You almost did it! You guys are a great team and should do well in AA next season! Now The BR Tigers are going to represent you and ALL of Alpha and show those Zeta punks who the superior conference is!
kaamiin
offline
offline
Originally posted by Dolfan03041992
You almost did it! You guys are a great team and should do well in AA next season! Now The BR Tigers are going to represent you and ALL of Alpha and show those Zeta punks who the superior conference is!
Wow!!! A FG with 0:47 left!
GG!!! You guys are truly the WEA5 Champs (we'll make it official in 2 days)!!!
-Wingmen
You almost did it! You guys are a great team and should do well in AA next season! Now The BR Tigers are going to represent you and ALL of Alpha and show those Zeta punks who the superior conference is!
Wow!!! A FG with 0:47 left!
GG!!! You guys are truly the WEA5 Champs (we'll make it official in 2 days)!!!
-Wingmen
About2 Break
offline
offline
Wow nice STR I slam all day from a pass heavy team! Nice game Wingman almost got us with that stuff! GL and enjoyed playing yall
kaamiin
offline
offline
Originally posted by cigtyme
Wow nice STR I slam all day from a pass heavy team! Nice game Wingman almost got us with that stuff! GL and enjoyed playing yall
Yeah, I figured it was the only way we could beat you guys (you guys are that much better than every team in the league), but the better team definitely won.
Good luck guys!
Wow nice STR I slam all day from a pass heavy team! Nice game Wingman almost got us with that stuff! GL and enjoyed playing yall
Yeah, I figured it was the only way we could beat you guys (you guys are that much better than every team in the league), but the better team definitely won.
Good luck guys!
About2 Break
offline
offline
Yes i was initially upset like not this crap, but then i realized i would of done the same thing in your shoes i just wish Bort fixes this broken Sim cause this is crap right now!!
lbrlove
offline
offline
Originally posted by cigtyme
Yes i was initially upset like not this crap, but then i realized i would of done the same thing in your shoes i just wish Bort fixes this broken Sim cause this is crap right now!!
I am not following here. What is it you are saying is "broken"?
Yes i was initially upset like not this crap, but then i realized i would of done the same thing in your shoes i just wish Bort fixes this broken Sim cause this is crap right now!!
I am not following here. What is it you are saying is "broken"?
About2 Break
offline
offline
Strong I slam play cannot be stopped effectively and an all passing team ran 60+ plays and threw 4 and almost beat us field goal with 47 sec left
lbrlove
offline
offline
Originally posted by cigtyme
Strong I slam play cannot be stopped effectively and an all passing team ran 60+ plays and threw 4 and almost beat us field goal with 47 sec left
I respectfully disagree with your logic. A "passing team" that has a 60 blocking rating and was defensed for passing manages 3.7 yds/carry with their grinder and 4.7 with their speedster against a potent near-rival.
How is that a broken sim? I mean if they could not be stopped, they certainly would not have had numbers like that (decent real-world numbers, but not undue given the circumstances). Moreover, my team which sports an uneven and somewhat-weak run-blocking line could never manage yardage like that even with a high concentration of strong-I slam plays (like I ran today). If the sim was truly "broken", my team should be able to do so even with a line not built (or leveled) to do that, right?
This is nothing like, say, the WR Screen was in season 6, a truly unstoppable play.
Bottom line, I hear a lot of talk about this, but I think it is BS. Okay, so Bort says he made the strong-I slightly too strong, but he also made FB blocking obtuse, worthless more often than not. Next season he is going to nerf the play, but improve lead blocking, so I expect you will see (gasp!) more of the same in the balance.
The only place I can concede any logic is that it is very hard to stop a strong-I slam for no gain or a loss. But that is real world too. It is the shortest path to the strongside A and B gaps so backside pursuit is useless; you are taking advantage of the strongside O-line double-team; you have a FB one step closer to the presumptive gap with a full head of steam; a good TE cuts the potential outside tackler. Any back worth salt falls forward for a yard on that play, generally gets a few.
