Warrior General Games

Originally posted by bhall43
Isn't that just zero edge blitz?

If the pathing wasn't fixed, Yeah. It would be the same.

The problem with the play is that you got 8-9 guys stacked so close together and have the olbs blitzing to the outside which closes off the middle and does a decent outside run contain on top of a very quick pass rush. Normally in the nfl a play like this would get blown up by a screen or a dump pass to the hb or fb but those plays don't work in glb unless you dump a decent amount of points into receiving skills which cripple the hbs ability to run. You could fix this play without even touching it by increasing hb and FBs base catching in the open field. Right now my hb could be sitting wide open on a little dump route and drop it 9/10 times. If we reduce it to like 2/10 hb dump passes would be viable and negate some of these hyper aggressive blitz plays like Zeb or mid overload. Though to balance this out you'd have to buff coverage defenses a bit (for example if a player has 2 defenders within like 2-3 yards the ball is x harder to catch) because you see wrs consistently making catches double covered where normally that he should have a very small chance to catch.i have even seen a catch in triple coverage.

Increasing the backs base catching in open field and buffing coverage is only going to make screens the most used part of this game because

A) Coverage of screens using any sort of man base is awful. So it will be the best way to move the ball against all coverages that aren't zone based.

and

B) Completion % into double coverage is not nearly as good as you are making it sound. In fact take away the corner stuff that creates that separation for WR3/4/TE and you won't see many people passing over 30%.

Making the OLBs blitz inside is changing the sim to do something it's not designed to do. That's why Corndog keeps mentioning it'd require waypoints. They simply blitz. Because they're lined up outside the DEs, they blitz around the outside.

I still think stacking the OLBs on the DEs and the MLB/FS on the DTs is the right solution. When evasive DEs do their thing where they go wide against the OT, the LBs will naturally blitz into the B gap the OTs are vacating. This will provide an opportunity for the unused G to pick up one of them after the other G and C block the 2 DTs. Leaving the potential for a HB to pick up the other if the awareness checks are made. It'd also increase the opportunity for builds with Wide Load to impact the unblocked blitzer. If the DEs take a power rush, the LBs may go inside or outside, and will get delayed more by the pathing around the DE/OT blocking engagment that will be required.

Since all the LBs/FS in the box will be more pinched, it should be even dirtier as an inside run defense, eliminating A and B gap plays even better, but be increasingly vulnerable to the Off-tackle and pitch plays. Just moving the MLB/SS in slightly more to fully stacked on the DTs should slightly decrease their ability to get to pitches. You'd have the possibility of the OT effectively eliminating both the DE and OLB on off-tackle plays, allowing the FB to sometimes move on to pick up one of the unblocked MLB/FS.

So should I be using this blitz? Because I'm currently not.

Heck, even the graphic shows them stacked on the DEs, so you wouldn't have to change the graphic at all. It also shows the FS and MLB directly stacked on the DTs and slightly deeper than they are in the sim, another thing that I think would be a good deal. Back them both up an extra yard, and pinch them to be lined up over the DTs. Then put the OLBs at the current MLB/FS depth, but stacked over the DEs. Tada! You have the play match the play-art!

Originally posted by bhall43
Increasing the backs base catching in open field and buffing coverage is only going to make screens the most used part of this game because

A) Coverage of screens using any sort of man base is awful. So it will be the best way to move the ball against all coverages that aren't zone based.

and

B) Completion % into double coverage is not nearly as good as you are making it sound. In fact take away the corner stuff that creates that separation for WR3/4/TE and you won't see many people passing over 30%.

