Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Mezirah
I think he means all the people who want it nerfed, lol.

Those tears are already here. If it doesn't, you are going to get the can't beat'em, join'em mentality from the rest of us.

Originally posted by peeti
Why Yorick? I only know the lol champ, but couldnt find out if it has a different meaning or not. Your team doesnt have anything in common with that guy^^
It's a Shakespeare reference. From Hamlet's famous monologue in the churchyard. Well, to be more precise, a reference to a Shakespeare reference, but no. It's sort of an in-joke with the Loungers from another game we played, that had been written by one of our members who has since passed away. The only relation to the LoL guy is that that's also a Shakespeare reference.

Originally posted by Corndog
Yep

hooray!

Great research. I don't see how anyone can argue that 14.8 YPC in rookie (with a sample size of 1340) isn't overpowered.

but, but, but -- that's just because those rookie defenders aren't built correctly...and because those rookie defensive coordinators don't know what they are doing....

Originally posted by Adderfist
Didn't realize we run "Deep passing attacks" 7.3 y/a on AR.

Grrrr..

7.3 Y/A is definitely a deep passing attack.

It doesn't mean you attempted to throw the ball 7.3 yards every time. It means that when yo divide the number of attempts by the number of yards, you get 7.3. For that to happen you either caught 100% of the passes, or you were throwing it deeper than that.

If you're completing at 50%, it'd take 14 yard completions to do that. If you are at 60%, you're still at 12 yards per completion. Either of those distances is plenty to break the new coverage meta.

Originally posted by Corndog
Yep

So...taking HB Sweep from goalline away as well? How 'bout HB Counter which actually is perfect for getting all the defenders piled up in the middle via the broken defensive AI?

Having just watch Louisana combine deep passes with HB outside running, I'm pretty much sold on the fact that there is no such thing as defense in GLB2 now. The tricks I use to slow down deep passing open you up to outside runs, and once your D gets tired out from chasing down runners, the deep passes start working as well since the QB ends up with oodles of time to wait.

Originally posted by Adderfist
"The spread dive isn't like this. The spread dive was a legit problem because we (DCs) were not properly equipped with the plays to stop inside runs from the 4wr. Why? Because the #WR cap forced DCs to not be able to select plays that could help, and the 4wr formations did little to stop inside runs." - Jampy

I feel that this is the same as for the GL plays. As DC's we do not have the tools to deal with the formation.

Interesting.

Originally posted by Sardonik00
Stobie, where does Yorick rank among teams? It's my owned team, so I don't care if you post my data (not sure Xav would care either). That is, if you want to pull it!

I can give you a sample set, but question is against only same tier teams or whole game.

In further evaluation, you guys are not the largest culprits, just the largest voices.

Originally posted by Stobie
Obviously you didn't look at the details. What I was showing was the yards per carry on the plays. Top plays in the game right now are GL plays. That is an OP situation where no matter the defense you run you are still not favorable in odds to stop. Furthermore if you even want a chance to stop it you can't use the traditional plays you would expect to use to stop it, you have to high risk.

Over power means stronger than normal, and my stats prove that. They are the strongest runs in the game by a mile!

To quote Mark Twain: "Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics" Which is not to say statistics are wrong. But that anyone can use statistics to make a false argument seem valid. Can you tell me what plays the defense played against the OP plays? Did you filter out CPU teams from your data? Can you tell me what the DB's were built like? Can you break down the OP plays against all defenses played against it for each tier? What are the top 10 teams style of each tier, and what plays are they using? Do you think these questions are not relevant?

Let me put it another way. Yorick lost the rookie championship game and we didn't lose because Mysterio ran Goal Line, we lost because we had a play in our defense that resulted in big plays against us. If this 1 defensive play wasn't used, those big plays would not have happened as we contained Meth Cookers really well in ALL other plays, resulting in a lot of punts. Who would've won? I have no idea. But there is no doubt that Meth Cookers 3 or 4 big plays came from 1 bad play in our defensive playbook.

Originally posted by Corndog
Originally posted by Parab00n
Gonna be a ton of tears soon.Yep

Why am I not surprised? No one has actually done any thorough and open testing. Why not let a couple of the "Pro OP" crowd make a team or two at rookie and seasoned to run the OP Goal Line plays, and let the "not OP" crowd run some teams against it? Then you can look at the dots, the playbooks, etc... and come up with some real data before making your decision.

In general there are some AI improvements needed, especially at rookie level when dots are less developed. I only hope you take the time to make a reasonable adjustment. Because really the "Pro OP" crowd argument is basically this: "Why should I have to build dots to stop a running team and make the right defensive plays?" which is absurd. Would you listen to the same argument if it was about passing teams? Probably not.

Is this fixed yet?

Originally posted by IotB
To quote Mark Twain: "Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics" Which is not to say statistics are wrong. But that anyone can use statistics to make a false argument seem valid. Can you tell me what plays the defense played against the OP plays? Did you filter out CPU teams from your data? Can you tell me what the DB's were built like? Can you break down the OP plays against all defenses played against it for each tier? What are the top 10 teams style of each tier, and what plays are they using? Do you think these questions are not relevant?

To answer your questions. Yes, Yes, No, Yes, Go look yourself, No

Originally posted by IotB
Why am I not surprised? No one has actually done any thorough and open testing. Why not let a couple of the "Pro OP" crowd make a team or two at rookie and seasoned to run the OP Goal Line plays, and let the "not OP" crowd run some teams against it? Then you can look at the dots, the playbooks, etc... and come up with some real data before making your decision.

In general there are some AI improvements needed, especially at rookie level when dots are less developed. I only hope you take the time to make a reasonable adjustment. Because really the "Pro OP" crowd argument is basically this: "Why should I have to build dots to stop a running team and make the right defensive plays?" which is absurd. Would you listen to the same argument if it was about passing teams? Probably not.

Why should a team have to build their entire defense to stop 1 play? Isn't that the very definition of overpowered?

Originally posted by Parab00n
Why should a team have to build their entire defense to stop 1 play? Isn't that the very definition of overpowered?

They don't. Everything you'd do to build your team to stop QB Rollout is the stuff you need to do to stop all the other outside runs as well.

Personally, I think young teams should be working on that more than anything else since I have faith that Corndog really will make more teaks to pass defense, and until then, you can't be sure what you'll need to work on beside the obvious there.

Originally posted by Parab00n
To answer your questions. Yes, Yes, No, Yes, Go look yourself, No

You know making assertions without data, is about the most idiotic thing you can do. Don't worry though, I get it, you have been so consumed by your belief that you can't be objective anymore. So with that, you should probably remove yourself from the conversation and let the grown ups make some rational arguments here.