Warrior General Games

and just let himself be sacked?

Just wondering cause I see it all the time.

It seems like this is part of the reason so many teams spam the shit out of the blitz.
If the QB won't pass to a wide open first read on a pass why would anyone not send the house on every snap?

This is a combination of plays and QB builds.

On the side of plays is that the wide open guy isn't necessarily the QB's 1st read in the playbook. Then there is the simple fact that some plays require the QB to wait longer before getting rid of the ball. Then you have game situations that make it likely the QB will hold the ball (3rd and long being the most obvious, and painful, case)

On builds, it comes down to the QB failing their Pass Awareness check. The sim isn't really "reading" the defense. It's making a dice roll for each WR in a progression set by the play. If it comes to the wide open WR and the QB fails that dice roll, they don't even get to evaluate whether they'll throw the ball to that player, they just go to the next WR in the progression and roll the dice again until they pass both the Pass Awareness check, and then whatever evaluation the sim goes through to decide whether to throw the ball our not).

By the way, while I can tell you you need to build Pass Awareness to make it more likely you'll throw the ball before blitzers arrive, I have no idea what the conditions are for deciding if a QB will pass or go to a checkdown. This is because in watching the Lost Lounge play offense all the time, I see 20-30 passes EVERY FRAKKIN' GAME that go to WR's who'd I'd consider to be totally covered. This tells me that either a) the sim has no criteria and just throws the ball at whatever WR the QB is on when he passes the awareness check, b) the criteria involves a bunch of variables that have nothing to do with how tightly covered the WR actually is, or c) the criteria I think are used get applied at a time that is not accurately portrayed in the replays which makes it impossible for me to be sure about how accurate what I think is happening actually is (ie. you can't reverse engineer that which you cannot observe).

For one just because its a first read doesn't entirely mean the QB is making a clean visible read to that WR.

Secondly, Zone Defense would be entirely more laughable than it currently is if a first read non covered player was just blindly thrown to right away.

Part of it is build related too. But the all out blitz works sometimes because it rattles the QB. Which is realistic. But people aren't spamming blitz's come Seasoned season as it is a good way to get crushed by any of the teams that know what they are doing.

Originally posted by bhall43
Part of it is build related too. But the all out blitz works sometimes because it rattles the QB. Which is realistic. But people aren't spamming blitz's come Seasoned season as it is a good way to get crushed by any of the teams that know what they are doing.

It doesn't work all that well in late rookie/any sophomore against a good passing team. QB's just get rid of the ball too fast when they have no reason to hold it longer than their 1st or 2nd 'read'.

And ya, play calling has to do with it too. The first read is almost entirely irrelevant to the equation often times. In fact you can punch in a certain play vs. a certain defense and 95% of the time come away with the exact same throw with the result depending on whether or not the defender made a jump for the play or not. That is why I am unsure this game survives without getting a little more complicated. Everything is essentially coded in with the same results currently.

Originally posted by Xavori
It doesn't work all that well in late rookie/any sophomore against a good passing team. QB's just get rid of the ball too fast when they have no reason to hold it longer than their 1st or 2nd 'read'.



Right but late rookie you can still get there part of the time. Sophmore still seems to be a little more build related. By seasoned though the QB and receivers just do most the work while the oline is just kinda there it seems. At least from what I have watched. And that has been sorta the case in Sophmore too since my all run based oline seems to be just fine at holding its own against any blitz.

I understand what you guys are saying, but it still seems like the QB actually should throw to his wide open first read on a pass play when he is getting blitzed every play.

Guess the real issue is that he is just as terrible at reading that blitz the 50th time he sees it as he was the first time he saw it. Just like defenses for O's spamming certain plays dozens of times a game. Too bad GLB never figured out how to deal with that part of the code. I think it would make the game a lot more fun.

Originally posted by glwarriors
I understand what you guys are saying, but it still seems like the QB actually should throw to his wide open first read on a pass play when he is getting blitzed every play.

