Warrior General Games

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Top_5_nfl_quarterbacks_2008
http://moondogsports.com/2009/05/10/the-nfls-top-5-quarterbacks/
http://www.kidzworld.com/article/15044-top-five-nfl-quarterbacks
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/94179-the-current-top-five-quarterbacks-in-the-nfl-in-my-opinion

It's so hard to find a link that supports your case.

I was able to find some with Favre up there, some with Brady lower than 2, etc.

The fact that you think that Griffin is better than Kerry Rhodes shows me that either you don't know about half of the NFL or you're delusional, dude.

The real difference between Reed and Polamalu is... Reed's a much more electric player. Easily the best pass coverage safety in the league, which turns into INTs which turns into highlight reels. What you don't see is the mistakes that he makes. Remember the Holmes catch to beat Baltimore (their 2nd meeting) last season? That was Reed's guy. He got there about a half second late. Doesn't sound like a lot, but I mean he lost the game.

And no, I won't argue vehemently that Polamalu/Reed are equals. I know there are arguments to be made for both.

Delusional? I love it when someone attacks an opinion like this. You obviously have a man crush on Rhodes, good for you, not so much for him. But I think you would argue with anyone about anything. Seems the only posts you ever post are argumentative. Some kind of complex, I dont know. But my opinion stands, Griffin > Rhodes. Take it how you want, I really dont give a damn.

My entire point was Griffin IS one of the best in the league. You could only come up with one person out of 2 lists that you think I am wrong about him not being better than. Which was your question to me, and your response proves me correct, he is better than half of the ones you two posted.

Originally posted by head1
Delusional? I love it when someone attacks an opinion like this. You obviously have a man crush on Rhodes, good for you, not so much for him. But I think you would argue with anyone about anything. Seems the only posts you ever post are argumentative. Some kind of complex, I dont know. But my opinion stands, Griffin > Rhodes. Take it how you want, I really dont give a damn.

My entire point was Griffin IS one of the best in the league. You could only come up with one person out of 2 lists that you think I am wrong about him not being better than. Which was your question to me, and your response proves me correct, he is better than half of the ones you two posted.

Note that only homers have had real problems with my lists. Even those that disagreed with it did so softly.

I could have come up with more. Personally, I think all of them are (from both lists). Kerry Rhodes was the best from the list that you left off, so I figured he'd be the easiest sell.

Atogwe and Sanders are also clearly better than Griffin. Laron Landry beats Griffin at his own game. A better tackler, better in pass coverage, smarter, you name it. Griffin doesn't stand up to Dawkins either.

Unfortunately, stats mean almost nothing for safeties for two reasons. The first is that there just aren't stats that describe how well a safety does, and the second is that safeties are used so differently in different defenses.

I'm even agreeing with you that Griffin is one of the best safeties. I'm saying he's top 25%.

Anyways, we can just leave this debate at a disagreement. When it starts to become a personal issue is when I really just stop caring.

OJ Atogwe!
Went to high school with him, honestly the nicest guy you will ever meet. He was pretty amazing at basketball too.

Originally posted by Livestrong
OJ Atogwe!
Went to high school with him, honestly the nicest guy you will ever meet. He was pretty amazing at basketball too.

Freakish athlete... not surprised he's good at bball.

The Rams have a really good CB too, and if Tye Hill gets healthy, he could also be good. They quietly have a good secondary in place.

I'll make it easy for everyone to understand with regard to QB's:

1) Brady/Manning
2) Manning/Brady

The rest don't matter and please don't ever put Favre in the same sentence with Brady. Favre is the single most overrated QB to ever play in the NFL. The media has hyped and over hyped this guy for so long and all he does is consistently make bonehead mistakes during the playoffs to cost his teams games (ie..his last playoff pass for the Packers, INT).

Reed and Polamalu are more or less in the same category, the list should start with them and then go from there. How could you go wrong with either one of them, but for me it would have to be Reed first only because Soap says he is Electric and has obvious insider knowledge to know that Reed blew his coverage on that touchdown....

Originally posted by rjssob
I'll make it easy for everyone to understand with regard to QB's:

1) Brady/Manning
2) Manning/Brady

The rest don't matter and please don't ever put Favre in the same sentence with Brady. Favre is the single most overrated QB to ever play in the NFL. The media has hyped and over hyped this guy for so long and all he does is consistently make bonehead mistakes during the playoffs to cost his teams games (ie..his last playoff pass for the Packers, INT).

