Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Galithor
Watch my guys games. I don't lose the morale battle. The act of breaking a block causes morale damage.

Yeah, rookie DTs don't really count. You're gonna get put on the ground repeatedly later on if you don't have any hold ground.

Your ladder games (so consistently good competition at the top of sophomore) - your superstar DT has:

7 games (as of right now)
5 hurries
3 sacks
0 tackles
3 missed tackles
10 times panckaked
8 times rev pancake

My superstar sophomore DT (who has invested in hold ground) - in ladder games - my ladder games are against lower seasoned teams so my guess would be that your ladder games are against tougher competition than mine (in general)

7 games (as of right now)
5 hurries
1.5 sacks
4 Tackles
0 missed tackles
9 times pancaked
11 times rev pancake

Now - because I'm curious - looking at my other 2 DT's who are pretty high in hold ground:
71 Hold Ground:
7 games (as of right now)
0 hurries
0 sacks
5 tackles
0 missed tackles
3 times pancaked
9 times rev pancake

59 Hold Ground:
7 games (as of right now)
1 hurries
0 sacks
3 tackles (is that stat box right?)
3 missed tackles
5 times pancaked
13 times rev pancake

I say all of that with no point -- except that you might be right! Hold ground certainly isn't adding anything to my DT's stats!

I don't think Hold Ground will really help much stat-wise but as far as not being a liability in the run game, it's important. DTs get caked a lot more after rookie season.

edit: For clarification, all I think Hold Ground does as a DT is keep you from getting pancaked.

I mean, if you want proof that you don't really need Hold Ground just look at http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/27167. Guy gets sat down all the time but still puts up stats, I just think it helps the team to invest in it.

Originally posted by Motiak
Yeah, rookie DTs don't really count. You're gonna get put on the ground repeatedly later on if you don't have any hold ground.

My player is a sophomore. There's only this seasons stats so far because I built him at the very end of last season for Victorious Secret after Jampy's insistence that the power skills were primary skills in the trenches.

Next season will be more telling. If he's getting rev-caked like a madman, I'll admit defeat. But I'm betting that won't be the case. There's not many Guards or Centers out there that will be "winning" the blocking roll against a DT with 70+ BRB, Footwork, and silver Shed Block.

Also, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying you can't have power in your build. Just don't treat it like a primary skill. It's not. It's a support skill.

If you wanna build a pass rush specialist or run stuffing specialist, you'll max out both the tech and power skill for that role. My point is, if you want to build a player that can defend both the run and the pass, the technique skills are superior the power skills.

Originally posted by Motiak

edit: For clarification, all I think Hold Ground does as a DT is keep you from getting pancaked.

And it pancakes the O-Lineman which is huge.

Originally posted by Galithor
Also, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying you can't have power in your build. Just don't treat it like a primary skill. It's not. It's a support skill.

If you wanna build a pass rush specialist or run stuffing specialist, you'll max out both the tech and power skill for that role. My point is, if you want to build a player that can defend both the run and the pass, the technique skills are superior the power skills.

I agree with that 100%.

Originally posted by nortobc
And it pancakes the O-Lineman which is huge.



What's the ratio of how many plays those rev-cakes have allowed your DT to make? I don't find a whole lot of value in the rev-cake total. Sure, some rev-cakes happen at the start of a play and let you do something very cool. Those are the vast minority of rev-cakes though. That moral/energy damage? Unless it's letting you go beast-mode in the second half, also pretty irrelevant.

Originally posted by Motiak
I don't think Hold Ground will really help much stat-wise but as far as not being a liability in the run game, it's important. DTs get caked a lot more after rookie season.

edit: For clarification, all I think Hold Ground does as a DT is keep you from getting pancaked.

No. It keeps the Guard from pushing you seven yards up the field.

Run Block Power + Get Low = Hold Ground + Whatever that "Get Low Counter SA" is.

Originally posted by Time Trial
No. It keeps the Guard from pushing you seven yards up the field.

Run Block Power + Get Low = Hold Ground + Whatever that "Get Low Counter SA" is.

I'm banking on it being difficult to push someone you can't reliably keep engaged in a block.

Originally posted by Galithor
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/72264

Ignores Hold Ground. Most certainly not dead vs the run.

1. build is closed.

2. that guy has 14 sacks if i saw correctly.

That aint no damn run stuffer if he has 14 sacks.

Originally posted by Jampy2.0
1. build is closed.

2. that guy has 14 sacks if i saw correctly.

That aint no damn run stuffer if he has 14 sacks.



His point is that you can be effective against the run without hold ground and still focus on getting sacks.

I disagree, but you have missed the point.

Originally posted by Galithor
I'm banking on it being difficult to push someone you can't reliably keep engaged in a block.

I'm counting on you being forced backwards, making you pass more and more difficult balance checks until you are either on your ass or the HB is through the hole.

Originally posted by Time Trial
His point is that you can be effective against the run without hold ground and still focus on getting sacks.

I disagree, but you have missed the point.

Then you aren't as good as you could be,

and im not in the business of promoting users building halfstepped joes.