Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Azure Dreams
Originally posted by Catullus 16
Originally posted by r87
Deathblade makes a great point.
Newer users of CPL may not like it (I am a newer user also btw), but the people who have been there for a year should really not have to change because some prissy fellow comes along demanding they act like choir boys.
it is a great point.
however, it's not out of the question for new users to expect that a league forum will behave according to the rules that everyone agreed to.
moreover, when a well-intentioned person happens to make an innocent post, i do feel empathy towards them when they're suddenly flamed by a dozen people for several pages. why wouldn't they get upset? why wouldn't they respond in kind? why wouldn't they start pointing to the rules, especially when (in their perception) the mods aren't upholding them?
this frequent scenario really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
Yes, you keep saying this. I'm still asking for proof. Because that doesn't happen NEARLY as much as people claim it does. It almost NEVER happens.

i'm stunned that you actually need proof for this. haven't i described almost every scenario where this occurs?

take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?

Originally posted by r87
EDIT: agree with asheme actually; they don't get 'shit on'. 15 ppl saying, 'you will gut by week 12' isn't being rude or harassing, that's straight up GLB competition talk o_O
Also completely accurate. CPL East (for a while, not so much anymore. No more Dryden ldo) was a fairly brutal conference, and to date has caused 358 teams to gut.

Keep in mind I support either an entire subforum for serious GG shit, or one (1) possibly stickied GG thread for everyone to use. I wouldn't want 12 new GG threads every other day.

Originally posted by r87
Originally posted by Vando

I have an idea.

How about we just agree not to shit on threads like GG threads and 'hi I am new to CPL' threads, because lets face it we can shit on the truly terrible posters when they post in other threads anyway.

This way, they can't argue they're being 'pushed out' because they're getting to keep the 2/3 tediously dull threads they'd have in any other league forum.

And yes, this is coming from the guy who started the 'fuck all GG threads everywhere forever' movement, I know. But I'd make the sacrifice if it meant the whiners would stfu.

Shitting on the new teams is like your guys tradition though. You can't sell out!

I mean, perhaps certain users who's username rhymes with bumcrunchable are a little coarse about it, but it is still amusing.

EDIT: agree with asheme actually; they don't get 'shit on'. 15 ppl saying, 'you will gut by week 12' isn't being rude or harassing, that's straight up GLB competition talk o_O

qfsasheme

Originally posted by Catullus 16
take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?
But that isn't what you're describing. FLgator and roctronic both provoked the attacks. What AD is talking about is doe-eyed dotballers wandering into the wrong part of the forest and getting Deliveranced.

Originally posted by Catullus 16
take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?

FLgators' first post in CPL was calling everyone childish and immature.

Rocktronic's first post was saying he is making a PF because the forum is shit.

Do they really expect a pleasant response?

Originally posted by Catullus 16
Originally posted by Azure Dreams

Originally posted by Catullus 16

Originally posted by r87

Deathblade makes a great point.
Newer users of CPL may not like it (I am a newer user also btw), but the people who have been there for a year should really not have to change because some prissy fellow comes along demanding they act like choir boys.
it is a great point.
however, it's not out of the question for new users to expect that a league forum will behave according to the rules that everyone agreed to.
moreover, when a well-intentioned person happens to make an innocent post, i do feel empathy towards them when they're suddenly flamed by a dozen people for several pages. why wouldn't they get upset? why wouldn't they respond in kind? why wouldn't they start pointing to the rules, especially when (in their perception) the mods aren't upholding them?
this frequent scenario really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
Yes, you keep saying this. I'm still asking for proof. Because that doesn't happen NEARLY as much as people claim it does. It almost NEVER happens.

i'm stunned that you actually need proof for this. haven't i described almost every scenario where this occurs?

take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?

they showed up because I suspect FLGator and co whined for fucking days about it, and that really annoys mod types.

