Warrior General Games

Summary of recent testing activity ...



1. Reworked Pump Fake

Originally posted by Bort
With the addition of new fake SA's, I redid the pump fake skill to work pretty much primarily on nearby zone defenders, and added an icon for when a guy falls for it. Might be kinda weak now, not sure, but combined with look off it seems pretty decent.
Originally posted by PP
I'll setup a test in the morning....one D will run pure zone, the other pure man, I'll just run the pump n go all game for both teams, no repeat play penalty.
I'll be honest, though. I'm more than a little worried about this. WRs weren't getting open nearly enough before. If the pump fake isn't as effective against man as it was, this could be a no good thing, IMO



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2. Double Morale/Energy effect

Originally posted by Bort
Uploaded version of sim with double morale/energy effect for testing. Could be too strong now, but also could be lolworthy in Q4
    Catch ran three test games:
        Game 1 - Energy and Morale both enabled: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1952
        Game 2 - Morale disabled: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1953
        Game 3 - Energy Disabled: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1954
    ... and then three more with energy settings at 1/0 to minimize subs:
        Game 4 - Energy and Morale both enabled, settings at 1/0: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1955
        Game 5 - Energy and Morale both enabled, settings at 1/0: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1956        
        Game 6 - Energy and Morale both enabled, settings at 1/0, depth chart set up correctly: http://test.goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1957

● Bort is currently tinkering with the rate of Breath drain, possibly a "compounding effect" resulting in players getting tired faster late in games.
● Side discussion brought up the idea of icons/pop-ups/indicators for players' current in-game morale/energy levels. Bort likes the idea.


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3. Reward Points

Originally posted by Bort
Added a new type of point: reward points. These are like flex points, but are non-refundable on retire. They'll be taking the place of the free handouts and used to track free players, etc. They cannot be used on team-related purchases, other than scrimmages, however, because there are a lot of multis that get created to simply buy peewee or casual teams (we'll be raising the price of these to 450 or 500).

Things that should have been completed with this:

* Show reward points on home page
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on flex points page
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on boost player and spend reward points first
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on boost all players page and spend reward points first
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on create player and spend reward points first
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on custom item and spend reward points first
* Show reward points as part of flex point total on buy PF and spend reward points first
* Spend reward points first for friendly scrimmage price
* Make custom eq refund not count reward points when selling directly
* Make retirement refund not count reward points used toward total and spend reward points first
* Add ability to see/edit reward points on user admin

Admins (me, catch) should be able to add points to your account if you want to test it.
Originally posted by jbleich
Something we can use to tie in "rewards" for frequent Boosters/Flex Buyers? I know you had mentioned it a while back and it's been referenced a few times in GLB main, but now you've got the interface for it.

I do agree that the "reward" flex that you hand out every season should be not refunded on retirement.

And the raise in Pee Wee/Casual team price is not going to go over well
Originally posted by Bort
Ding ding

Gives us more freedom to do rewards because we're not giving away a 70% refund with it too. That adds up!

Team price raise is required to get rid of the damn multi exploit. We shut down at least 30-40 multis with nothing but new teams every season. They're used for cash farms or to get a free team. Even if it was 401, it would fix it, but it should be an even number


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4. Percentage items with diminishing returns

Originally posted by Bort
Diminishing returns coded in sim and on player profile.

● Preparing interface/mechanics for changes.


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5. Updated refund price for offseason retirements

Originally posted by Bort
Full refund for < 80 day old players, 80% refund for 120 day old players
Need math check I guess.

● Preparing interface/mechanics for changes.


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Will currently owned Casual League teams now cost 450-500 to extend ownership? Because, that kind of sucks.

Originally posted by turnit643
Originally posted by PP
I'll setup a test in the morning....one D will run pure zone, the other pure man, I'll just run the pump n go all game for both teams, no repeat play penalty.
I'll be honest, though. I'm more than a little worried about this. WRs weren't getting open nearly enough before. If the pump fake isn't as effective against man as it was, this could be a no good thing, IMO


i really hope they stick with that change.

the whole reasoning behind m2m not being pump faked is the defender isnt looking at the QB. they need to stick with that thought process and if m2m is too good then make m2m less able to react to the pass by making a tougher vision check for a m2m defender to see the pass immediately.