Strong I slam play cannot be stopped effectively and an all passing team ran 60+ plays and threw 4 and almost beat us field goal with 47 sec left
I respectfully disagree with your logic. A "passing team" that has a 60 blocking rating and was defensed for passing manages 3.7 yds/carry with their grinder and 4.7 with their speedster against a potent near-rival.
How is that a broken sim? I mean if they could not be stopped, they certainly would not have had numbers like that (decent real-world numbers, but not undue given the circumstances). Moreover, my team which sports an uneven and somewhat-weak run-blocking line could never manage yardage like that even with a high concentration of strong-I slam plays (like I ran today). If the sim was truly "broken", my team should be able to do so even with a line not built (or leveled) to do that, right?
This is nothing like, say, the WR Screen was in season 6, a truly unstoppable play.
Bottom line, I hear a lot of talk about this, but I think it is BS. Okay, so Bort says he made the strong-I slightly too strong, but he also made FB blocking obtuse, worthless more often than not. Next season he is going to nerf the play, but improve lead blocking, so I expect you will see (gasp!) more of the same in the balance.
The only place I can concede any logic is that it is very hard to stop a strong-I slam for no gain or a loss. But that is real world too. It is the shortest path to the strongside A and B gaps so backside pursuit is useless; you are taking advantage of the strongside O-line double-team; you have a FB one step closer to the presumptive gap with a full head of steam; a good TE cuts the potential outside tackler. Any back worth salt falls forward for a yard on that play, generally gets a few.
Last edited Apr 3, 2009 10:02:23
About2 Break
offline
offline
The play is broken on an relatively even playing field 3.5 yards a carry avg at least! Here Pros AAA i OC them all the play can be contained somewhat but not stopped when set up right!
Look 576 out of 19 games on rushing attempts
Season totals
Rush Att 576 125 121 122 208 0
Our Game
Team Stats
Baton Rouge Mighty
TOTAL NET YARDS 304.5 255
TOTAL RUSHING YARDS 60.5 244
Rushes 30 69
Yards/Rush 2 3.5
TOTAL PASSING YARDS 244 11
Completions/Attempts 14/16 2/4
Yards/Pass 15.3 2.8
Times Sacked 2 2
Times Intercepted 0 0
PUNTS 0 1
Yards per Punt 0 31
PENALTIES 1 1
Penalty Yards 5 5
FUMBLES 0 0
Fumbles Lost 0 0
69 versus us and 576 for year how is the play not broken
that is 12% of their rushes for the year the damn play is broken and if used right cannot be stopped
Look 576 out of 19 games on rushing attempts
Season totals
Rush Att 576 125 121 122 208 0
Our Game
Team Stats
Baton Rouge Mighty
TOTAL NET YARDS 304.5 255
TOTAL RUSHING YARDS 60.5 244
Rushes 30 69
Yards/Rush 2 3.5
TOTAL PASSING YARDS 244 11
Completions/Attempts 14/16 2/4
Yards/Pass 15.3 2.8
Times Sacked 2 2
Times Intercepted 0 0
PUNTS 0 1
Yards per Punt 0 31
PENALTIES 1 1
Penalty Yards 5 5
FUMBLES 0 0
Fumbles Lost 0 0
69 versus us and 576 for year how is the play not broken
that is 12% of their rushes for the year the damn play is broken and if used right cannot be stopped
lbrlove
offline
offline
I am still not seeing how 3.5 yds/carry average on a specific play is that broken, especially in AAA/Pro leagues where the level differences converge. I already spelled out the logical and physical advantages of the play, real world. There is a reason it is very effective: the warfare principle of mass.
If it was something far in excess of rushing averages? Sure. But it is not. It is a play that has an extra marginal utility due to its efficient use of force. Are you really saying with a complete knowledge of football that you want a single back weakside rush, for instance, to have the same effectiveness as the premier power rushing play? That is a contortion of physics and reason.
