Forum > FAQ's, Player Guides and Newbie Help > Circle Capping
lucifer_pdx
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Originally posted by jdbolick
No, the argument is over what to do early on.
Ah, that explains the difference in opinion.
Circle capping is not useful until the secondary attribute gets high enough that it can be capped. This is 31 at the minimum (if you have all 18 SP to spend), and can be 36 or higher depending on how high you want to take your primary attribute. If you want your primary to get to 100 at level 69 then it needs to be 88 at level 21. This corresponds to 85.5 at level 16. Using JD's method and 3 capping the primary at level 6 you can get there before your end-of-1st-season boosts. This will give you 18 SP and a secondary attribute of around 31-33.
This ignores the high value trains that start at 84. Whether you take advantage of this now to maximize EL or train another tertiary attribute is a personal decision. I don't know which method will make better dots.
After that you then build the secondary attribute. Circle capping comes in once the third attribute reaches 36-40. At this point you will preserve training value and maximize ALGs by capping this and then going back to putting all SPs into the secondary attribute. You will reach one more case of bad training value around 36-40. You can deal with this either by capping that other attribute as well or not training it for a while. With my offensive line I'm doing a mixture of both.
Circle capping doesn't become really worthwhile until the third season, going from levels 32 to 43. In those levels, assuming you've completed your primary and secondary attributes and have been quad training religiously, you'll have several attributes approaching regions of poor training value. Personally, I will be training attributes at the low 50s, and capping those only when necessary. My secondary attribute will be at the 5th cap at the start of the third season. I haven't completed this attribute, and will spend much of the third season building my secondary attribute. Since I just one-capped the third and fourth attributes I won't have to worry about capping them for quite a few more trains and can devote all my SPs to my secondary for now.
My QB is another matter entirely. Because of the 0.67 vs 0.50 base ALG I was able to complete his primary at 79 at level 13. His secondary will be complete the first level of his third season. His tertiary was one capped a while ago, and will be two capped the second level of his third season. His quarternary is approaching the critical point before the first cap now, and will be one capped the third level of his third season. Here we see circle capping at it's finest: 3 levels, 3 caps. After that is 3 more levels and four cap to the tertiary, and continue building until that attribute is finished in the fourth season. However, this illustrates what circle capping can accomplish when used correctly: 3 caps in 3 levels, and 5 caps in 11 levels in the third season, with 4 of those 5 caps in major attributes.
Your ALGs are also reduced to 56% of their original value, and 42% after level 37. Training becomes the main way to add effective value to your players, because most of your ALGs are due to your primary and secondary, attributes where you will never spend any more SP. The main reason circle capping is useful here is not to maximize ALGs, but to train an attribute to 90+% in one cap region and roll it to the next point in the next region up. By doing this training value becomes [(n+1)/n]*(base training value)*(quad)*(BL), where n is the cap region. If n>3 then you'll want to roll it at n+2 if possible, but we're talking about training at 68 and rolling at 78 where n=4 and (n+2)=6. I don't know how many tertiary attributes that applies to, but I don't imagine it's more than 2 after the primary and the secondary.
I tried circle capping in the first season, S25, with my very first player. I thought it would make me different and give me a leg up in dot building. All it did is make a bad dot. I retired him and started the QB and O-line I'm working with in S26. Circle capping in the first season is a BAD IDEA. Circle capping more than once or twice in the second season is also a BAD IDEA. Circle capping is necessary, but should be done out of necessity only. It's like sacrificing your queen in chess.
If you're wondering whether or not my methods are working, I just did a quick check at 2030 PST on January 30th. I am playing in Sophomore Competitive #2. Out of all the QBs in Sophomore Competitive #1 and #2 my QB has the highest SP value at 615.18 at level 31. The closest QB is at 608.18 at level 31. There are 3 QBs within 10 SP value of my QB that I was able to find, 1 at 608.18 and 2 at 606.18. My goal is to build the best QB in the game. So far, I am succeeding.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2532181
My O-line isn't bad either.
No, the argument is over what to do early on.
