Warrior General Games

^ignore him

Originally posted by NiborRis
It does seem to be harder to pass awareness checks on longer throws for the DBs, maybe?

The more I watch, the more certain I am that *what* the DB is doing plays an impact on how hard the reaction rolls are. When my FS is sitting in his zone just staring at the QB, he reacts near-instantly to the ball being thrown almost every single time. When he's running after a DB, back to the QB, it takes him longer to notice.

I do think that plays like the OP, there needs to be an immediate drop in difficulty when the WR you are chasing stops - either that or there needs to be both an awareness check on the ball and also an awareness check on the WR breaking off his route to react to the ball, which gets easier quickly as you run by him and should be automatic once the WR is no longer in your field of view. The problem is the DB is still following the route even when the WR drops off.

This will mostly be noticeable on the really long throws that are somewhat off target. Running full out after the WR back to the QB is going to make the awareness check on the pass quite difficult, and yet it looks REALLY dumb when he fails to react to the WR moving because he's too focuses on...following the WR?

Originally posted by NiborRis

This will mostly be noticeable on the really long throws that are somewhat off target. Running full out after the WR back to the QB is going to make the awareness check on the pass quite difficult, and yet it looks REALLY dumb when he fails to react to the WR moving because he's too focuses on...following the WR?

Like in GLB1 for the longest time on deep throws where the CB would just watch the WR catch the ball short of him.

Yup, exactly - throw deep with a mediocre QB whose accuracy was crap, watch the catches.
The logic seems to all be available, just need to add something where the WR breaking off his route to go to the ball counts as a "cut" in his route for the DB to track. The WR still gets an awareness edge, assuming he earns it, but it's not to become automatically open. And the DB still has to deal with the course change and track it correctly, which can fail, so it should just make certain passes more correctly balanced rather than just automatically Be Open.

Originally posted by Parab00n


How would being too slow cause my guys to continue running down the field while the WR turns around and runs in the other direction towards the ball?

I worded that poorly. The lack of an adequate combination of sprinting, quickness and footwork could led to him being unable to track with sudden cuts, even though his mental make up might indicAte otherwise.

Originally posted by McGruffHawk
I worded that poorly. The lack of an adequate combination of sprinting, quickness and footwork could led to him being unable to track with sudden cuts, even though his mental make up might indicAte otherwise.

This is what I was thinking....

Even on my man CBs with over 60 Awareness and 45+ cover tech its like the CB makes no effort to adjust...
By no means do i find 60 Man aware low... so I don't think the problem is in passing the check to notice the WR has dropped off his route..

Let's not forget we are playing joeball with darn near a elementary/middle school type cast, when majority of players are running 5.5+ 40yrd dashes etc. etc.

Who knows? Maybe the 30 quckness everyone is bragging of is garbage? because I sure know It wouldn't be too farfetched for me to hit a sub 6 second 40 backpedaling....

Maybe when quickness/balance (2 things that I only assume would help CBs make a sharp cut off their route)hit 50-60+, this problem will stop....

But if this belief is correct... This only goes to show pass coverage needs a buff, because the WR that can have no more than 30 route awareness is making incredible adjustments on longballs..

I agree that there is clearly something wrong/unnatural with the passing game. I think the problem is that in real-life-football, so much of a passing game is timing and throwing to open spots on the field and letting the WR go get it, as opposed to directly throwing to the WRs. Think of button hooks, comeback routes, quick slants, fades, back shoulder throws, etc. All of that is done with impeccable timing that has been practiced repeatedly by the players for years. In fact, quite often, balls are thrown before the WR even makes his break. In real life it's "run this route and if you do it well and shake your defender enough I'll throw the ball to this spot which is at the end of your route", and then every once in awhile you have the scramble-drill type plays where a play breaks down and the WRs just need to get open.

