Warrior General Games

I stop all run plays just fine using zone.

Originally posted by Parab00n
All this talk about rushing and passing reminded me about how both are great against Zone defenses.

I still think the biggest problem with zone is the awareness check is too random (like I said, over 70 awareness to consistently pass it) and the defenders move to slowly in it. Although that could be footwork/quickness/sprinting related. I kept thinking my defenders wouldn't need as much invested in those stats because of zone, I'm pretty sure I was wrong

Originally posted by o The Boss x
I stop all run plays just fine using zone.

Guess you should have used it vs Erkner then...

Originally posted by Parab00n
All this talk about rushing and passing reminded me about how both are great against Zone defenses.

Well kinda. Zone is actually great for stopping the run from at least rookie to seasoned tier.

Didn't have faith in it then, but it works fine now.

Originally posted by TxSteve
so this new D logic is to nerf your 21-9 team because they are doing too well?

Gee, lame ass troll TxSteve has nailed it. I has been exposed.
Carry on GLB.

Originally posted by o The Boss x
Didn't have faith in it then, but it works fine now.

I guess we can add this to my earlier post where my Man based defenders ran Zone better than my Zone base ones, this is 4 teams now that have realized the same thing. The higher your Man Awareness the better your defenders react to the run while in Zone.

Originally posted by Parab00n
I'm hoping I can make a case with just a few replays, nothing conclusive I'm sure but maybe it'll convince Bort and Corndog to take a quick look.


http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/182319/2924425

In this play, you see the ROLB(18 ZA, 50 MA) read run at tick 24 and the FS(65ZA,50MA) read run at tick 24.5/25.

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/182319/2924432

Same ROLB reads it about tick 27, MLB tick 29/30, and FS about tick 30. Only the FS has an investment in ZA, all have at least 50 in MA.



Now for my Zone team, all in which range from 60-77ish ZA and nothing invested into MA.

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/169123/2635717

FS across the field reads it at 30/31, CB2 tick 40, LOLB is engaged in a block at tick 47 without reading run, SS reads run at 47.5

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/169123/2635926

CB2 and LOLB read it about tick 33(much better, but they backpedaled 5 yards down field and now they are ready to be engaged by blockers who have had time to line up perfectly) SS reads it at tick 37

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/169123/2635973

LOLB reads it about tick 35, CB2 about tick 56ish, and SS about tick 60

Not to say you are wrong here. But can you dig up either examples of DD running Cover 2 sink in comparison or DD3 running Cover 3? Because its tough to really gauge your argument with 2 completely separate plays. I wonder if the initial sink makes it harder for the players to make the actual read.

Also CB's post snap movement isn't right for C2 Sink. He is supposed to move backwards not sideways.

Originally posted by bhall43
Also CB's post snap movement isn't right for C2 Sink. He is supposed to move backwards not sideways.

Those outside 5th zones are pretty terrible. Always thought the fourth and third zones were much better looking.

Originally posted by bhall43
Not to say you are wrong here. But can you dig up either examples of DD running Cover 2 sink in comparison or DD3 running Cover 3? Because its tough to really gauge your argument with 2 completely separate plays. I wonder if the initial sink makes it harder for the players to make the actual read.

Didn't run any Cover 2 with DD, but tried the Cover 3 out with DD3. We have had multiple users try to make a zone defense and they all give up along the way. The answer can't be they have to have extremely high speed because users aren't going to want to waste Rookie - Pro just to see what they get at Vet. That's a lot of flex to risk when you can just run a man defense and know exactly what you are going to get.

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/171557/202341

Same thing, defenders closer to the ball take much longer to recognize run away from the ball. CB2 at the time had over 70 ZA.

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/169062/749305 - Under Cover 3

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/175681/1256508

In terms of pass defense. I think it is the only answer. Zone defense's only decent time was in GLB1 when defenders were given ridiculous speed bonus's when in zone both just for being in zone (Zone Specialist) and when the ball was in the air (Ball Hawk). I think we already have our Jackhammer effect in Zone Shark. Players just can't close in enough to make most of the coverages viable. You are left with just hoping blitz's rattle QB's quick enough that the QB makes an errant throw.

Don't mean to be negative --- but a few seasons back when zone got some tweaks --- and we he had Corndog with us full time...

Didn't he say "uh ya - this is probably as good as zone is going to get" or something? I took it to mean that he had improved it as much as he could but that there just wasn't anything to do based on the base code structure or something.

Originally posted by TxSteve
Don't mean to be negative --- but a few seasons back when zone got some tweaks --- and we he had Corndog with us full time...

Didn't he say "uh ya - this is probably as good as zone is going to get" or something? I took it to mean that he had improved it as much as he could but that there just wasn't anything to do based on the base code structure or something.

Yeah this was also right around the time he said end of game tactics were unfixable as well.

Maybe some zone specific traits to make physicals a bit easier? I guess the only way to prevent man players from also using it would be with a huge man awareness penalty.