Originally posted by Catullus 16
Originally posted by Azure Dreams

Originally posted by Catullus 16

Originally posted by r87

Deathblade makes a great point.
Newer users of CPL may not like it (I am a newer user also btw), but the people who have been there for a year should really not have to change because some prissy fellow comes along demanding they act like choir boys.
it is a great point.
however, it's not out of the question for new users to expect that a league forum will behave according to the rules that everyone agreed to.
moreover, when a well-intentioned person happens to make an innocent post, i do feel empathy towards them when they're suddenly flamed by a dozen people for several pages. why wouldn't they get upset? why wouldn't they respond in kind? why wouldn't they start pointing to the rules, especially when (in their perception) the mods aren't upholding them?
this frequent scenario really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
Yes, you keep saying this. I'm still asking for proof. Because that doesn't happen NEARLY as much as people claim it does. It almost NEVER happens.

i'm stunned that you actually need proof for this. haven't i described almost every scenario where this occurs?

take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?

Those arent' examples of what you described. Please go look at FLGators threads. He incited flames by being condescending and elitist in the first place. Claiming the moral highground and damning us sinners and our ways to hell. That isn't just coming in saying "hey what's up".... If he didn't mean it, it would be textbook brilliant trolling.

Originally posted by Asheme
Originally posted by Catullus 16

take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?
But that isn't what you're describing. FLgator and roctronic both provoked the attacks. What AD is talking about is doe-eyed dotballers wandering into the wrong part of the forest and getting Deliveranced.

you got a purrdy bear.

Catullus; you can't honestly believe that FLGator's thread was in any way innocent. It was a slap in the face to CPL, and to the mods who work the corner there. It's sole intent was to cause discord in CPL (and through this, get ppl banned and achieve his goal), as I cannot believe FLGator is so retarded as to do something like that without a purpose. He knew this, and quoted the rules. When the inevitable shit-storm followed, non-CPL mods were contacted (most likely on purpose).

Originally posted by Asheme
Originally posted by Catullus 16

the fact that other forums have similar problems doesn't mean that the CPL is thus perfect.

if the question is whether or not the CPL generally abides by the forum rules, you'd have to grant the the opposition's claim is pretty much correct. but the logical misstep that they make is assuming that that fact necessitates prompt action by the mods along the lines that they prefer. we obviously don't have enough mods to make every forum obey all the rules (even if our current collection of rules were even halfways enforceable).

so i think we can leave USPL and other forums out of it, other than to note that there's a serious disconnect between the forum rules and how the forums actually behave. the point remains that the CPL (more than any other forum that i'm aware of) seems to have a lot of these problems with great frequency. so we can either blame the complainers and say it's actually their fault for complaining... or we can find a structural solution to solve/prevent things.

i mean, wouldn't all of you rather be talking about something else right now? i fail to see how a compromise (no matter how cheesy) isn't a good thing here.
Well, I did say I'm fine with a GG forum. Or, as Vando proposed (also known as Vando Slayer of GG Threads), a moratorium on posting in new ppls"Hey, we're new" and "GG" threads.

Of course I don't think CPL is perfect or blameless or perfectly smooth-skinned with lavender sweat and taut sweater muffins, I just think hiding behind forum rules while other league forums blatantly break the same rules is ridiculous. The numerous mod raids, the obvious anti-CPL bias, CPL miscast as FFA pt.2, etc., is what bothers me.


my sweater muffins are as perky as they come.

Originally posted by r87
Catullus; you can't honestly believe that FLGator's thread was in any way innocent. It was a slap in the face to CPL, and to the mods who work the corner there. It's sole intent was to cause discord in CPL (and through this, get ppl banned and achieve his goal), as I cannot believe FLGator is so retarded as to do something like that without a purpose. He knew this, and quoted the rules. When the inevitable shit-storm followed, non-CPL mods were contacted (most likely on purpose).
I still sol at the fact he actually removed my quote from the OP.