Leaving backs with lead hands isnt a solution either. Like i said currently backs are useless unless you build them as receiving backs, even nfl lineman can catch more open throws their way. Leaving backs useless is exactly why blitzes like mid overload thrive. Also I am sure plenty of people would disagree. Heres a great example http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/72048/2594192 literally 3 defenders able to make a play on this by tick 66 and none of them make a play and the wr makes a diving catch. This is a dramatic example but I can link more double coverage plays where the wr makes an easy catch.

edit: obvious broken coverage on man base is obvious http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/72048/2594719 (follow the strong safety)
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/72824/2791675 2 defenders in the area still makes the catch
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/72824/2791712 two defenders though for some reason cb3 doesnt even look for the ball

Originally posted by USC_Trojans
Leaving backs with lead hands isnt a solution either. Like i said currently backs are useless unless you build them as receiving backs, even nfl lineman can catch more open throws their way. Leaving backs useless is exactly why blitzes like mid overload thrive. Also I am sure plenty of people would disagree. Heres a great example http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/72048/2594192 literally 3 defenders able to make a play on this by tick 66 and none of them make a play and the wr makes a diving catch. This is a dramatic example but I can link more double coverage plays where the wr makes an easy catch.

My backs have pretty minimal investments in receiving skills and do an ok job. Sure I wouldn't shell screens at them all day but they do alright in the receiving game. I understand that screens should be better in terms of making the catch but currently they are huge problems defending without the use of zone defense as they run outer defenders into the middle of the field where all the blockers are. Screens are a hard balance. One in which GLB1 constantly had problems with both making them impossible to stop and then making them useless, and then back to being hard to stop again.

As far as the 3 defenders replay. That's a freak play. For every example you show me of a guy making a catch in that situation I could show you tons more where he doesn't.

Originally posted by bhall43
My backs have pretty minimal investments in receiving skills and do an ok job. Sure I wouldn't shell screens at them all day but they do alright in the receiving game. I understand that screens should be better in terms of making the catch but currently they are huge problems defending without the use of zone defense as they run outer defenders into the middle of the field where all the blockers are. Screens are a hard balance. One in which GLB1 constantly had problems with both making them impossible to stop and then making them useless, and then back to being hard to stop again.

As far as the 3 defenders replay. That's a freak play. For every example you show me of a guy making a catch in that situation I could show you tons more where he doesn't.

even if not the screens at least the little drag routes should be an easy catch when the hb has no one near him (combined 16 targets 6 drops and 8 receptions) i mean those drag routes are suppose to be super high completion pass normally in the NFL. also I added a few plays but I feel this gets the issue I have with double coverage. Though mane base coverage needs a serious look at it

Some of those plays get better with deflection ability and sa's as well. That 3rd play wasn't really well covered. The one cb missed the int and cb3 got caught up by the other cb when following the wr.

In terms of backs catching passes. My guy on funday has caught 90+ this season and my rusty guy has 41 caught. Like I said very minimal investment in catching.

Actually Wolf of Wall Street has been pretty solid considering his build imo.

94/170 and 36 drops. Those drops being a pretty easy fix with build but I am unsure I want him catching a lot of those passes against MO right now.

Originally posted by bhall43
Some of those plays get better with deflection ability and sa's as well. That 3rd play wasn't really well covered. The one cb missed the int and cb3 got caught up by the other cb when following the wr.

That was my point with the 3rd play, cb 3 is our best cb has great awareness and he didn't even look, it maybe a bad awareness roll but still frustrating

Originally posted by USC_Trojans
That was my point with the 3rd play, cb 3 is our best cb has great awareness and he didn't even look, it maybe a bad awareness roll but still frustrating

Why would you expect him to look? He is covering WR3.

Way too many alternative options for this play. We don't need to change the way RB's catch the ball and the way QB's handle being sacked, just change the play that is the problem. More problems will arise from changing too much. Just make the play what it is, which is MIDDLE OVERLOAD. Have the OLB's line up more towards the middle. It will take them longer to get to the QB, which will help with the quick sacks, but it will still be a good play for stuffing inside runs.

It's very simple. Based on the way the defenders line up and act on this play it is hard to beat, particularly at low levels. No single play should be the best pass rush and the best inside run stuffing play. No need to change the entire game around a play that is just designed incorrectly.

Originally posted by Corndog
I don't have anything in mind, but there has to be some reason that it's so strong. Obviously the play design isn't unstoppable or they would just spam it non-stop in the NFL.

The only thing I can think of at the moment is a hot read system, but I'm not entirely sold on that.

This is not the NFL. The play design IS too strong. There are many elements to the NFL game that aren't in this game and it is quite unfair to compare it to the NFL. Pretty much everyone agrees that this play needs tweaking, not the entire sim.