Warrior General Games

Originally posted by bhall43
Energy isn't going to have a super dramatic reach on your skills. At best it probably results in a 5% decrease in skills.

lolno

Originally posted by Time Trial
Yeah, but GLB was a lot more fun before we knew all of the answers.

That's because the base of the character building isn't fun, not because the fun was the shroud of mystery, in my opinion. GLB2 seems like the player building would still be fun enough even with more specifics. Already I rather suspect someone will make a builder (already has one?) where you bang in your desired end skills and it tells you what starting stats/traits to take, or something similar. If I want a certain amount of pass block technique and pass block awareness and sprinting and footwork and consistency and so forth...is Str 10 worth it if it means my speed is only 3, or would I be better off with 9 Str and 4 speed...blah blah. That won't take "the fun" out of character building, you'll still dream up a plan and then watch it execute - and it will be WAY more fun to execute the plan in GLB2.

But, overall, this is a personal opinion - look at pencil and paper RPGs. Sometimes the players get all the formulas laid out for them. Sometimes they want the person running the game to keep the inner workings secret. Some people like one way, some like another.

Originally posted by Corndog
lolno

Well I think I have already proven I tend to look at skills at lot deeper than what they really are with my thoughts on pass blocking.

Originally posted by NiborRis
That's because the base of the character building isn't fun, not because the fun was the shroud of mystery, in my opinion. GLB2 seems like the player building would still be fun enough even with more specifics. Already I rather suspect someone will make a builder (already has one?) where you bang in your desired end skills and it tells you what starting stats/traits to take, or something similar. If I want a certain amount of pass block technique and pass block awareness and sprinting and footwork and consistency and so forth...is Str 10 worth it if it means my speed is only 3, or would I be better off with 9 Str and 4 speed...blah blah. That won't take "the fun" out of character building, you'll still dream up a plan and then watch it execute - and it will be WAY more fun to execute the plan in GLB2.

But, overall, this is a personal opinion - look at pencil and paper RPGs. Sometimes the players get all the formulas laid out for them. Sometimes they want the person running the game to keep the inner workings secret. Some people like one way, some like another.

All you need to do is run the inspect element on your skill points and enter whatever number you want.

Originally posted by bhall43
All you need to do is run the inspect element on your skill points and enter whatever number you want.

Yeah, but he means a formula with the traits and attributes that lead to an end build.

We have done some work on that, but I'm afraid that Sid Meier has taken a huge chunk of my time and I wasn't able to contribute to the project the way I intended.

Originally posted by bhall43
All you need to do is run the inspect element on your skill points and enter whatever number you want.

I think you mean "All you need to do is build 75 different test build configurations, then inspect element on the skill points and put in the 209k points, and then build them up and see which one leaves you with the most skills that you care about"
The type of question it would be trying to answer is "do I want 10 Strength / 9 Agility or 9 Strength / 10 Agility or is it worth cutting another Speed and getting 10/10 Str/Agi or should I go 9/9 and 6 Awareness or..."

This data is all hidden, but derivable. So we can "pull back the curtain" and make more efficient builds. But it shouldn't "take the fun out of the game", because the player builder still has depth, and in a fun way. Once I set my starting attributes, and traits, I can still enjoy adding points to my player and make adjustments, because unlike GLB1, I can still add the points in any order I want. So just because I know the start point and the end point I still get to play around with making him the best when he's a rookie, and sophomore, and so forth. And I can make adjustments on the fly too; if I change my mind, within certain limits, my player is still fine.

And of course we still have to decide if we want 90 Pass Block Tech / 70 PB Awareness / 90 Pass Block Power or more like 80/80/95 or 80/60/70 with more points in toughness and heart and conditioning and footwork....

They did a good job breaking up the skills to keep builds pretty interesting. More skills was the right approach.

I'd still like to see something akin to a "play consistency" skill that takes the bottom out on rolls.

Say you have a 100 max roll on something. Let's say you also had 100 points in "play consistency". If you scored a 50 roll out of 100 on your play consistency, it would take the bottom out of your roll.

Example:

100 PC
100 Snap Reaction

You roll a 10/100 on your snap reaction roll. Bad luck.
You roll a 50/100 on your play consistency. Average roll.

That means that your Snap Reaction roll would be 32.5/100 instead. Why? A roll of 50/100 in Play Consistency took the bottom 25 out of your roll, essentially making the roll Rand(0 to 75) + 25 instead of Rand (0 to 100). So a 10/100 = 7.5/75, +25 = 32.5. Saves your investment in high skills from resulting in terrible rolls.

Of course, in order to save it by that much, you had to invest a ton of points into play consistency, which would mean that you wouldn't be able to take your other skills as high as could have. The result? You will have a player that renders far better RNG rolls compared to another player, but your "best" isn't as good as their "best", as they invested their play consistency points to increase the max in something else.

I've got a really good spreadsheet that I worked on to develop the concept.

how do you know that defensive consistency, receiving consistency, blocking consistency, passing consistency, punting consistency, kicking consistency don't already do that?

Originally posted by bhall43
Energy isn't going to have a super dramatic reach on your skills. At best it probably results in a 5% decrease in skills.

I very much doubt it being just 5%. at least as far as max speed is concerned.

Originally posted by Sean1995
I very much doubt it being just 5%. at least as far as max speed is concerned.

Good deduction considering Corndog already laughed at my proposal that it is that low a %.

higher than 5% and not 20%

at least we got something from him.

Originally posted by Sean1995
higher than 5% and not 20%

at least we got something from him.

technically what he said even if it was 20-30%
so it could be that high

Originally posted by Sean1995
higher than 5% and not 20%

at least we got something from him.

I didn't say that.

Originally posted by Corndog
I didn't say that.

Yeah, Corndog actually gave us the answer that it's 20-30%, then thought better of it and put up a disclaimer to try and hide it

Originally posted by NiborRis
That's because the base of the character building isn't fun, not because the fun was the shroud of mystery, in my opinion. GLB2 seems like the player building would still be fun enough even with more specifics. Already I rather suspect someone will make a builder (already has one?) where you bang in your desired end skills and it tells you what starting stats/traits to take, or something similar. If I want a certain amount of pass block technique and pass block awareness and sprinting and footwork and consistency and so forth...is Str 10 worth it if it means my speed is only 3, or would I be better off with 9 Str and 4 speed...blah blah. That won't take "the fun" out of character building, you'll still dream up a plan and then watch it execute - and it will be WAY more fun to execute the plan in GLB2.

I've got some work done on that. Got lazy before I started actually figuring out coefficients, though.