Mostly running team probably won't see much Over Will if he does it right.
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Xars
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Originally posted by bhall43
Kinda a silly conversation. "Need" certain "stats" is just kinda a dumb representation of things.
Really all depends on playcalling. You run long developing plays and 45 PBT is gonna suck. You don't and you will still thrive. My run block oline produced the second best QB in the league a couple seasons back. My all pass block oline producing similar. It is what it is.
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
Kinda a silly conversation. "Need" certain "stats" is just kinda a dumb representation of things.
Really all depends on playcalling. You run long developing plays and 45 PBT is gonna suck. You don't and you will still thrive. My run block oline produced the second best QB in the league a couple seasons back. My all pass block oline producing similar. It is what it is.
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
Galactic Empire
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Originally posted by Xars
I know you like the idea of all this, but he's just not going to scramble all that well.
Your QB is going to be chased out of the pocket by a Speed RO on a Over Will Blitz call. Assuming the RT wins the LDE battle and you don't slide into a sack, your 65 Quickness/ 65 Speed QB is being chased by a 90 Quickness/ 90 Sprinting RO who is already at top speed.
You won't be successful. You might turn a 6 yard sack into a 3 yard sack, but on average that's it.
Look at how little YAC Belgarion gets. He's at 87 Quickness/ 83 Sprinting and can't get away from CBs who have equivalent or less Quickness and Sprinting than him. He has a skill value edge and can't get away from the tackle. Your QB is going to have a skill value deficit of 25 points and starting from a low value Footwork pocket slide.
And you think your QB is going to out scramble/get away from the 90/90 Speed RO's that are being built????
I have plays that will destroy Over Will Blitz.
I know you like the idea of all this, but he's just not going to scramble all that well.
Your QB is going to be chased out of the pocket by a Speed RO on a Over Will Blitz call. Assuming the RT wins the LDE battle and you don't slide into a sack, your 65 Quickness/ 65 Speed QB is being chased by a 90 Quickness/ 90 Sprinting RO who is already at top speed.
You won't be successful. You might turn a 6 yard sack into a 3 yard sack, but on average that's it.
Look at how little YAC Belgarion gets. He's at 87 Quickness/ 83 Sprinting and can't get away from CBs who have equivalent or less Quickness and Sprinting than him. He has a skill value edge and can't get away from the tackle. Your QB is going to have a skill value deficit of 25 points and starting from a low value Footwork pocket slide.
And you think your QB is going to out scramble/get away from the 90/90 Speed RO's that are being built????
I have plays that will destroy Over Will Blitz.
Xars
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I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Edited by Xars on Aug 22, 2015 08:13:50
FairForever
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Originally posted by Xars
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Problem with your build is you literally have no investment into sprinting / quickness. For sure, outside running becomes impossible. Some teams do only inside rushing/passing but personally I like the physicals. Could also take run blocking specialist to get a huge SP benefit.
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Problem with your build is you literally have no investment into sprinting / quickness. For sure, outside running becomes impossible. Some teams do only inside rushing/passing but personally I like the physicals. Could also take run blocking specialist to get a huge SP benefit.
bhall43
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Originally posted by Xars
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
I think you are focusing on a very small part of the game and making a mountain of a mole hill out of it. Granted I don't think it's going to work out the way he wants but it can certainly work.
fwiw, we hardly used 3 WR and never used 4 WR at that point so Over Will wasn't much of a concern regardless.
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
I think you are focusing on a very small part of the game and making a mountain of a mole hill out of it. Granted I don't think it's going to work out the way he wants but it can certainly work.
fwiw, we hardly used 3 WR and never used 4 WR at that point so Over Will wasn't much of a concern regardless.
Edited by bhall43 on Aug 22, 2015 09:07:32
Galactic Empire
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Originally posted by Xars
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Where is his quickness and speed? My guards have decent quickness and speed, along with lead block awareness. I like my guards to be athletic. If you are building a RG to defend against ROLB, then you want him to be quick. Also high Pass Block Tech won't be needed when blocking a ROLB because I'm pretty sure he doesn't have high pass rush abilities and all his SPs are invested in physicals.
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Where is his quickness and speed? My guards have decent quickness and speed, along with lead block awareness. I like my guards to be athletic. If you are building a RG to defend against ROLB, then you want him to be quick. Also high Pass Block Tech won't be needed when blocking a ROLB because I'm pretty sure he doesn't have high pass rush abilities and all his SPs are invested in physicals.
Edited by Galactic Empire on Aug 22, 2015 09:04:32
Galactic Empire
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Originally posted by Xars
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
Starscream will have 75 quickness, 89 speed, Silver First Step, Gold Head Fake, 74 Route Tech and 76 Route Elusiveness. He should get open fairly quickly.
If he doesn't have high Quickness Speedster WRs that can get open fast enough for the QB to recognize and release a throw, he's doomed.
And a couple of seasons back, people weren't building 90/90 Speed ROs and spamming Over Will against 3WR and 4WR sets.
Starscream will have 75 quickness, 89 speed, Silver First Step, Gold Head Fake, 74 Route Tech and 76 Route Elusiveness. He should get open fairly quickly.
bhall43
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PBT more comes from the RT against the DE. Because the ROLB sends your QB running opposite right into the DE.
Galactic Empire
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Originally posted by Xars
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Just looked. My RG will have 45 PBT and PBA but 67 quickness, 50 sprint and 45 footwork. That should be enough for him to slide over and block the ROLB and allow my scrambling QB to run right up the middle for a 10 yard gain.
I just built a combo/lean run OG using the following on GLB2scout:
http://www.glb2scout.com/virtualplayer.php?Code=a70dc40477bc2adceef4d2c90f47eb82
Early Bloomer, Technical Blocker, Strong Base
Str 8, Agil 10, Aware 8, Spd 1, Stam 1, Conf 7
RBT 87 with RBP 61 and RBA 40 (LBA 13)
PBT 65 with PBP 13 and PBA 50
Block Consist 61
Balance 70, Footwork 38, Conditioning 40 (use 3 caps), Toughness 50
Snap 66, Heart 30
My point is I don't see the need to go PBT of 45. Are you really getting that much better of a run blocker, when you can have PBT of 60-65 and have a quality run blocker? (Lowering PBT to 60 allows you to get up LBA.)
Just looked. My RG will have 45 PBT and PBA but 67 quickness, 50 sprint and 45 footwork. That should be enough for him to slide over and block the ROLB and allow my scrambling QB to run right up the middle for a 10 yard gain.
Edited by Galactic Empire on Aug 22, 2015 09:30:27
bhall43
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NE's oline guys have like 70-80 awareness and rarely step back to block that ROLB coming around the corner. Not sure exactly what triggers it against plays like Over Will but its mostly the HB who is your big blitz pick up guy.
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