Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Sean1995
How does it analyze the play? Is it based on the play description?

Super sekrets I keep, I wrote a huge analyzer that can do all of this, but yes description is the key.

I've never thought hurries meant anything, I just blitz so the qb can't sit back and find a receiver that got open due to the bullshit coverage mechanics lol

Originally posted by Galithor
Steve runs a 100% rushing attack with Minnesota, and his team dominates his tier by a wide margin. Your own team is a majority rushing offense itself.

You probably should look elsewhere than ladder rankings for the evidence you need to prove that passing is basically on par with rushing.

our league has 9 teams that pass more than they run... compton is not in our league they are all pass, air raid all pass, Alpine all pass, if you would like to break this down i would be happy to. I'm also not making blind statements of 60/40 in favor of the run, my run based team has beat tiers higher than me with a passing attack and my best Oline has 21 in pass blk technique because i want you to hurry me to make the throw before your db can register he's in coverage.

And steve isnt the wide margin you think, perhaps you didnt witness our championship game, if i would have held on to the ball better i would have won probably pretty convincingly as i had big yardage advantage. Steve is very stopable and we talk pretty much every day about that mindset. Other than our two teams and perhaps Dharan find me a top 15 team in our Tier that runs the ball effectively, and how many pass the ball all the time. These numbers dont lie

Originally posted by Galithor
Steve runs a 100% rushing attack with Minnesota, and his team dominates his tier by a wide margin. Your own team is a majority rushing offense itself.

You probably should look elsewhere than ladder rankings for the evidence you need to prove that passing is basically on par with rushing.

Top ladder rankings is all that needs to be said to discuss the OP of one versus the other... as it is what the top teams are doing.

Originally posted by Sean1995
if hurries don't affect anything other than literally just forcing QB quick throws

when has this EVER been validated in any way, shape or form?

What we know from the sister code (GLB1) is that pressure lowers pass quality, making the pass more off target, harder to catch and easier to deflect/intercept. What you can't jump to, and I can't physically say this anymore, is the end performance of "oh the WR caught the ball, it must have no effect". WR's adjust to off target throws in GLB2. That's the whole reception awareness skill. It's also part of the reason why WRs fall down, slow down, come to a complete stop, etc. They're effectively adjusting for unideal passes. You can easily visualize this by watching the game. You can likewise see the other side of things when WRs make an inaccurate pass look accurate, most easily on deep overthrows to fast WRs where they catch it in stride.

I can understand the analysis side here, looking into things and visualizing the effects, and the understanding the blitzing and leaving 1 on 1 coverage isn't as effective as people think, but what I can't is the awful bullying of opinion.

Originally posted by vipermaw82
Top ladder rankings is all that needs to be said to discuss the OP of one versus the other... as it is what the top teams are doing.

To be fair, the top 10 has had many effective passing offenses. Teams like Sunday Funday were burned because of defensive woes. They rarely struggled putting up points.

Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust
To be fair, the top 10 has had many effective passing offenses. Teams like Sunday Funday were burned because of defensive woes. They rarely struggled putting up points.

I agree with this, that part of the discussion was in relation to their are more running teams out there and are more effective. IMO the ladder ranking tells the story of how many teams are doing each effectively.

I'd actually argue that passing is more effective (due to coverage woes, defender SP applicatoin and pure pass o-line effectiveness), HOWEVER rushing is easier to be effective and therefore more popular.

As the sim stands I'm going to make my next gen as a pass first offense.

Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust
when has this EVER been validated in any way, shape or form?

What we know from the sister code (GLB1) is that pressure lowers pass quality, making the pass more off target, harder to catch and easier to deflect/intercept. What you can't jump to, and I can't physically say this anymore, is the end performance of "oh the WR caught the ball, it must have no effect". WR's adjust to off target throws in GLB2. That's the whole reception awareness skill. It's also part of the reason why WRs fall down, slow down, come to a complete stop, etc. They're effectively adjusting for unideal passes. You can easily visualize this by watching the game. You can likewise see the other side of things when WRs make an inaccurate pass look accurate, most easily on deep overthrows to fast WRs where they catch it in stride.

.

I think people are looking at it from a sheer number perspective and then mixing logic against straight fact. Mixing these things is dangerous, but logically if you are making things stressful on an opponent or increase his "to hit roll" then realistically the number should be somewhat lower in specific situations... (mathamatically it makes sense). No matter what happens, if the logic isnt explained to use its all a moot converation.

Thanks Stobie,

Will be interesting to see what you turn up from Season 5 numbers.

Personally - I kind of hope this is all ado about nothing -- and it was just blind bad luck that the couple games I tabulated showed an increase in completion % when hurried (vs not hurried)

Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust
I'd actually argue that passing is more effective (due to coverage woes, defender SP applicatoin and pure pass o-line effectiveness), HOWEVER rushing is easier to be effective and therefore more popular.

As the sim stands I'm going to make my next gen as a pass first offense.

There are a lot more factors and moving parts in the passing game which if done right can be way more effective, but if done wrong is worthless. Running not nearly the factors are involved and I'm from Nebraska so running is what we do

Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust
I'd actually argue that passing is more effective (due to coverage woes, defender SP application and pure pass o-line effectiveness), HOWEVER rushing is easier to be effective and therefore more popular.

As the sim stands I'm going to make my next gen as a pass first offense.

I think I would too - if I started over.

A lot easier for game planning too, I think. With multiple targets on every play - I expect you can pretty consistently leave your playbook the same and depend on the QB to distribute the ball as open or needed (based on pass rush).

Running - I've got to find the specific formations to attack with either an inside or an outside rush focus (maybe you don't -- but playing up in ladder games - I pretty much have to put in effort to have as efficient an O as possible).

Originally posted by TxSteve
Thanks Stobie,

Will be interesting to see what you turn up from Season 5 numbers.

Personally - I kind of hope this is all ado about nothing -- and it was just blind bad luck that the couple games I tabulated showed an increase in completion % when hurried (vs not hurried)


Next level of analysis will need to be done if your results are consistent with a large sample. Basically attempting to determine if you have proved the effect of hurries as ineffective or that blitzing, leaving 1 on 1 matchups is ineffective.

agree - could be that the penalty is fine -- but the SS behavior is stupid (as Galithor said a few pages back) - in which case - perhaps a tweak to SS starting position (if corndog thought it worth it) would have hurries meaning at least something.

Well, we'd have to jump to individual plays at that level. But yeah, specific positions are the culprits with a lot of coverage woes. I'll also hedge that inaccurate throws could probably help WRs in situations where there is room to adjust away from 'good' coverage. The WRs having the advantage in adjusting to the pass well.