Warrior General Games

You get access to the forums before you are ever asked to spend any money.

I don't think forced retirement is necessary for competition, you just have to have enough leagues to support the playerbase. Some leagues will be filled with the more experienced players and other will be filled with the less experienced players that way they play against fair competition. AND NOBODY HAS TO WORRY ABOUT ABOUT LOSING THEIR PRECIOUS PLAYER.

Again this threat is split up between two people. People who spent money and people who didn't. You haven't seen one person who's saying hey I spend money and I don't care. While this game is free to play, the reality is this site needs money to stay open. The Admin's are great and they do work hard so they deserve to make money from this. Like I said the scam thing is going to far but as a member who has spent money I never would have spent money knowing this. Its more of a feeling of being mislead to some degree.
I'm truly not trying to be a jerk here, I love this site and have a ton of fun on here. But I don't want to see this site shut down because they don't have enough money to run it. People can say whatever they want but the reality of this rule is they are going to loose a lot of money. Read some of the threads and how many people as a result of this aren't going to buy flex points anymore. Yeah its free but this site can't exist if everyone is playing for free.



Originally posted by ry31

If everyone's going to retire at some point, if they play long enough everyone is going to get a chance to be one of the top players.
That would be the point I think. Make it so everyone has a chance to be a top player. Not a bad goal for a game to have.

I agree to some degree but its killing competition. Its going to be like little league were everyone gets a change to play. Again from a money standpoint if your guys going to be a top player eventually, why spend the money on flex points to level up. Someone who spends money please back me up on this. Is it not the reason you spend money because you want your guys to be good.


Originally posted by ry31

I mean it would be like beating a RPG, you don't really want to start over and do it again.
Have you ever played an mmorpgs? They are all about doing the same things over and over and over and over and over...

And try a new position. Subtle change that will alter how you look at and play the game.

Most mmprpgs never really end, new things are usually created to do. Also even if you do every single thing you can in the game your character does die. He's still in the game and be god like all he wants. I spent money and have 15 players so the change your positions thing isn't going to be an exciting option. At this point I will play my guys to retirement and probable stop playing. I don't want to spend a year or so doing what I already did.

Originally posted by ry31

I'm not trying to be a baby but I probable won't buy another flex point until I need to extend my team. Based on this you killed all competition of anyone trying to be the best. I no longer see the point in trying to level up my guy now with flex points. He's going to get to the top at some point.
By all and anyone do you mean the players that joined now? Because without retirement all and anyone will not include anyone who joins after about a month from now. And if being competitive for the next 18 months is not a point, then is this the right game for you? And retirement encourages competition by giving more players the chance to compete.

What I mean is the people who paid are customers of this site are going to be hurt by this. Your changing this rule for new people who may play a week and quite. For guys that most likely won't spend money. This doesn't encourage competition at all, it your basically giving everyone a chance to be the best at some point where is the competition is that? There isn't any.

Originally posted by ry31

I also don't get why there's such a fear of people dominating. Looking again at all the people who have helped to make this site work why don't they desure to be the best since they were the onces who helped you first and really started it with you guys. I just think your making this rule for the hypthetical people, rather then the real people you already have.
For a marketing major you don't understand the concept of bringing in new clients. Why would a person who joins 6 months from now continue playing? He will never dominate or be competitive with 20,000 users. And why? Because he wasn't lucky enough to hear about it first. Seems to me like you just want a god uber pwnzer. The game would become very stale with all the top teams rarely changing. This idea allows new players a chance to thrive while breathing new life into the top leagues. What is the downside?

I do understand the need for new clients, its huge. Also not a marketing major just worked in marketing for Smith/Barney. Honestly I just kind of fell into, but that's not the point. But a bigger issue is keeping your clientele happy. Customer service is one of the most important aspects in any business. If you have a valued customer for years, he a bigger priory then finding new clients. While new customer are important for progression, keeping old ones is key in preventing regression.

