Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Xavori
Again...not counting on hurries to be disruptive. In fact, I don't care if the sim says "hurried" at all.

I care that the QB can't hold the ball long enough for the WR's to blow past my safeties. That's it. All I'm going for because it's all I can go for.

You don't care about hurrying the pass but you care about hurrying a pass? Ya that makes sense.

Originally posted by bhall43
You don't care about hurrying the pass but you care about hurrying a pass? Ya that makes sense.

I don't care about the sim calling a play "hurried" or any of the disruption that might occur by getting the QB inside a pass rusher's intimidation halo.

I do care very much about forcing the sekrit dump off roll that gets rid of the pass as soon as a pass rusher is within a step of the sack since that means I'm getting the best chance at underneath passes that I can actually hope to cover.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Not really... even my team the QB isn't "stat hurried" though I understand the difference between "making the QB throw early (not a stat)" and "hurried (a stat)".

Still, sending the wave like you did a couple of seasons back to stop the pass isn't as effective as it used to be. Sending a single extra man in order to get double on the "threat" receiver or getting an extra zone might be worthwhile, as I don't see the QB hurried that much better by the classic DAG-type blitzes.

As effective as it used to be? No, but it has its merits when done right. Especially in the case where it is almost a must to shut down some of the rush/pass teams.

Originally posted by Xavori
I don't care about the sim calling a play "hurried"

Why do you think I am saying that?

Originally posted by Time Trial
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/11590

5 sacks and 110 passing attempts with 16 hurries. And I'm a running team. I can't imagine a solid passing team getting pressured in the current sim.

Cleveland Brown's been hurried 8 times with 2 sacks in 311 passing attempts in the 5 games so far this season.

Then again Yukiko got sacked 19 times in one game. So there is that.

Originally posted by Xavori
I don't care about the sim calling a play "hurried" or any of the disruption that might occur by getting the QB inside a pass rusher's intimidation halo.

I do care very much about forcing the sekrit dump off roll that gets rid of the pass as soon as a pass rusher is within a step of the sack since that means I'm getting the best chance at underneath passes that I can actually hope to cover.

You also force the pass earlier in the play, which some of us have exploited by making the early route very dangerous. Given enough time, the QB throws a pass to my HB (for a drop), when hurried they are throwing the ball into that deep single coverage.

Originally posted by bhall43
Then again Yukiko got sacked 19 times in one game. So there is that.

Sieg is not stupid, and we've addressed the playcalling that made that possible

Originally posted by Time Trial
You also force the pass earlier in the play, which some of us have exploited by making the early route very dangerous. Given enough time, the QB throws a pass to my HB (for a drop), when hurried they are throwing the ball into that deep single coverage.

Or even better, rushing 6 causes the QB to hold the HB in to block, furthering increasing the risk of them electing to burn you deep, and have the time to do so from the extra block, while removing the useless HB dump off as an option.

Originally posted by Galithor
Or even better, rushing 6 causes the QB to hold the HB in to block, furthering increasing the risk of them electing to burn you deep, and have the time to do so from the extra block, while removing the useless HB dump off as an option.

Ya people wondered hard about why I was making the suggestion of allowing yourself to hold a blocker at will so difficult. Because holding in the HB just takes out the guy you absolutely don't want to be throwing to most of the time.

Originally posted by Xavori
Sieg is not stupid, and we've addressed the playcalling that made that possible

Looked more like an oline problem than anything. But ya I just watched that game and that would have been depressing to see MO do work like that.

Ya, but playing coverage too much leads to plays like this that are just all kinds of the coverage stupidity:

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63025/522810

With just one more guy, we prolly get the QB to throw before tick 40 which is the point where the CB fails their turn pretty spectacularly even though we're pushing Footwork across the board. On top of that, you'd think that under-over coverage would be great. And maybe it would if the CB had stayed closer to the WR, and maybe if the safety didn't go off doing I have no idea what (safety was in zone coverage and has over 70 in zone aware, and this happens a lot, so I'm skeptical about failed rolls there)

Contrast that with this:
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63025/521995

Same team. Same offensive playcall, but the ball comes out much earlier. The CB isn't lost yet so there's a chance on the play. The safety is still...uh...whatever. Wasn't a hurried pass, but it was a much better outcome.

Originally posted by Xavori
Ya, but playing coverage too much leads to plays like this that are just all kinds of the coverage stupidity:

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63025/522810

With just one more guy, we prolly get the QB to throw before tick 40 which is the point where the CB fails their turn pretty spectacularly even though we're pushing Footwork across the board. On top of that, you'd think that under-over coverage would be great. And maybe it would if the CB had stayed closer to the WR, and maybe if the safety didn't go off doing I have no idea what (safety was in zone coverage and has over 70 in zone aware, and this happens a lot, so I'm skeptical about failed rolls there)

Contrast that with this:
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63025/521995

Same team. Same offensive playcall, but the ball comes out much earlier. The CB isn't lost yet so there's a chance on the play. The safety is still...uh...whatever. Wasn't a hurried pass, but it was a much better outcome.


I would say that the problem isn't with the idea of the SA, it is the continuing problems with the coverage.

By the end of the season the top teams will have all figured out a way to shut this down.

I mean, it isn't like the throws are high%... you just need to connect on one of your three downs because they are all going for 15+ yards. The problem is, most of those throws seem to have a 35 to 55% completion %, which is the only reason that I'm still a running team first and a passing team as a "threat".