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Catullus 16
it is a great point.
however, it's not out of the question for new users to expect that a league forum will behave according to the rules that everyone agreed to.
moreover, when a well-intentioned person happens to make an innocent post, i do feel empathy towards them when they're suddenly flamed by a dozen people for several pages. why wouldn't they get upset? why wouldn't they respond in kind? why wouldn't they start pointing to the rules, especially when (in their perception) the mods aren't upholding them?
this frequent scenario really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
Again...rules are upheld just as much as they are in other forums. The only one that might not be is personal attacks, which is purely subjective, and relies 100% on the individuals threshold. Some people get offended and pissed if someone calls them a turd. Other people, you can talk about fucking their cousin while simultaneously telling them to go fuck a goat...and they send another pic of their cousin in response.

Where do you put the personal attack line? Ban for anything that could be negative about a person? You will always have people that have a smaller threshold than other people, so unless you put it at the bare minimum, then someone will get offended at some point. And asking for it to be the bare minimum is pretty fucking ridiculous.

As for people getting insulted for many pages in their innocent thread...it is usually along the lines of "loldots", and "when will you gut?". It's usually not "I'm going to fuck your mom".

i agree that it's subjective... and it would be a fool's game to try and specify a line.

but can we agree that the main reason why the CPL seems more prone to this complaint is because of the sheer volume of those sorts of responses?

while it's easy for individual CPLers to point to the fact that they personally didn't say anything that far out of line, the perception for the "victim" is of the aggregate. this is why i mentioned earlier about the asymmetry that seems to be in play here.

i mean, let's be honest -- when the CPL decides to mock someone, they're not particularly gentle. frankly, this is one of CPL's strong suits... reducing people (especially assholes) into quivering mounds of impotent rage. well okay, that can be a good skill at times (especially when dealing with assholes), but you've got to admit that there have been some innocents that have gotten into your crosshairs... and when they get pissed off (who wouldn't?) that doesn't justify their maltreatment post hoc.

even people new to the internet can usually handle one opponent... but the CPL is a blitzkrieg that i'm not sure anyone can really handle.

Originally posted by Catullus 16
Originally posted by Azure Dreams

Originally posted by Catullus 16

Originally posted by r87

Deathblade makes a great point.
Newer users of CPL may not like it (I am a newer user also btw), but the people who have been there for a year should really not have to change because some prissy fellow comes along demanding they act like choir boys.
it is a great point.
however, it's not out of the question for new users to expect that a league forum will behave according to the rules that everyone agreed to.
moreover, when a well-intentioned person happens to make an innocent post, i do feel empathy towards them when they're suddenly flamed by a dozen people for several pages. why wouldn't they get upset? why wouldn't they respond in kind? why wouldn't they start pointing to the rules, especially when (in their perception) the mods aren't upholding them?
this frequent scenario really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
Yes, you keep saying this. I'm still asking for proof. Because that doesn't happen NEARLY as much as people claim it does. It almost NEVER happens.

i'm stunned that you actually need proof for this. haven't i described almost every scenario where this occurs?

take a look at even recent episodes like with FLgators (or whatever) or roctronic (or whatever). i don't know all the details, but do you honestly think that NVM and drksandman showed up because they had nothing better to do?

and they showed up because they head up the anti-CPL camp. they sit around with their swastikas waiting for anything they can try to justify as a green-light to invade with impunity and then claim they were just doing their jobs or shove the useless support form in our faces with questions.

Originally posted by Asheme
Originally posted by r87

Catullus; you can't honestly believe that FLGator's thread was in any way innocent. It was a slap in the face to CPL, and to the mods who work the corner there. It's sole intent was to cause discord in CPL (and through this, get ppl banned and achieve his goal), as I cannot believe FLGator is so retarded as to do something like that without a purpose. He knew this, and quoted the rules. When the inevitable shit-storm followed, non-CPL mods were contacted (most likely on purpose).
I still sol at the fact he actually removed my quote from the OP.

qfsol