Ah, that explains the difference in opinion.
Circle capping is not useful until the secondary attribute gets high enough that it can be capped. This is 31 at the minimum (if you have all 18 SP to spend), and can be 36 or higher depending on how high you want to take your primary attribute. If you want your primary to get to 100 at level 69 then it needs to be 88 at level 21. This corresponds to 85.5 at level 16. Using JD's method and 3 capping the primary at level 6 you can get there before your end-of-1st-season boosts. This will give you 18 SP and a secondary attribute of around 31-33.
This ignores the high value trains that start at 84. Whether you take advantage of this now to maximize EL or train another tertiary attribute is a personal decision. I don't know which method will make better dots.
After that you then build the secondary attribute. Circle capping comes in once the third attribute reaches 36-40. At this point you will preserve training value and maximize ALGs by capping this and then going back to putting all SPs into the secondary attribute. You will reach one more case of bad training value around 36-40. You can deal with this either by capping that other attribute as well or not training it for a while. With my offensive line I'm doing a mixture of both.
Circle capping doesn't become really worthwhile until the third season, going from levels 32 to 43. In those levels, assuming you've completed your primary and secondary attributes and have been quad training religiously, you'll have several attributes approaching regions of poor training value. Personally, I will be training attributes at the low 50s, and capping those only when necessary. My secondary attribute will be at the 5th cap at the start of the third season. I haven't completed this attribute, and will spend much of the third season building my secondary attribute. Since I just one-capped the third and fourth attributes I won't have to worry about capping them for quite a few more trains and can devote all my SPs to my secondary for now.
My QB is another matter entirely. Because of the 0.67 vs 0.50 base ALG I was able to complete his primary at 79 at level 13. His secondary will be complete the first level of his third season. His tertiary was one capped a while ago, and will be two capped the second level of his third season. His quarternary is approaching the critical point before the first cap now, and will be one capped the third level of his third season. Here we see circle capping at it's finest: 3 levels, 3 caps. After that is 3 more levels and four cap to the tertiary, and continue building until that attribute is finished in the fourth season. However, this illustrates what circle capping can accomplish when used correctly: 3 caps in 3 levels, and 5 caps in 11 levels in the third season, with 4 of those 5 caps in major attributes.
Your ALGs are also reduced to 56% of their original value, and 42% after level 37. Training becomes the main way to add effective value to your players, because most of your ALGs are due to your primary and secondary, attributes where you will never spend any more SP. The main reason circle capping is useful here is not to maximize ALGs, but to train an attribute to 90+% in one cap region and roll it to the next point in the next region up. By doing this training value becomes [(n+1)/n]*(base training value)*(quad)*(BL), where n is the cap region. If n>3 then you'll want to roll it at n+2 if possible, but we're talking about training at 68 and rolling at 78 where n=4 and (n+2)=6. I don't know how many tertiary attributes that applies to, but I don't imagine it's more than 2 after the primary and the secondary.
I tried circle capping in the first season, S25, with my very first player. I thought it would make me different and give me a leg up in dot building. All it did is make a bad dot. I retired him and started the QB and O-line I'm working with in S26. Circle capping in the first season is a BAD IDEA. Circle capping more than once or twice in the second season is also a BAD IDEA. Circle capping is necessary, but should be done out of necessity only. It's like sacrificing your queen in chess.
If you're wondering whether or not my methods are working, I just did a quick check at 2030 PST on January 30th. I am playing in Sophomore Competitive #2. Out of all the QBs in Sophomore Competitive #1 and #2 my QB has the highest SP value at 615.18 at level 31. The closest QB is at 608.18 at level 31. There are 3 QBs within 10 SP value of my QB that I was able to find, 1 at 608.18 and 2 at 606.18. My goal is to build the best QB in the game. So far, I am succeeding.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2532181
My O-line isn't bad either.
Tajson
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Originally posted by lucifer_pdx
Ah, that explains the difference in opinion.