Originally posted by ry31

I also don't see how new people wouldn't have fun. If you look at the top leagues most of the players are around 7. People just starting out aren't going to be playing those guys, so why is there the fear.
If its alright for the new players of the future to start from the bottom why is it not alright for you?

?... It is alright for me to start out at the bottom. I posted late last night so maybe I didn't explain myself right. Looking at the top leagues there's a lot of guys ranked 7 which my guys couldn't play with. So I play in a different league were guys are at the same level. If your starting out 6 months from now of course you couldn't compete with guys at level 60 or whatever. But you could compete with the new players that joined as well as the people who signed up a week or two earlier. Maybe I'm missing an important aspect of something. There wouldn't be god like players that dominate every game because they would be playing against other top players who had similar stats. Think of it like the NFC compared to college football and even area football. If an NFL player like LT played a college football game he would rush for 500 yards in a game and be unstoppable. But that wouldn't happen because he's an NFL player and plays in a better league against better competition Why can't vets of this site play in the big boy leagues with players of similar ranking, and the people who just started play in a lower league with players of similar ranking. I don't see why the two have to connect. If your just starting out you would play because you want to win now and develop your guy to the point where he can move up leagues and eventually play with the top guys. If all the stats maxed out at 99 players would hit a road block, which would allow lower level guys to eventually move up. If your looking at the top of the league full of 99 players its going to even out. I don't see how that would affect someone just starting out, since they would never play each other unless the player spent the time and in all likely hood money to have his player progress to the top level.

Originally posted by ry31

Those guys are going to keep getting better to the playing fields always going to remain level. With new people why not just put them in a new league which your going to have to create as more and more people come. Why not make level restrictions in different leagues.
But like you they want to be in the pro leagues. And under your proposed system, they never will be. So why play?
And if you fear not being a part of the top competition while you lvl a new guy, plan ahead. About halfway through the life of your first player, start your next generation. That way when the 1st dies, the next one is ready to step up to the plate.

They would play because its still a fun game. Honestly how important would it be to be in the top league. I bought my team in one of the lower leagues because the players were of similar level ranking. It doesn't really matter if your a top player or a guy starting out if you use a league/level type system. You might have a 99 ranked player but since your playing against 99 ranked players you wouldn't have a advantage. You could have a level 1 player that's more dominating in his league, then a 99 ranked guy would in his league.



Based off of the suggestion forums, people want this place to be as realistic as possible. So why stop short of retirement? As I said earlier, it will only cost you $1.26/player(glamour)/month. Toss in fp bonuses at ends of seasons, random gifts from bort/dd, and referrals that cost might evens shrink. That isn't a slap in the face in the least. And with the talk of additional bonuses or rewards to people who have retired players, how is that not showing some form of respect?
Its not showing respect because going back to the keeping your clients happy, your not doing this. People can think I'm a dick or that I suck but the truth is I love this site and want to see it does well. I want to the people that made this to make money and that's what it all comes down to. I think the retirement option is going to hurt this site financially. I spent about 30 bucks on here and honestly I don't really care about the money, its whatever. But from my point of view with the retirement thing I won't buy another one. Like I said in the last point I'm not being a bitter about this but I think its pointless for the most part. Why spend money to level up your player anymore? Like what would the rush be level him up. I think a large number of the people who do this now, do this because they want to catch up with people. Even looking at new players down the line, if guys are going to retire down the road it eliminates any urgency to level up your players quicker. Even looking at newer players it would be an incentive to spend money to level up because they could move up leagues quicker

Not trying to dismiss your worries, its just, in my own opinion, your worries aren't coinciding with what is good for the game/site but what is good for you. And nothing wrong with that.