However, in the sim it seems to be "run this route and if you look kind of open at any point or when I get pressured by someone I'll throw the ball whenever to wherever you are in your route". It has a much more amateurish feel like it's a backyard pickup game, and timing is essentially removed from the equation altogether and throws that would be very hard in real life are the same as any other in the sim. And because of the coding, WRs seem to have a sixth sense for when and where the ball is thrown. I'm assuming this is because the WR SHOULD know what the play is and SHOULD know when the ball is coming if everything is done correctly in a timing system. But the sim doesn't run a timing system and the problem is so many of the plays are so sloppy in the sim (likely because of the currently poor skills everyone has) that there is no way the WR, in many situations, could have the awareness to adjust to the ball and make the catch. It would be superhuman. Simply put, the offense appears to get all of the benefits of a perfectly run timing system, but none of the disadvantages. This is why backyard pickup games compared to the pros look ridiculous, because of the lack of timing and polish that only comes with intense practice. I've seen many incomplete throws in the sim, but to my perspective none of them have been because a route was poorly run and the QB threw it to where the WR was supposed to be at that moment. Or because of bad timing between the QB and WR. Because the QB always throws it directly to the WR. I think those of us who take issue with the passing game, feel this unnatural aspect to it.

Meanwhile, the CBs and other DBs actually appear to react realistically (except that they should break off the route when they see the WR break off). For example, when you have these streak routes, the WR would expect the pass to be thrown down field and that he would need to run under it, being in front of the defender and catching it over the shoulder. However, in the sim--because the QBs don't have the arm strength or whatever--all of these passes look like perfect back-shoulder throws where the WR stops short with amazing timing and the CB keeps running not realizing what happened, despite the back-shoulder throw being one of the hardest in football to actually complete.

That's my two cents at least. I have more to say, but I've probably said too much as it is (sorry about the length).

Originally posted by Phantom Cannon
I agree that there is clearly something wrong/unnatural with the passing game. I think the problem is that in real-life-football, so much of a passing game is timing and throwing to open spots on the field and letting the WR go get it, as opposed to directly throwing to the WRs. Think of button hooks, comeback routes, quick slants, fades, back shoulder throws, etc. All of that is done with impeccable timing that has been practiced repeatedly by the players for years. In fact, quite often, balls are thrown before the WR even makes his break. In real life it's "run this route and if you do it well and shake your defender enough I'll throw the ball to this spot which is at the end of your route", and then every once in awhile you have the scramble-drill type plays where a play breaks down and the WRs just need to get open.

However, in the sim it seems to be "run this route and if you look kind of open at any point or when I get pressured by someone I'll throw the ball whenever to wherever you are in your route". It has a much more amateurish feel like it's a backyard pickup game, and timing is essentially removed from the equation altogether and throws that would be very hard in real life are the same as any other in the sim. And because of the coding, WRs seem to have a sixth sense for when and where the ball is thrown. I'm assuming this is because the WR SHOULD know what the play is and SHOULD know when the ball is coming if everything is done correctly in a timing system. But the sim doesn't run a timing system and the problem is so many of the plays are so sloppy in the sim (likely because of the currently poor skills everyone has) that there is no way the WR, in many situations, could have the awareness to adjust to the ball and make the catch. It would be superhuman. Simply put, the offense appears to get all of the benefits of a perfectly run timing system, but none of the disadvantages. This is why backyard pickup games compared to the pros look ridiculous, because of the lack of timing and polish that only comes with intense practice. I've seen many incomplete throws in the sim, but to my perspective none of them have been because a route was poorly run and the QB threw it to where the WR was supposed to be at that moment. Or because of bad timing between the QB and WR. Because the QB always throws it directly to the WR. I think those of us who take issue with the passing game, feel this unnatural aspect to it.

Meanwhile, the CBs and other DBs actually appear to react realistically (except that they should break off the route when they see the WR break off). For example, when you have these streak routes, the WR would expect the pass to be thrown down field and that he would need to run under it, being in front of the defender and catching it over the shoulder. However, in the sim--because the QBs don't have the arm strength or whatever--all of these passes look like perfect back-shoulder throws where the WR stops short with amazing timing and the CB keeps running not realizing what happened, despite the back-shoulder throw being one of the hardest in football to actually complete.

That's my two cents at least. I have more to say, but I've probably said too much as it is (sorry about the length).

Bless your soul