Originally posted by monsterkill
i really hope they stick with that change.

the whole reasoning behind m2m not being pump faked is the defender isnt looking at the QB. they need to stick with that thought process and if m2m is too good then make m2m less able to react to the pass by making a tougher vision check for a m2m defender to see the pass immediately.

Agree. The interactions should be 'logical' and if the interactions are logical and the results are not, then we tweak various components while keeping the interactions as they were until the target range is met.

Maybe the vision check for keeping in close coverage when a route change is made and the WR cuts needs to be harder to make. Maybe the Agility requirement for the cut for the CB needs to be higher, or the speed loss on the cut higher for the CB because unlike the WR they do not know where the route is going so they have to return to a more neutral position before they react, etc.

So, I am championing myself that m2m gets a 'bonus' to not being faked by pump fakes and Zone defense suffers a penalty and is easier to pump fake. Likewise, when the pass is made, the Zone defenders gt a bonus to their chance to notice the ball has been thrown and to where while the m2m coverage is slower to react if it wasn't thrown to their receiver (if they react at all honestly). Then also have in complementary abilities so that M2M coverage can be 'faked' by the receiver slowing down and acting like they are going for the catch but when the CB bites they cut and pour on the speed to gain separation etc.

M2M defender gets a penalty to reading those situations while a player in zone defense gets a bonus (decreased penalty) to read those moves.

Etc.

Originally posted by Enkidu98
Agree. The interactions should be 'logical' and if the interactions are logical and the results are not, then we tweak various components while keeping the interactions as they were until the target range is met.

Maybe the vision check for keeping in close coverage when a route change is made and the WR cuts needs to be harder to make. Maybe the Agility requirement for the cut for the CB needs to be higher, or the speed loss on the cut higher for the CB because unlike the WR they do not know where the route is going so they have to return to a more neutral position before they react, etc.

So, I am championing myself that m2m gets a 'bonus' to not being faked by pump fakes and Zone defense suffers a penalty and is easier to pump fake. Likewise, when the pass is made, the Zone defenders gt a bonus to their chance to notice the ball has been thrown and to where while the m2m coverage is slower to react if it wasn't thrown to their receiver (if they react at all honestly). Then also have in complementary abilities so that M2M coverage can be 'faked' by the receiver slowing down and acting like they are going for the catch but when the CB bites they cut and pour on the speed to gain separation etc.

M2M defender gets a penalty to reading those situations while a player in zone defense gets a bonus (decreased penalty) to read those moves.

Etc.

What about allowing then WR's to Juke or Head Fake DURING the route to create separation then that works primarily in m2m?

Originally posted by mbinger
What about allowing then WR's to Juke or Head Fake DURING the route to create separation then that works primarily in m2m?

I'm pretty sure they already can Juke and Head Fake while running routes. They just can't Spin.

Originally posted by monsterkill
i really hope they stick with that change.

the whole reasoning behind m2m not being pump faked is the defender isnt looking at the QB. they need to stick with that thought process and if m2m is too good then make m2m less able to react to the pass by making a tougher vision check for a m2m defender to see the pass immediately.

I'm pushing hard for man coverage mechanics to be redone, and that is definitely on the list.

Originally posted by monsterkill
i really hope they stick with that change.

the whole reasoning behind m2m not being pump faked is the defender isnt looking at the QB. they need to stick with that thought process and if m2m is too good then make m2m less able to react to the pass by making a tougher vision check for a m2m defender to see the pass immediately.

It's not unheard of for a CB in M2M to get caught looking in the backfield and blow his assignment. It shouldn't be a complete M2M=NO PF... It should be tied to vision, coverage aggressive and distance. And it should be dialed down (in no way should it happen as frequently as it happens now in M2M).

Originally posted by monsterkill
i really hope they stick with that change.

the whole reasoning behind m2m not being pump faked is the defender isnt looking at the QB. they need to stick with that thought process and if m2m is too good then make m2m less able to react to the pass by making a tougher vision check for a m2m defender to see the pass immediately.

In reality, I don't completely disagree with this at all, but here's the rub. GLB isn't reality. I'm all for making things as realistic as practical, so long as it doesn't destroy the fun, but we're dealing with SPs here.

1st, why would a QB invest a bunch of points into something that only works against zone coverage? Sure, you can counter that by saying DBs have to choose SAs based on man or zone coverage, but their DC can easily put a man CB in man all game long and a zone CB in zone.

