Warrior General Games

Rattled just seems to be another 'rich get richer' part of the game like morale spirals already are.

If the defense is getting hurries in a short period of time to trigger "rattled" aren't they likely already winning the morale / defensive battle regardless?

If the goal was for getting pressure on the QB to be more rewarding for the offense isn't the easiest answer to buff morale penalties for hurries/sacks than to add a mechanic that pulls blockers in at random? The latter is much more difficult to balance and introduces completely new situations of "what the fuck" that we didn't have prior.

What QB is sending three eligible receivers into a 3-4 cover 2 ever? Even if you are 'scared of the blitz' it just doesn't make any practical football sense. It's a stupid bandaid and once again pulls this game further and further away from anything resembling football. Sending three receivers into guaranteed double coverage and getting intercepted or deflected for a further penalty (which results in an even further morale loss) is asinine. Any QB with half a brain knows that is a situation with a low likelihood of a successful pass so why take further penalties if something stupid happens because of rattled?

Like what do we have morale for if we need alternate mechanics for the same goal? Am i missing something?

What is lame to me is that it triggers based off more than just credited hurries/sacks. My QB stands all day 3 plays in a row and makes easy throws and then the 4th play im holding the 3 of my 5 targets? wat

Of course that results in a sack because I got nobody to throw to. Which then results in another consecutive sack because of that lame duck. Which results in an even longer 3rd down attempt and yet another sack. Derp...

There is definitely something fishy about rattled but without an indicator of when you are 'close to rattled' or 'rattled' or 'no longer rattled' it's difficult to say for sure.

The entire idea though just seems kind of 'wat' to me.

From a game design perspective it just seems to add more variables without addressing any kind of new problem which is a recipe for a game too obfuscated to balance.

For example, If you want to address the problem of "QB's complete too many passes" how do you even approach that at this point?

Is rattled not strong enough to force morale spirals to drop %?
Does rattled not trigger enough which makes morale the dominant factor and thus the key to address?
Are both of these values undertuned and passing skills are simply too dominant in the equation?
If receiver morale -> catch % and qb morale -> throw % are not equal, are they lopsided and how does that affect the bigger picture?
Is stamina too big of a factor and throw %'s simply don't drop enough late in the game?

At this point changing any of those sections or adding a new mechanic is basically impossible to predict. Making the problem even more difficult by adding more variables seems to be kind of to me unless nobody cares about the long-term health of this game and they just want to demonstrate season-over-season "improvement" to get us all to believe in Mighty Brawlers when it releases (since if this game dies before Mighty Brawlers that project is basically dead too).

Well I think you are being a bit over dramatic about this but it certainly shows its advantages offensively when it works right. Like when someone is blitz you from the outside and the HB picks up the closest guy allowing you to evade the pressure long enough to throw. I really have no problem with it holding a TE at times because if it didn't the tactic would be 100% offensively favored. Honestly I don't even have a problem when it holds at least 2 guys. But holding 3 players and especially when there was no recorded hurry/sack for several plays just sort of frustrates a guy because it doesn't seem like I as an OC can do anything about it and that the defense pretty much dictates its use.

Originally posted by bhall43
Like when someone is blitz you from the outside and the HB picks up the closest guy allowing you to evade the pressure long enough to throw.

Can't you already do this with the QB settings to hold in the selected blocker anyway? This is what I am trying to say. Don't see what this addresses that morale or QB settings aren't already supposed to.

Originally posted by bhall43
I really have no problem with it holding a TE at times because if it didn't the tactic would be 100% offensively favored.

I am 99% sure it was designed as a defensive benefit, so it's interesting that holding in just a HB is a buff for the offense in most cases yet holding in a TE is a nerf. What is the point of the mechanic if it's pretty much random which side it benefits?

I'm naturally super dramatic, but these offseason changes have kind of jaded me about this game (no plinko chips for guessing which player I am getting beat up on) just because I put a lot of time into studying ludology for my own side projects and the track record for GLB changes that I can at least see the reasoning behind is not very good (and the practical results seem to back up my view and don't inspire confidence either).