I am still not buying. Bort will nerf the play because a simulation has a tough time taking into account the real world reasons you would not run it time after time: high injury potential from hard collisions; exhaustive energy use (both sides); defensive counter-measures that would naturally be employed in response that cannot be simmed.
EDIT: I would add also that 3.5 yds/carry may seem like a lot to a Baton Rouge that has the roster level differentials to hold most people to negative rushing yardage, but if you look at RL pro box scores, you will see that it is not very extraordinary at all, actually somewhat subpar.
If it was something far in excess of rushing averages? Sure. But it is not. It is a play that has an extra marginal utility due to its efficient use of force. Are you really saying with a complete knowledge of football that you want a single back weakside rush, for instance, to have the same effectiveness as the premier power rushing play? That is a contortion of physics and reason.
I am still not buying. Bort will nerf the play because a simulation has a tough time taking into account the real world reasons you would not run it time after time: high injury potential from hard collisions; exhaustive energy use (both sides); defensive counter-measures that would naturally be employed in response that cannot be simmed.
EDIT: I would add also that 3.5 yds/carry may seem like a lot to a Baton Rouge that has the roster level differentials to hold most people to negative rushing yardage, but if you look at RL pro box scores, you will see that it is not very extraordinary at all, actually somewhat subpar.
Last edited Apr 3, 2009 10:31:49
About2 Break
offline
offline
3.5 time 4 = 14 yards right that is why cause you can just walk down the field on 4 downs
Wow RL does not = GLB
Wow RL does not = GLB
PierreThomas
offline
offline
Originally posted by lbrlove
Originally posted by cigtyme
Strong I slam play cannot be stopped effectively and an all passing team ran 60+ plays and threw 4 and almost beat us field goal with 47 sec left
I respectfully disagree with your logic. A "passing team" that has a 60 blocking rating and was defensed for passing manages 3.7 yds/carry with their grinder and 4.7 with their speedster against a potent near-rival.
How is that a broken sim? I mean if they could not be stopped, they certainly would not have had numbers like that (decent real-world numbers, but not undue given the circumstances). Moreover, my team which sports an uneven and somewhat-weak run-blocking line could never manage yardage like that even with a high concentration of strong-I slam plays (like I ran today). If the sim was truly "broken", my team should be able to do so even with a line not built (or leveled) to do that, right?
This is nothing like, say, the WR Screen was in season 6, a truly unstoppable play.
Bottom line, I hear a lot of talk about this, but I think it is BS. Okay, so Bort says he made the strong-I slightly too strong, but he also made FB blocking obtuse, worthless more often than not. Next season he is going to nerf the play, but improve lead blocking, so I expect you will see (gasp!) more of the same in the balance.
The only place I can concede any logic is that it is very hard to stop a strong-I slam for no gain or a loss. But that is real world too. It is the shortest path to the strongside A and B gaps so backside pursuit is useless; you are taking advantage of the strongside O-line double-team; you have a FB one step closer to the presumptive gap with a full head of steam; a good TE cuts the potential outside tackler. Any back worth salt falls forward for a yard on that play, generally gets a few.
It is broken because if you can average 3 ypc regardless what the defense does it can't be stopped. 3 ypc doesn't sound like much but 3x4=12 when all you need is 10 to get a first down.
The strong i slam gets 3 ypc against a goal line defense with a strong shift and every single player blitzing, even the corners. I have plays set up that send the LOLB, MLB and SS through the exact hole the slam goes to and the RB just runs through them like they aren't there.
Check out this game to see what I am talking about.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=453839
88 runs, the same exact play, one of the best teams in the game stacked against it to try and stop it and they out of 88 runs they got 0 tackles for losses.
Originally posted by cigtyme
Strong I slam play cannot be stopped effectively and an all passing team ran 60+ plays and threw 4 and almost beat us field goal with 47 sec left
I respectfully disagree with your logic. A "passing team" that has a 60 blocking rating and was defensed for passing manages 3.7 yds/carry with their grinder and 4.7 with their speedster against a potent near-rival.