Circle capping is not useful until the secondary attribute gets high enough that it can be capped. This is 31 at the minimum (if you have all 18 SP to spend), and can be 36 or higher depending on how high you want to take your primary attribute. If you want your primary to get to 100 at level 69 then it needs to be 88 at level 21. This corresponds to 85.5 at level 16. Using JD's method and 3 capping the primary at level 6 you can get there before your end-of-1st-season boosts. This will give you 18 SP and a secondary attribute of around 31-33.
This ignores the high value trains that start at 84. Whether you take advantage of this now to maximize EL or train another tertiary attribute is a personal decision. I don't know which method will make better dots.
After that you then build the secondary attribute. Circle capping comes in once the third attribute reaches 36-40. At this point you will preserve training value and maximize ALGs by capping this and then going back to putting all SPs into the secondary attribute. You will reach one more case of bad training value around 36-40. You can deal with this either by capping that other attribute as well or not training it for a while. With my offensive line I'm doing a mixture of both.
Circle capping doesn't become really worthwhile until the third season, going from levels 32 to 43. In those levels, assuming you've completed your primary and secondary attributes and have been quad training religiously, you'll have several attributes approaching regions of poor training value. Personally, I will be training attributes at the low 50s, and capping those only when necessary. My secondary attribute will be at the 5th cap at the start of the third season. I haven't completed this attribute, and will spend much of the third season building my secondary attribute. Since I just one-capped the third and fourth attributes I won't have to worry about capping them for quite a few more trains and can devote all my SPs to my secondary for now.
My QB is another matter entirely. Because of the 0.67 vs 0.50 base ALG I was able to complete his primary at 79 at level 13. His secondary will be complete the first level of his third season. His tertiary was one capped a while ago, and will be two capped the second level of his third season. His quarternary is approaching the critical point before the first cap now, and will be one capped the third level of his third season. Here we see circle capping at it's finest: 3 levels, 3 caps. After that is 3 more levels and four cap to the tertiary, and continue building until that attribute is finished in the fourth season. However, this illustrates what circle capping can accomplish when used correctly: 3 caps in 3 levels, and 5 caps in 11 levels in the third season, with 4 of those 5 caps in major attributes.
Your ALGs are also reduced to 56% of their original value, and 42% after level 37. Training becomes the main way to add effective value to your players, because most of your ALGs are due to your primary and secondary, attributes where you will never spend any more SP. The main reason circle capping is useful here is not to maximize ALGs, but to train an attribute to 90+% in one cap region and roll it to the next point in the next region up. By doing this training value becomes [(n+1)/n]*(base training value)*(quad)*(BL), where n is the cap region. If n>3 then you'll want to roll it at n+2 if possible, but we're talking about training at 68 and rolling at 78 where n=4 and (n+2)=6. I don't know how many tertiary attributes that applies to, but I don't imagine it's more than 2 after the primary and the secondary.
I tried circle capping in the first season, S25, with my very first player. I thought it would make me different and give me a leg up in dot building. All it did is make a bad dot. I retired him and started the QB and O-line I'm working with in S26. Circle capping in the first season is a BAD IDEA. Circle capping more than once or twice in the second season is also a BAD IDEA. Circle capping is necessary, but should be done out of necessity only. It's like sacrificing your queen in chess.
If you're wondering whether or not my methods are working, I just did a quick check at 2030 PST on January 30th. I am playing in Sophomore Competitive #2. Out of all the QBs in Sophomore Competitive #1 and #2 my QB has the highest SP value at 615.18 at level 31. The closest QB is at 608.18 at level 31. There are 3 QBs within 10 SP value of my QB that I was able to find, 1 at 608.18 and 2 at 606.18. My goal is to build the best QB in the game. So far, I am succeeding.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2532181
My O-line isn't bad either.
Yes.
First Number is the cap level - Second number is the maximum cost of skill points
87.61 - 18
85.59 - 16
83.26 - 14
80.54 - 18
77.29 - 20
73.25 - 20
67.98 - 21
60.52 - 24
48.07 - ? = less than your highest cap before 87.61
It is really simple.