I disagree with you 1000 percent here. My biggest worry is this site being shut down because they don't have enough money. If anyone can give me an answer how this move isn't going to hurt this site financially please tell me. Your killing the urgency factor by doing this. If the top guys ahead of me are going to retiring and I'm going to be the best player why spend the money to ever level up? I know this game is free and everyone that is supporting this move is playing for free because its going to help them out. Some of my guys are ranked at level 5 and was considering spending some money to get them up but its pointless to spend the money now. I

I also think you should tell players about this when they sign up or when they are spending money on flex points. Not everyone is going to look at the forums. While is a very strong word and just unfair to say. I'm sure everyone could understand were people are coming, you feel like you were mislead. One guy said he spent over 100 dollars, why would he spend that money outside of trying to have the best players in the league. While everyone can says hey this site is free what's the big deal. The big deal is this site isn't free and money is needed to improve the game and keep it running. I don't see how this move finically isn't going to take a huge hit.

Originally posted by ry31
Your killing the urgency factor by doing this. If the top guys ahead of me are going to retiring and I'm going to be the best player why spend the money to ever level up?

If retirement is after a certain number of seasons then you're not going to be the best player. The other people of the same "age" as your player who pay to boost their players are going to be better.

Agreed. If it is forced, you should get 100% FP back.

I have spent money, and will continue to spend money... and guess what? I think 70% return is amazing.

This is entertainment. Some others have hit on that fact already. I went a few weeks ago to play laser tag, it was for my entertainment. I spent $12 for about 20 minutes of fun and when I walked out of there they didn't give me $9 back. And I didn't expect it, I paid them to entertain me.

I put my money into a 401k, Mutual Funds, CD's and saving's accounts when I want a return on my investment. I bought a house, it's a serious investment, I expect a return on that investment when I decide to sell.

But in this game, I expect to pay for the right to own a team and create/level up players. Whether it's a forced retirement or if there is an age/declining skills scenario, I wouldn't have even expected a single flex point back in return, let alone 70% of them.

a HoF would be cool, but honestly I play some other dynasty sim games and the players just disappear eventually. Nobody has to remember them, I know that they were great for some time and it was fun while it lasted. Perhaps the way to deal with this would be to add a "Former Players" button on everyone's profile, it would list the players that they have managed and retired, as well as their career stats, but that player would be unplayable, just a name and numbers in a database.

I don't have a problem with the forced retirement at all. What I do have a problem with is the 30% loss. I think it would be a smarter business model to not have a retirement since players will want to keep on boosting their guys and keep on spending more money.Plus I think a 30% loss and a forced retirement will discourage more people from buying flex points. I know I am not going to be spending any money if that is the case and I was seriously considering buying $30-$50 worth of flex points per season. Another thing why retirement is bad is because even if people have level 80 players, they will still want to train more players thus spending more flex points instead of your level 80 player getting vanished and you have 70% of your flex points to just buy some more players, so you don't need to spend any more cash.

Originally posted by mrbismarck
Originally posted by ry31

Your killing the urgency factor by doing this. If the top guys ahead of me are going to retiring and I'm going to be the best player why spend the money to ever level up?

If retirement is after a certain number of seasons then you're not going to be the best player. The other people of the same "age" as your player who pay to boost their players are going to be better.





Being completely serious thats a really great point. Don't really have much of an arguement except I think people would be more willing to invent in a player rather then spend on a player. You may not be the best player but your going to have a good one. But there are different leagues and there should be more to come as time goes by. I don't see why theres an issue to give new players a far chance to be the top players in all of GLB. Just because your not a top ranked guy doesn't mean your player wouldn't do well at all. You could still be a top player in your league as a rookie. While a guy thats high leveled up might not do as well because hes playing guys ranked just as good. The only issue for a new player is it would take a while to be able to play in the top league.

I understand becoming attached to your players...

I have to ask you what you thought was going to happen with the flexpoints you bought? You powerlevel your guy 3 levels so he gets good off the bat, but in the end, players cant play forever, well they could, but it would end up everyone would have roughly the same build same gear and new players would have to suffer greatly. As would the repetition of seeing the same players play each other 30 seasons in a row.

How realistic do you want your mmo? My guess if either they would have ot start ton of "Noob" leagues for people to poach players off of, or people would just slowly amass enough flexpoints to have an entire team, and never have to spend another dime for anything other than team cost every season.

These guys are providing s service, one that should in theory keep you entertained with your guys for a year and a half easy. Should they not make some money for their troubles?