Guess the real issue is that he is just as terrible at reading that blitz the 50th time he sees it as he was the first time he saw it. Just like defenses for O's spamming certain plays dozens of times a game. Too bad GLB never figured out how to deal with that part of the code. I think it would make the game a lot more fun.

You have to remember sim players don't learn anything from doing. They 'learn' by having SP's spent on relevant skills.

Oh, and I'm a fan of the idea of boosting awareness versus spammed plays which would definitely improve the QB's chances of reading the blitz and getting rid of the ball more quickly.

I don't mind spamming but I wish teams had more of an identity. Like the guys who rock gl sweep aren't then moving to spread dive and 5 wr hooks. Would be cool if there was certain playbooks and you forced to pick your identity as a coach when signing on to a team as oc or dc.

Originally posted by bhall43
I don't mind spamming but I wish teams had more of an identity. Like the guys who rock gl sweep aren't then moving to spread dive and 5 wr hooks. Would be cool if there was certain playbooks and you forced to pick your identity as a coach when signing on to a team as oc or dc.

You do... It's the way the players are built. Not every team will run a dangerous GL pitch, then the next down run an equally dangerous 5wr throw.

I think it would be kinda cool to locking in playbooks to certain types of plays, but i also think reducing the # of SPs given in the players career would do the same thing.

Originally posted by bhall43
I don't mind spamming but I wish teams had more of an identity. Like the guys who rock gl sweep aren't then moving to spread dive and 5 wr hooks. Would be cool if there was certain playbooks and you forced to pick your identity as a coach when signing on to a team as oc or dc.

I'm actually building my rookie team sorta along those lines, but it's as much out of necessity as anything. Defenses just get better at defending the sweeps as their players get faster.

The problem is that the spread dives require a powerful o-line, and that takes a lot more SP's than just a technique line even if you build monsters to be your o-line. So it has to wait. It might very well have to wait until after the 10k points for end of season star and boosts.

Originally posted by Jampy2.0
You do... It's the way the players are built. Not every team will run a dangerous GL pitch, then the next down run an equally dangerous 5wr throw.


Not really. The way it is now you can essentially build your team with a run anything and everything philosophy. I am not talking about an all run or all pass team. But more so an identity to whether you are a spread offense or a wishbone style team. And the type of offense playbook you choose signing with a team would revolve around a position or 2, highlighting superstars a bit more. In order to hinder a person from jumping playbook to playbook each season there could also be a small boost to your playbook each season you stick with it as a team. +1 AP point for everyone or something up to 5 seasons.

Examples:

Playbook 1: A mix of Pro Set, Wish Bone (ideally I think this game needs the wishbone ), GL, Big I. Then you choose a mix of 2 positions to highlight (TE, HB, FB, WR, RQB) and it shoots out a playbook with those formations of plays that revolve around those 2 positions. Also ideally the dives and slams would have more variety to them from each formation. With the ability to hit 9/7/3/5/2/4/6/8 holes instead of just a select few. Like with the FB that would be nice imo.

Playbook 2: A mix of 5 WR, Spread, Trips, and probs Shotgun. Same thing, highlight plays revolving around 2 positions except here obviously no FB.

Playbook 3: I form, Strong I, Weak I, Big I.

Playbook 4: Big I, SB Big, Power I, GL

Playbook 5: SB Big, SB, SG, Trips

etc...

Originally posted by Xavori

The problem is that the spread dives require a powerful o-line, and that takes a lot more SP's than just a technique line even if you build monsters to be your o-line. So it has to wait. It might very well have to wait until after the 10k points for end of season star and boosts.

Naw, those just take good HB's with plenty of awareness.

Originally posted by bhall43
Not really...

That sounds awesome tbh. Anything for forcing to teams having a true identity is +1 to me

I like the idea of team identity / philosophy with some reward for consistency.

it seems like you could do the same thing on a game by game basis for spammed plays though, by either nerfing the spammer or buffing the spamee. After a play is run 10 times the opponent gets x% boost every time the play is run again up to a maximum. That would make a lot of games much more interesting, but not totally change the dynamic.