden Signature Abilities might make it more interesting, they would fire based on your build but without published standards on the exact numbers you would need where to activate it like:

Level 1 would have a 0.5% chance of firing
Level 2 would have a 1% chance of firing
Level 3 .. a 2% chance of firing

Hurdle for RB's. The SA might fire against a diving tackle who would then be hurdled.

Inside Hands for offensive linemen. Essentially holding where offensive linemen get away with it he drags the downlinemen down on top of him (just like they do sometimes now by running their hands inside the frame of the defenders arms)

What goes on under the pile..... For any defensive player. When two defenders are tackling the ball carrier simultaneously and cause a fumble, if the RB recovers the fumble with the defender lying on top of him the defender has a minute chance of wrestling the ball back

Leap into the stands After scoring a TD at home, a player could leap into the stands , pumping up the home crowd and granting a +5 heart bonus

Spin Away Quarterback, while throwing from the pocket a QB is in the danger zone of a defender about to sack him, the QB will duck , change direction, and spin to the other side of the pocket.

... Obviously we'll need many of them and the assignment should be logical but random.

Basically at the start of every season each player would get one randomly assigned based on them meeting certain criteria like for example a HB would only get a chance to get Hurdle if they have 50 balance, 35 vertical, and 35 footwork (arbitrary just saying there should be a baseline). The SA would be determined at random from all the special SA's the player has.

The SA would be hidden until it fires in a game then would appear on the player sheet. If you got the same random one the next season it would appear as a level 2. So on and so forth.

I think it would add some of the WOW plays that NFL football is famous for and certainly spice up the game sim a bit. So long as they are very rare firing and balanced offense/defense it would be interesting while not totally overpowering. It would also , being based on your stats, be generally aligned with your player.

Originally posted by william78

Sorry... I missed this one earlier.

I actually wouldn't mind some randomness in vet leagues when we've stopped assigning points but I think some rare firing hidden Signature Abilities might make it more interesting, they would fire based on your build but without published standards on the exact numbers you would need where to activate it like:

Level 1 would have a 0.5% chance of firing
Level 2 would have a 1% chance of firing
Level 3 .. a 2% chance of firing

Hurdle for RB's. The SA might fire against a diving tackle who would then be hurdled.

Inside Hands for offensive linemen. Essentially holding where offensive linemen get away with it he drags the downlinemen down on top of him (just like they do sometimes now by running their hands inside the frame of the defenders arms)

What goes on under the pile..... For any defensive player. When two defenders are tackling the ball carrier simultaneously and cause a fumble, if the RB recovers the fumble with the defender lying on top of him the defender has a minute chance of wrestling the ball back

Leap into the stands After scoring a TD at home, a player could leap into the stands , pumping up the home crowd and granting a +5 heart bonus

Spin Away Quarterback, while throwing from the pocket a QB is in the danger zone of a defender about to sack him, the QB will duck , change direction, and spin to the other side of the pocket.

... Obviously we'll need many of them and the assignment should be logical but random.


I like this more than build related stuff. Since the chances are small, it's not going to have dramatic impacts on the way games go, but it will add a bit, and more importantly, some flavor to watching replays.