I assure you anyone worth their weight has spent countless hours debating how to run this. As far as I can tell their main options were:

No one retires ever. You end up with about 5 billion leagues where people have to suffer on crappy teams in a crappy league until they level up enough to compete in the pro leagues.

People retire/get injured/etc. You have a fairly balanced system where people cant completely benefit for starting out the gates on day 1 with a uber squad of doom. You end up taking the good with the bad and you slowly rotate out your old favorites and create new ones. If its 100% return, the only money these guys can possibly make is off teams. And even if they have 2000 teams... that would be 8000 every 40 days, if all of them are full. Now I am sure they wont have a problem and they might fill it. but how much are server sand the cost of several coders working everyday to fix problems. And the website guy who makes sure it's all good. They need a decent revenue to make this site work.

When the people off Alpha say: just chop out the 10 or 20 bucks and enjoy yourself... it means If you blow 20 bucks for Devil may cry, how much enjoyment are you getting? a month or two of playing til you clear it, maybe go back through get all the specials and do everything. Will it take you 2 years to be done or would you then have it collect dust on your DVD case? You could in theory, for free, have years of entertainment. And if you cough up the 4 bucks every 40 days for your team and have a 1 time cost of 10 or 20 bucks to make a few players and dont level them up with flexpoints, you can have a lot of fun on the cheap. This game is fun, it's fun enough to support the people making it.

Just try to remember that when you get upset about them trying to earn a buck or two.

you get a percentage back for a retired player

What they should do is allow us to retire any time after a certain point...

have leveling up stop after a certain point (like, say, season 6 your player stops leveling up entirely)... then a few seasons later your player starts declining slowly... then faster...

and make ways that you can slow down the decline some (see: Jerry Rice), but not stop it entirely...

and then have a certain "wall" they hit where they retire no matter what...

Honestly, though, I don't see why they give us any points back at all... all that means is they'll stop making $$ after 10 seasons or so when peopel start retiring...

Originally posted by Semaj
If its 100% return, the only money these guys can possibly make is off teams. And even if they have 2000 teams... that would be 8000 every 40 days, if all of them are full. Now I am sure they wont have a problem and they might fill it. but how much are server sand the cost of several coders working everyday to fix problems. And the website guy who makes sure it's all good. They need a decent revenue to make this site work.So they do not make any money off of the original flex point purchase? What you seem to be forgetting is that once a player buys flex points there is no way to get that money back. Plus, every time someone buys flex points they are essentially giving the owners free cash to help with the servers. It's not like everyone is just going to buy one player in season one and play 10 years until they retire. People are going to keep on spending flex points to buy and maintain more teams and to buy and maintain more players.
I think if people are losing more money to get better at something that will just disappear in a year and a half, the "entertainment value" wouldn't be enough to keep on spending cash.

Also another solution to this problem would be to raise the boosting price the higher your player gets. So instead of Paying 300 flex points to boost a QB by 1000xp, make them have to double it. So after like 20 levels it will cost 600 flex for 1000xp, after 40 levels it would be 900 flex, after 60 levels it would be 1200 flex and after 80 levels it would be 1500 flex. That way it will force more people to spend more the higher you go up.

Originally posted by NiceRaQ
Also another solution to this problem would be to raise the boosting price the higher your player gets. So instead of Paying 300 flex points to boost a QB by 1000xp, make them have to double it. So after like 20 levels it will cost 600 flex for 1000xp, after 40 levels it would be 900 flex, after 60 levels it would be 1200 flex and after 80 levels it would be 1500 flex. That way it will force more people to spend more the higher you go up.

aren't we talking about them giving all those flex points back at the end of a player's career???

If so... how would that help them make more money??

why force retirement? look at the NFL. Brett Favre, Vinny Testeverde, Mortan Anderson, Jeff Feagles. there are tons of ancient guys in the NFL. i just think players should lose stats after a while and the older they get the faster they lose stats. if a player is forced retirement i think 100% of flex points should be returned to the user.