How is that a broken sim? I mean if they could not be stopped, they certainly would not have had numbers like that (decent real-world numbers, but not undue given the circumstances). Moreover, my team which sports an uneven and somewhat-weak run-blocking line could never manage yardage like that even with a high concentration of strong-I slam plays (like I ran today). If the sim was truly "broken", my team should be able to do so even with a line not built (or leveled) to do that, right?
This is nothing like, say, the WR Screen was in season 6, a truly unstoppable play.
Bottom line, I hear a lot of talk about this, but I think it is BS. Okay, so Bort says he made the strong-I slightly too strong, but he also made FB blocking obtuse, worthless more often than not. Next season he is going to nerf the play, but improve lead blocking, so I expect you will see (gasp!) more of the same in the balance.
The only place I can concede any logic is that it is very hard to stop a strong-I slam for no gain or a loss. But that is real world too. It is the shortest path to the strongside A and B gaps so backside pursuit is useless; you are taking advantage of the strongside O-line double-team; you have a FB one step closer to the presumptive gap with a full head of steam; a good TE cuts the potential outside tackler. Any back worth salt falls forward for a yard on that play, generally gets a few.
It is broken because if you can average 3 ypc regardless what the defense does it can't be stopped. 3 ypc doesn't sound like much but 3x4=12 when all you need is 10 to get a first down.
The strong i slam gets 3 ypc against a goal line defense with a strong shift and every single player blitzing, even the corners. I have plays set up that send the LOLB, MLB and SS through the exact hole the slam goes to and the RB just runs through them like they aren't there.
Check out this game to see what I am talking about.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=453839
88 runs, the same exact play, one of the best teams in the game stacked against it to try and stop it and they out of 88 runs they got 0 tackles for losses.
lbrlove
offline
offline
Originally posted by PierreThomas
Check out this game to see what I am talking about.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=453839
88 runs, the same exact play, one of the best teams in the game stacked against it to try and stop it and they out of 88 runs they got 0 tackles for losses.
I do not consider that necessary valid. I have not had time to go through the entire game, but I only see one defense being used to stop it, an unshifted 4-3-4 cover-1. It is impressive they got 4.1 per play, sure, but the other team ran for 9.4 per play. What were they doing the whole time? BTW, the Chocolate City team has 28 broken tackles. Could it be that San Francisco just sucks at tackling relatively speaking? In my book 28 mistackles=loss.
I agree it is ridiculous that somebody would run any play 88 times, but out of curiosity, why is the San Francisco team not doing it? I guess because they can get 9.4 yds/carry with a diverse attack. Moreover, I see no TFLs on either side, so I am guessing rushing is just too good league-wide.
Check out this game to see what I am talking about.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=453839
88 runs, the same exact play, one of the best teams in the game stacked against it to try and stop it and they out of 88 runs they got 0 tackles for losses.
I do not consider that necessary valid. I have not had time to go through the entire game, but I only see one defense being used to stop it, an unshifted 4-3-4 cover-1. It is impressive they got 4.1 per play, sure, but the other team ran for 9.4 per play. What were they doing the whole time? BTW, the Chocolate City team has 28 broken tackles. Could it be that San Francisco just sucks at tackling relatively speaking? In my book 28 mistackles=loss.
I agree it is ridiculous that somebody would run any play 88 times, but out of curiosity, why is the San Francisco team not doing it? I guess because they can get 9.4 yds/carry with a diverse attack. Moreover, I see no TFLs on either side, so I am guessing rushing is just too good league-wide.
lbrlove
offline
offline
Originally posted by cigtyme
Wow RL does not = GLB
No, but if you know anything about simulation, you generally model for effect.
Wow RL does not = GLB
No, but if you know anything about simulation, you generally model for effect.
You are not logged in. Please log in if you want to post a reply.
