Warrior General Games

More specifically, should there be a difference in flex if you create one of these as a returner?

There is absolutely no reason to create any returner as a CB any more, other than it is cheaper. A HB can simple take the return man as a 3rd SA tree skill and have the same thing. Was this thought of? Is this just to seperate the haves and have-nots? In addition to having a returner, you will also have a decent glamour position player by creating a HB/WR as a returner. If you create a CB as a returner, you've just got a decent 5th CB at best.

Thoughts?

Originally posted by RMiller517
More specifically, should there be a difference in flex if you create one of these as a returner?

There is absolutely no reason to create any returner as a CB any more, other than it is cheaper. A HB can simple take the return man as a 3rd SA tree skill and have the same thing. Was this thought of? Is this just to seperate the haves and have-nots? In addition to having a returner, you will also have a decent glamour position player by creating a HB/WR as a returner. If you create a CB as a returner, you've just got a decent 5th CB at best.

Thoughts?

It depends on the build you want. If you want a pure speedster, CBs are better since they can be lighter and have the bonus to RS. You also have to take into account that there is a limited number of sps that either of the positions can spend on attributes and SAs. All three will likely go for similar attributes and have a similar number of sps to spend on SAs. Right now I'm planning a 5'8" 170lbs CB with 10 FS, 10 CD, 16 RS, and 16 Spin, and 21% Break Tackle chance. If a WR or HB wants to try and get anything better than that in their SAs and have the same attributes, I don't think that they'd be much more successful than the CB. The CB SA tree works out perfect for a pure kr/pr as all three SAs a CB wants are the first three in the three. Add to that an option to get Spin without having to invest in any pre-reqs or the added cost of being in the 5th SA spot, and you get a huge bang for your sp buck.

Do you think that many people are going to build a man specialist CB with the .5 speed, agility, jumping, vision boost as the return man? I think that this is a good way to go for an elusive return man, but I am wondering how much better the bonus to return specialist and having carrying would make the CB specialist?

I'm probably going to build one of each and then maybe a WR version and see how they do.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Do you think that many people are going to build a man specialist CB with the .5 speed, agility, jumping, vision boost as the return man? I think that this is a good way to go for an elusive return man, but I am wondering how much better the bonus to return specialist and having carrying would make the CB specialist?

I'm probably going to build one of each and then maybe a WR version and see how they do.

I'd take the return man archetype. The switch out of jumping for carrying and the lack of a bonus to RS just isn't worth it. Plus you have to factor in whatever the archetype SA is going to be.

Originally posted by Longhornfan1024
Originally posted by Time Trial

Do you think that many people are going to build a man specialist CB with the .5 speed, agility, jumping, vision boost as the return man? I think that this is a good way to go for an elusive return man, but I am wondering how much better the bonus to return specialist and having carrying would make the CB specialist?

I'm probably going to build one of each and then maybe a WR version and see how they do.

I'd take the return man archetype. The switch out of jumping for carrying and the lack of a bonus to RS just isn't worth it. Plus you have to factor in whatever the archetype SA is going to be.

Yeah I forgot about the Archetype SA, but supposedly jumping will help elusives break diving tackles.

Cost and Atty gains.

Originally posted by Adderfist
Cost and Atty gains.

im pretty sure attribute gains will be the same...
the difference is available SAs, bonus/penalty SAs, and cost.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Yeah I forgot about the Archetype SA, but supposedly jumping will help elusives break diving tackles.

It does, but not more than carrying.

Originally posted by Worker 3
the difference is available SAs, bonus/penalty SAs, and cost.

Yep. Advantages in available SAs are worth the extra cost imo. At least in the HB's case. Maybe not for WRs, but WRs are not worth their cost in any case.

Originally posted by TrevJo
Yep. Advantages in available SAs are worth the extra cost imo. At least in the HB's case. Maybe not for WRs, but WRs are not worth their cost in any case.

Where are you going to get the sps to invest in all the extra SAs?

Originally posted by TrevJo
Yep. Advantages in available SAs are worth the extra cost imo. At least in the HB's case. Maybe not for WRs, but WRs are not worth their cost in any case.

yeah, thats what im thinking... all the extra break tackle SAs might be worth it... yeah, PT is penalized, but if that fails, you still have LTS and spin that could possibly fire, and that is if they didnt already get juked/HF'd... tack on RS as the bonus SA, and it would be a pretty build. attributes would be lower, but i think it would be effective...

more effective than a CB with good attributes, a bonus to RS, and spin as the bonus SA? i dunno, but i think both would be very effective.
i dont think anyone can say that WRs would be a better option than the other 2.

Originally posted by Longhornfan1024
Where are you going to get the sps to invest in all the extra SAs?

That's a good point. Although if you can add a little bit to a lot of good SAs instead of a lot to a few SAs, you can get more out of your SP, since SA cost goes up the higher you increase a particular SA.

I just thought of an advantage to CB Returners, though... they can be lighter. (And thus faster.)

Originally posted by TrevJo


I just thought of an advantage to CB Returners, though... they can be lighter. (And thus faster.)

yeah, that and the bonus to RS.
just those 2 things alone might be enough to make CBs the best option. although, im still tempted to play around and see how good a HB build i can muster up with all those break tackle/fake SAs.
has returner been added to the new archetype builder yet?

Originally posted by Worker 3
yeah, that and the bonus to RS.

HBs and WRs can now choose RS as their Bonus SA.

Has a player builder with the KR/PR archetypes come out yet?