Edit: I like my whiskey and cigar by the 3-finger rule so retire if you are not +3 EL.
Ah, that explains the difference in opinion.
Circle capping is not useful until the secondary attribute gets high enough that it can be capped. This is 31 at the minimum (if you have all 18 SP to spend), and can be 36 or higher depending on how high you want to take your primary attribute. If you want your primary to get to 100 at level 69 then it needs to be 88 at level 21. This corresponds to 85.5 at level 16. Using JD's method and 3 capping the primary at level 6 you can get there before your end-of-1st-season boosts. This will give you 18 SP and a secondary attribute of around 31-33.
This ignores the high value trains that start at 84. Whether you take advantage of this now to maximize EL or train another tertiary attribute is a personal decision. I don't know which method will make better dots.
After that you then build the secondary attribute. Circle capping comes in once the third attribute reaches 36-40. At this point you will preserve training value and maximize ALGs by capping this and then going back to putting all SPs into the secondary attribute. You will reach one more case of bad training value around 36-40. You can deal with this either by capping that other attribute as well or not training it for a while. With my offensive line I'm doing a mixture of both.
Circle capping doesn't become really worthwhile until the third season, going from levels 32 to 43. In those levels, assuming you've completed your primary and secondary attributes and have been quad training religiously, you'll have several attributes approaching regions of poor training value. Personally, I will be training attributes at the low 50s, and capping those only when necessary. My secondary attribute will be at the 5th cap at the start of the third season. I haven't completed this attribute, and will spend much of the third season building my secondary attribute. Since I just one-capped the third and fourth attributes I won't have to worry about capping them for quite a few more trains and can devote all my SPs to my secondary for now.
My QB is another matter entirely. Because of the 0.67 vs 0.50 base ALG I was able to complete his primary at 79 at level 13. His secondary will be complete the first level of his third season. His tertiary was one capped a while ago, and will be two capped the second level of his third season. His quarternary is approaching the critical point before the first cap now, and will be one capped the third level of his third season. Here we see circle capping at it's finest: 3 levels, 3 caps. After that is 3 more levels and four cap to the tertiary, and continue building until that attribute is finished in the fourth season. However, this illustrates what circle capping can accomplish when used correctly: 3 caps in 3 levels, and 5 caps in 11 levels in the third season, with 4 of those 5 caps in major attributes.
Your ALGs are also reduced to 56% of their original value, and 42% after level 37. Training becomes the main way to add effective value to your players, because most of your ALGs are due to your primary and secondary, attributes where you will never spend any more SP. The main reason circle capping is useful here is not to maximize ALGs, but to train an attribute to 90+% in one cap region and roll it to the next point in the next region up. By doing this training value becomes [(n+1)/n]*(base training value)*(quad)*(BL), where n is the cap region. If n>3 then you'll want to roll it at n+2 if possible, but we're talking about training at 68 and rolling at 78 where n=4 and (n+2)=6. I don't know how many tertiary attributes that applies to, but I don't imagine it's more than 2 after the primary and the secondary.
I tried circle capping in the first season, S25, with my very first player. I thought it would make me different and give me a leg up in dot building. All it did is make a bad dot. I retired him and started the QB and O-line I'm working with in S26. Circle capping in the first season is a BAD IDEA. Circle capping more than once or twice in the second season is also a BAD IDEA. Circle capping is necessary, but should be done out of necessity only. It's like sacrificing your queen in chess.
If you're wondering whether or not my methods are working, I just did a quick check at 2030 PST on January 30th. I am playing in Sophomore Competitive #2. Out of all the QBs in Sophomore Competitive #1 and #2 my QB has the highest SP value at 615.18 at level 31. The closest QB is at 608.18 at level 31. There are 3 QBs within 10 SP value of my QB that I was able to find, 1 at 608.18 and 2 at 606.18. My goal is to build the best QB in the game. So far, I am succeeding.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2532181
My O-line isn't bad either.
Yes.