Reed and Polamalu are more or less in the same category, the list should start with them and then go from there. How could you go wrong with either one of them, but for me it would have to be Reed first only because Soap says he is Electric and has obvious insider knowledge to know that Reed blew his coverage on that touchdown....

I never said he blew coverage, I said he was late. Watch the replay. You'll see him push down Holmes after Holmes makes the tuck. I'm not saying he was supposed to be man on man with the Steelers' #1, but he was the closest guy to Holmes when Ben made the throw. They're different players... hell they even play different position. They're both the best at their respective position no doubt.

And I wouldn't argue with a T1Brady/Manning situation too much. I think Brady's '07 season stats were much more padded than Manning's 04 stats (running score up etc), and I think Peyton is assessed too much blame for postseason failures, eg 2005 vs Pittsburgh, their oline was lulz, and then even when they had the chance to tie, Vanderjagt made possibly the worst kick in recent NFL history.

So whatever Brady does is basically padded and what Manning does is anybody but his own fault? In all honesty, who really cares about regular season performances? The best players in the history of the NFL are remembered for what they did in crunch time, not the regular season. The Patriots will be the first to admit that the undefeated season was meaningless when they lost to the Giants. I'll take the guys that get the job done when the game is on the line, not the ones who have excuses built in for when they lose.

Originally posted by rjssob
So whatever Brady does is basically padded and what Manning does is anybody but his own fault? In all honesty, who really cares about regular season performances? The best players in the history of the NFL are remembered for what they did in crunch time, not the regular season. The Patriots will be the first to admit that the undefeated season was meaningless when they lost to the Giants. I'll take the guys that get the job done when the game is on the line, not the ones who have excuses built in for when they lose.

Whoa whoa whoa

I'm not saying that at all.

I'm saying that I think Manning's 04 season was a better season than Brady's 07 (regular season that is). Brady's included a 52-7 (or something) win over the Redskins and Brady playing in the final game. Manning didn't play much after they locked up the playoffs, and he had to score those points more than Brady.

Don't extrapolate too much.

Buuuuuuuuuuuut, if really all you count is how they do in the crunch time... Roethlisberger only has as many SB wins as he does playoff losses, and much of that Denver/Indy game was on his shoulders (I think he had over a 120 PR in those), and then he did what he had to vs Cards.

I'm not saying Ben's #2 cuz lulz, but you do have to take into account what they do over their entire career, not just the playoffs. I agree, playoffs count for much more, but also... there's the UH effect. Hawaii's oline/dline got destroyed by Georgia, yet Colt shouldered a bunch of the blame.

I said (in that post) that I wouldn't disagree with a Manning/Brady tie for 1st. I personally like what Manning does on his own more.

For the record, I would take take Brady and Roethlisberger over Manning in a must win playoff game...Valid point with the blowouts, I would contend that was only the first of all Brady's seasons that he actually had weapons to use in each and every game. I would hardly put Givens, Patten or Branch in the same category as Harrison, Wayne, Stokely, Clarke, Edge James and or Addai

Extrapolate....that sounds dirty!

I extrapolated all over this thread

Edit: Here is the happy medium that I agree on easily.

I think that Manning isn't a clutch QB. Not much at all. If we're talking about clutch QBs, I agree... it's not all that close. It's like that guy who's really just flat out amazing but then becomes ordinary under pressure.

Yeah baby! We agree....

Originally posted by rjssob
For the record, I would take take Brady and Roethlisberger over Manning in a must win playoff game...Valid point with the blowouts, I would contend that was only the first of all Brady's seasons that he actually had weapons to use in each and every game. I would hardly put Givens, Patten or Branch in the same category as Harrison, Wayne, Stokely, Clarke, Edge James and or Addai

Extrapolate....that sounds dirty!

excellent points /\

Top 3 QBs of all time:

1. Tom Brady
2. Joe Montana
3. Dan Marino
4. Woof!
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=560498

Originally posted by csull36
Top 3 QBs of all time:

1. Tom Brady
2. Joe Montana
3. Dan Marino
4. Woof!
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=560498


Wait

So your #3 QB is basically a previous generation Peyton Manning?

At least Manning won a SB...

Personally, I'm quite partial to Sammy Baugh.

Dan Fouts is my favorite "underappreciated" QB though. That Air Coryell thing...awesomeee. Plus, the Fouts/Winslow dynamic was also awesome.