Next, it's no more realistic for a zone CB to be PFed than a man CB. Either way, it only occurs when the CB is actively covering the WR. In GLB, and to a great extent in real FB, when a WR is traveling through a zone defender's "zone" that defender is covering in man like any man CB does, up until he releases the WR. He's not looking in the backfield any more or less than a CB playing pure man, while he's in his coverage zone. It's only when he's not actively covering a WR that his eyes are focused on the QBs more. So, why should one CB that's actively engaging in man coverage bite any more or less than the other?

Lastly, the way we're currently heading, the new version of PF would only work against zone and the new Look Off would only work against zone, just just the Catch Fake would work against man. In order to balance that out, you'd either have to over power Catch Fake and under power PF and Look Off or just kill zones and be done with it.

Originally posted by PP
1st, why would a QB invest a bunch of points into something that only works against zone coverage?

There are a slew of situational VAs that only work in certain, limited, situations. Some SAs only work vs pass plays, some only work against run plays. Even the new proposed Elusive SA only works when there is only 1 defender within 10 yds. We're asked to make choices like this all the time.

of course it shouldn't be all or nothing for zone or man. my bad if that's what people got from my post.

it should be easy enough to identify if a defender is attempting to cover a receiver, whether it's m2m or or a zone defender that has committed to a single receiver

do it like this. get 3 coordinates, the receiver, the defender, and QB. a triangle.

get the angle of the defender's vertex. pump fake's effectiveness should be closely related to that angle and their aggressiveness tactic.
less than ~60 degrees means the QB and WR are both in the defender's vision cone at the same time and there's a good chance he would fall for a pump fake.
as that angle gets larger, it should be increasingly less likely that the defender is looking at the QB during the pump fake

that angle should also have a similar effect on the vision check to see the ball in the air for the first couple ticks

and only do all that for m2m or zone defenders that have selected a receiver to cover in their zone.

if you're worried QBs won't invest in pump fake then add this. get the line from the qb to receiver at the time of the pump fake, any blitzing d line man crossed by that line might fall for it and try to deflect it, if they're close enough to the QB. you'd think that would have an effect on their fight/shed block rolls for a tick or two.

i havent heard about catch fake, but i assume it's a receiver reaching up like the ball is coming in to make the defender turn or jump?

could use that same angle for catch fake's effectiveness, but reversed..assuming catch fake is what i think it is

Originally posted by monsterkill
i havent heard about catch fake, but i assume it's a receiver reaching up like the ball is coming in to make the defender turn or jump?

could use that same angle for catch fake's effectiveness, but reversed..assuming catch fake is what i think it is

Yes, this is to provide a similar ability but usable against a guy in Man coverage.

SAnd I am with you.... I've never said m2m should be immune to pump fake, just have less of a chance of getting snared by PF. Likewise with Catch Fake, the M2m guy will have an increased chance to get snared but the zone coverage guy would have a reduced chance.

In both cases everyone should have a chance to get snared by it.

Originally posted by taz20075
There are a slew of situational VAs that only work in certain, limited, situations. Some SAs only work vs pass plays, some only work against run plays. Even the new proposed Elusive SA only works when there is only 1 defender within 10 yds. We're asked to make choices like this all the time.




Of course there are...some work vs the pass...PF only works when passing, so it already fits that niche. That said, GLB wide, man coverage is much more common than zone. Even during the zone craze, there were still a lot more man teams than zone. I don't want to see SAs get worse. I want to see more SAs get better. Besides, if we now have 3 SAs for beating zones and only 1 for beating man, the results aren't going to be great, IMO

Originally posted by Enkidu98
Yes, this is to provide a similar ability but usable against a guy in Man coverage.

SAnd I am with you.... I've never said m2m should be immune to pump fake, just have less of a chance of getting snared by PF. Likewise with Catch Fake, the M2m guy will have an increased chance to get snared but the zone coverage guy would have a reduced chance.

In both cases everyone should have a chance to get snared by it.

Actually, we may all be on the same page, then...I don't think DBs\LBs actively covering a WRing target, be within a zone or playing straight up man, should bite as much as the deep zone defenders reading the play, but not actively covering anyone. They should bite more than anyone. If that occurred, by default, it'd be more successful against zones, but not leave pure man Ds immune, either