First Number is the cap level - Second number is the maximum cost of skill points
87.61 - 18
85.59 - 16
83.26 - 14
80.54 - 18
77.29 - 20
73.25 - 20
67.98 - 21
60.52 - 24
48.07 - ? = less than your highest cap before 87.61
It is really simple.
Edit: I like my whiskey and cigar by the 3-finger rule so retire if you are not +3 EL.
Edited by The unknown Grey Jedi on Jan 30, 2012 22:12:07
mandyross
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Originally posted by Behn
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Jaysus. I just read that post. Epic. Puts the rest of the stuff in this thread into perspective.
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Jaysus. I just read that post. Epic. Puts the rest of the stuff in this thread into perspective.
jdbolick
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Originally posted by Behn
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Signed Up: Aug 25, 2011 01:18:34 lol
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Signed Up: Aug 25, 2011 01:18:34 lol
Shrazkil
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Originally posted by Bane
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Dude still pen and papers his builds too, old school smarts.
lucifer_pdx is a true student of the game
Dude still pen and papers his builds too, old school smarts.
lucifer_pdx
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Mandyross, just keep that training guide there. I have it bookmarked.
https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots
Actually, I'm not using pen and paper. I'm not using anything. This is my distraction from vector potentials and Helmholtz decomposition. This has replaced counting powers of 2 to help me fall asleep at night.
I'm currently studying AEQ from tautology's post and some experimentation:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4796578&page=2
I learned early build strategy from one of Shrazkil's posts and some math:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4739161
Everything else is applying some concepts for build maximization.
https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots
Actually, I'm not using pen and paper. I'm not using anything. This is my distraction from vector potentials and Helmholtz decomposition. This has replaced counting powers of 2 to help me fall asleep at night.
I'm currently studying AEQ from tautology's post and some experimentation:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4796578&page=2
I learned early build strategy from one of Shrazkil's posts and some math:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4739161
Everything else is applying some concepts for build maximization.
Shrazkil
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offline
Originally posted by lucifer_pdx
Mandyross, just keep that training guide there. I have it bookmarked.
https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots
Actually, I'm not using pen and paper. I'm not using anything. This is my distraction from vector potentials and Helmholtz decomposition. This has replaced counting powers of 2 to help me fall asleep at night.
I'm currently studying AEQ from tautology's post and some experimentation:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4796578&page=2
I learned early build strategy from one of Shrazkil's posts and some math:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4739161
Everything else is applying some concepts for build maximization.
Ohh thought i read a post earlier about you jotting build stuff down for your dots, might have misenterpretted. Either way, smarts plus direction go a long way.
Mandyross, just keep that training guide there. I have it bookmarked.
https://sites.google.com/site/glbmandyross/training_hotspots
Actually, I'm not using pen and paper. I'm not using anything. This is my distraction from vector potentials and Helmholtz decomposition. This has replaced counting powers of 2 to help me fall asleep at night.
I'm currently studying AEQ from tautology's post and some experimentation:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4796578&page=2
I learned early build strategy from one of Shrazkil's posts and some math:
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4739161
Everything else is applying some concepts for build maximization.
Ohh thought i read a post earlier about you jotting build stuff down for your dots, might have misenterpretted. Either way, smarts plus direction go a long way.
Tajson
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offline
Originally posted by lucifer_pdx
maximization.
Most people would learn from studying so they know the word of the bird.
Well don't you know about the bird?
Well everybody knows that the bird is the word!
A-well-a bird bird, b-bird's the word
maximization.
Most people would learn from studying so they know the word of the bird.
Well don't you know about the bird?
Well everybody knows that the bird is the word!
A-well-a bird bird, b-bird's the word
lucifer_pdx
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offline
Originally posted by Shrazkil
Ohh thought i read a post earlier about you jotting build stuff down for your dots, might have misenterpretted. Either way, smarts plus direction go a long way.
I jotted a few things down, but I lost the envelope and used the napkin. Oh well.
Ohh thought i read a post earlier about you jotting build stuff down for your dots, might have misenterpretted. Either way, smarts plus direction go a long way.
I jotted a few things down, but I lost the envelope and used the napkin. Oh well.
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