Im sure we will all live with it for a season while CDog stays quiet or responds only to snarky comments directed at him and not to the issue at hand, and then in the offseason there will be some drastic change to this mechanic and then some drastic change targetted at running as they got by pretty free last season and I'm sure people will begin to complain by midway.

Using the regular tactic nobody was holding the te. The audible option was dumb to begin with as a checkbox. Said that on the server.

Originally posted by bhall43
The audible option was dumb to begin with as a checkbox.

�\_(ツ�)_/�

If were gonna keep rattled, at least make it where pocket awareness can give you a chance to roll to overcome it when it won't be needed to handle the rush. I'd like a chance to avoid it impacting a play when the defense is only gonna rush 3-4 guys.

Originally posted by Galithor
If were gonna keep rattled, at least make it where pocket awareness can give you a chance to roll to overcome it when it won't be needed to handle the rush. I'd like a chance to avoid it impacting a play when the defense is only gonna rush 3-4 guys.

Or... once the QB realizes that the D isn't blitzing and that he has no WRs, he should be able to send a blocker on a hot route.

TBH, I really like the rattled mechanic for rookie. It is the only way to hold off the two-sided blitz.

I'm running 4 S* WRs and a S* QB, so I figured I would be running a lot of 4-5 WR sets. Turns out that 5WR is a bad option because you have no one to hold in against the blitz. 4 WR is okay because the HB hangs back and picks up the first blitzer, so as long as two blitzers aren't both getting through before the throw, it works pretty well.

Holding in the HB and/or TE in the 3 WR sets gives you a good chance against the blitz and still gives you three options up field.

Singleback Big has resulted in some fairly lol plays where everyone gets held in and you've got 6 defenders chasing 2 WRs... and because the defenders are lol in coverage, the 2 WRs both win the battle on slant plays where the D players choose to give up the inside shoulder and then make bad turns.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Or... once the QB realizes that the D isn't blitzing and that he has no WRs, he should be able to send a blocker on a hot route.

Alternatively, it could also be the blocker making his own check. Blocker held in for protection sometimes can leak out into hot routes if they realize they have no one to block.

Oh I guess that might be problematic in either case (either the QB or the blocker decides to leak out) because there's no D heuristics for assigning a cover guy or having any responsibility for the new receiver. The D will just happily let 50000 guys continue to cover 2 receivers while ignoring everyone else.

Originally posted by kurieg
Oh I guess that might be problematic in either case (either the QB or the blocker decides to leak out) because there's no D heuristics for assigning a cover guy or having any responsibility for the new receiver. The D will just happily let 50000 guys continue to cover 2 receivers while ignoring everyone else.

Well, tbf, if they believe that their man was assigned to block and they abandon their man to cover another man instead of dropping into a zone, that's probably what they deserve.

Originally posted by Time Trial
Well, tbf, if they believe that their man was assigned to block and they abandon their man to cover another man instead of dropping into a zone, that's probably what they deserve.



Actually, having them drop back into a zone instead of going some place random and double covering would make more sense to begin with.

Though they could provide for the "see my cover responsibility block so BLITZ EM" option for D

Originally posted by kurieg
Actually, having them drop back into a zone instead of going some place random and double covering would make more sense to begin with.

Though they could provide for the "see my cover responsibility block so BLITZ EM" option for D

I know...

Part of the reason that I miss the DPC. I don't even want to move players around or change their initial assignments, I just wish I could change their second progressions.

Cover HB or [Blitz], [Zone], [Spy], or [Man] is something that I miss.

HB goes to block, finds that there are no blitzers, so decides to run a route.
The Defender saw that the HB went to block, so he runs his second progression. In GLB2 that generally is Man cover, but I think that there are some plays where it is blitz if no cover (not sure). If the second progression is blitz, the HB would have a blitzer to block. If the second progression was cover another man, the HB would have an open underneath route. If the second progression was zone, the defender would see the HB go into a route, break out of the zone, and resume the man coverage (imo).