Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Deathblade
Originally posted by Deathblade

To be honest, I already believe it helps with fakes.

As for breaking tackles...I'm not sure.

I've also suggested making fakes, or similar happen when an HB cuts or changes direction...which would simulate the whole "running to make it hard to tackle", since it would fake out players, or make them lose balance, or something to make changing direction worthwhile.

Yeah, this is pmuch what I mean.

Originally posted by David Stern
Originally posted by jrry32

I think we are all in agreement that vision and agility should be much more important and that pathing needs to be improved.(doing so would help make them more important)

Yeah, definitely. I mean, I don't even have any high vision/agility hb guys on any of the teams I over see any more. Like literally they have all been weeded out due to being terrible.


Originally posted by jrry32

Emmit Smith's best attributes as a runner was Larry Allen

FYP

You are so wrong on the 2nd part.

Originally posted by blln4lyf
Originally posted by Deathblade

Originally posted by Deathblade


To be honest, I already believe it helps with fakes.

As for breaking tackles...I'm not sure.

I've also suggested making fakes, or similar happen when an HB cuts or changes direction...which would simulate the whole "running to make it hard to tackle", since it would fake out players, or make them lose balance, or something to make changing direction worthwhile.

Yeah, this is pmuch what I mean.

Same here and that's what Bolick fought so hard to prevent.

Originally posted by Deathblade


Really, I think there is something wrong with Bort's vector calculation. I mean, if there's 2 defenders coming at you from two directions...what kind of calculation would make you alternate 90 degree angles between them? The logical "angle" would be calculating their vectors and running between it, rather than alternating between running straight at defender A, and straight at defender B.
This too.

It could also be the rate that defenders can change direction that throws off elusive rushing.

Like, if a defender is going...
----------->

The HB thinks "hmm, I can go
<-----------

But then the defender just instantly changes direction, and goes
<------------

Then the HB thinks "fuck, I have to change direction again
------------->

Though really, he shouldn't be calculating which way the defenders are moving, but rather, how fast they can get to him. Which would explain the zigzag...he reads one way as "safe" because the defender is running the other way or something...when in actuality, he should just be running towards the slowest defender, but still at a distance far enough to not get tackled.

Like...

A--->x<------------B

He should aim for the X, assuming player A is much slower than player B, rather than trying...

A---><------------Bx

Which results in an alternation between....
A---><------------Bx
and
xA--->B------------>

Originally posted by tautology
Originally posted by tautology


The alternating is a "dance" that looks to me like an oscillator...the defenders engage in it too. They form some sort of closed loop system with no escape possible.

If there is only one defender there is no problem, but two defenders creates a closed loop.



Actually the sideline can act like a defender for this purpose as well

Yep. It sure can. Also thinking of the sideline as a defender which dots currently run to - and then bounce off of and back into the defender...

When looking at pathing... The path of least resistance... Especially for some of the 'weaklings' no Strength or strengthless builds maybe the out of bounds should not be viewed as high of a determent? Especially if a big hitting SS or LB is veering down on the Elusive HB?

How many times have you seen Reggie Bush duck out of bounds and avoid contact?

That should be factored into the 'risk' of making an Elusive that has no Strength.

Originally posted by Deathblade
It could also be the rate that defenders can change direction that throws off elusive rushing.

Like, if a defender is going...
----------->

The HB thinks "hmm, I can go
<-----------

But then the defender just instantly changes direction, and goes
<------------

Then the HB thinks "fuck, I have to change direction again
------------->

Though really, he shouldn't be calculating which way the defenders are moving, but rather, how fast they can get to him. Which would explain the zigzag...he reads one way as "safe" because the defender is running the other way or something...when in actuality, he should just be running towards the slowest defender, but still at a distance far enough to not get tackled.

Like...

A--->x<------------B

He should aim for the X, assuming player A is much slower than player B, rather than trying...

A---><------------Bx

Which results in an alternation between....
A---><------------Bx
and
xA--->B------------>



Best post ever. Fucking zig zags.

Deathblade, I think you are hitting the nail on the hammer with your thoughts. Did you suggest this all to Bort?

Originally posted by blln4lyf
Deathblade, I think you are hitting the nail on the hammer with your thoughts. Did you suggest this all to Bort?

Agreed he is very warm. This definitely reminds me of the speed script, 'x-factor', zero weight debates.

Originally posted by Deathblade
It could also be the rate that defenders can change direction that throws off elusive rushing.

Like, if a defender is going...
----------->

The HB thinks "hmm, I can go
<-----------

But then the defender just instantly changes direction, and goes
<------------

Then the HB thinks "fuck, I have to change direction again
------------->

Though really, he shouldn't be calculating which way the defenders are moving, but rather, how fast they can get to him. Which would explain the zigzag...he reads one way as "safe" because the defender is running the other way or something...when in actuality, he should just be running towards the slowest defender, but still at a distance far enough to not get tackled.

Like...

A--->x<------------B

He should aim for the X, assuming player A is much slower than player B, rather than trying...

A---><------------Bx

Which results in an alternation between....
A---><------------Bx
and
xA--->B------------>



Pretty much, yes.

The HB should be able to pick a strategy rather than a route:

Cut between them, go around them, juke once right and go left...whatever.


But he should have at least some level of judgment as to how the defender *can* move to intercept and be able to anticipate that.

ideally, he can calculate a point towards which the defender cannot reach, if he is good enough.

deathblade for mod imo

Originally posted by tautology


ideally, he can calculate a point towards which the defender cannot reach, if he is good enough.

= +++Vision?

Originally posted by Deathblade
It's not that vision doesn't have an effect, or that it's scaled too far out (to accommodate 150 vision players)...it's that the "best" path...isn't.

Otherwise, if vision was scaled too far, or had no effect...it wouldn't actually hurt you. However, it does actually hurt you when you go up to 70+. You get dancing that you don't with low vision.

Really, I think there is something wrong with Bort's vector calculation. I mean, if there's 2 defenders coming at you from two directions...what kind of calculation would make you alternate 90 degree angles between them? The logical "angle" would be calculating their vectors and running between it, rather than alternating between running straight at defender A, and straight at defender B.

If that's the issue, why not solve it with simple vectors? Assign "threat" values to each incoming defender and "importance" value to your goal, each of these is the length of a vector, add all 3 and the HB suddenly knows the instant best way considering all defenders at once. It doesn't consider blockers, but it's a pretty simple solution. It even considers backpeddling if the defender threat value goes beyond the "reward" or "importance" value of maintaining the same general direction.

Was used in one of the best bots of all time back in the 90s in quake 1 with great success!

Originally posted by Sabataged DTD
deathblade for mod imo

he was one but got removed for being a douchebag. Semi helpful but mostly a douchebag

Originally posted by burn_209
Originally posted by Sabataged DTD

deathblade for mod imo

he was one but got removed for being a douchebag. Semi helpful but mostly a douchebag

GTFO.