Warrior General Games

Originally posted by McGruffHawk
Originally posted by rutgar

Good game TIT. I saw the score and thought we had put something good together.

Then I saw the box score and figured someone committed a felony and this karma trying to get back at them.

Yeah, you gotta think something is going on when the yardage difference is 428 to 34, with 2 punts against 8, and the final score is 20-16.

Special teams ftw!

Originally posted by Notor
Originally posted by McGruffHawk

Originally posted by rutgar


Good game TIT. I saw the score and thought we had put something good together.

Then I saw the box score and figured someone committed a felony and this karma trying to get back at them.

Yeah, you gotta think something is going on when the yardage difference is 428 to 34, with 2 punts against 8, and the final score is 20-16.

Special teams ftw!

Yeah, that and turnovers . . . we had two fumbled punts that were returned for TD's to go along with our 4 other turnovers. But those muffed punts were brutal.

Originally posted by beenlurken
Originally posted by The Lurker

Originally posted by beenlurken


Originally posted by The Lurker



Basically, the system isn't perfect, but it's the only thing we have that equates to a real life motivation boost. We have no other way of making our dots play harder.

I understand what you what you are saying. I just feel that by adding this attempt at a real life motivational boost brings more flaws to the game than there are without it. Why introduce more problems? Why not add more AI options to allow the truly motivated teams to gain an advantage by super customizing the game plans?

Because the boosting idea was easier to implement Seems like all the best ideas and improvements are put on the back burner for long periods of time in favor of more stop gap and quick fix-it ideas. Five seasons in and we still don't have full depth chart control, such as situational players (3rd down back, switch between blocking/receiving TE's, many more examples). We still can't dictate which direction we want to run the football. There are tons of other things more important that temporary boosting that the game is missing, but it is what it is. It's already here and we might as well roll with it like steelerblitz said.

I can roll with it... but I dont have to like it

Personally, (and this is the only time you will ever hear me say this) whenever a team loses that I think should have won I will forever wonder how much boner tokens played a part in the upset. Will forever wonder if it was a valid win. Likewise, if the teams my players play for win a game that we boosted for I will also forever wonder if we only won because we boosted. Just look how frustrated killertoad was that it was suggested that RTT's win was potentially a result of the tokens. It sucks that that will always be in the back of our minds, but thats what we are forced to deal/roll with and I just cant believe that anyone welcomes this in any shape or form.

I agree with everyone who said that more in-depth AI, especially for offense, and other tactical improvements were more needed than this. But you have to remember that it was part of a big seasonal update, training, where Bort catered to the more casual players who only have a few players and don't log on for hours every day. Remember that he had catered exclusively to team owners and GMs with the season 4 AI update. I'm sure that the season 6 update will be more along those lines. I actually generally dislike the new training system and don't even think it achieves what it set out to do, improve the gaming experience for the casual player. The one thing that I sort of like is the temp boosting, for two reasons. One, like The Lurker said, it adds an element of realism. Two, it adds an element of strategy that a team can use to get an edge over an equal team, or have a better chance to beat a better team.

But I strongly disagree with you beenlurken that "whenever a team loses that I think should have won I will forever wonder how much boner tokens played a part in the upset. Will forever wonder if it was a valid win."
Like lukin and McGruff said, you won't be able to win with the boosts alone. Good game planning and great builds will still be required. So the win will have been valid.
Also, like I said earlier, the temp boosts are not available in the playoffs.



--edited for grammar.

Originally posted by HaplosDog
Originally posted by beenlurken

Originally posted by The Lurker


Originally posted by beenlurken



Originally posted by The Lurker




Basically, the system isn't perfect, but it's the only thing we have that equates to a real life motivation boost. We have no other way of making our dots play harder.

I understand what you what you are saying. I just feel that by adding this attempt at a real life motivational boost brings more flaws to the game than there are without it. Why introduce more problems? Why not add more AI options to allow the truly motivated teams to gain an advantage by super customizing the game plans?

Because the boosting idea was easier to implement Seems like all the best ideas and improvements are put on the back burner for long periods of time in favor of more stop gap and quick fix-it ideas. Five seasons in and we still don't have full depth chart control, such as situational players (3rd down back, switch between blocking/receiving TE's, many more examples). We still can't dictate which direction we want to run the football. There are tons of other things more important that temporary boosting that the game is missing, but it is what it is. It's already here and we might as well roll with it like steelerblitz said.

I can roll with it... but I dont have to like it

Personally, (and this is the only time you will ever hear me say this) whenever a team loses that I think should have won I will forever wonder how much boner tokens played a part in the upset. Will forever wonder if it was a valid win. Likewise, if the teams my players play for win a game that we boosted for I will also forever wonder if we only won because we boosted. Just look how frustrated killertoad was that it was suggested that RTT's win was potentially a result of the tokens. It sucks that that will always be in the back of our minds, but thats what we are forced to deal/roll with and I just cant believe that anyone welcomes this in any shape or form.

I agree with everyone who said that more in-depth AI, especially for offense, and other tactical improvements were more needed than this. But you have to remember that it was part of a big seasonal update, training, where Bort catered to the more casual players who only have a few players and don't log on for hours every day. Remember that he had catered exclusively to team owners and GMs with the season 4 AI update. I'm sure that the season 6 update will be more along those lines. I actually generally dislike the new training system and don't even think it achieves what it set out to do, improve the gaming experience for the casual player. The one thing that I sort of like is the temp boosting, for two reasons. One, like The Lurker said, it adds an element of realism. Two, it adds an element of strategy that a team can use to get an edge over an equal team, or have a better chance to beat a better team.

But I strongly disagree with you beenlurken that "whenever a team loses that I think should have won I will forever wonder how much boner tokens played a part in the upset. Will forever wonder if it was a valid win."
Like lukin and McGruff said, you won't be able to win with the boosts alone. Good game planning and great builds will still be required. So the win will have been valid.
Also, like I said earlier, the temp boosts are not available in the playoffs.



--edited for grammar.

My question is if a win using boner tokers is considered valid then why not allow them in the playoffs?

I couldnt agree more that boosts alone wont win games... but I think it is fair to say that at the very least all eight teams heading to the playoffs have great builds and game planning (there is a very fine, small gap from 1 to 8 imo). Being that those two variables are relatively equal boner token would most certainly be a deciding factor in those games if one team were to use them and the not the other. This is the reason as to why they are not allowed during the playoffs.

HOLY MOLY!! I just got back from my mini vacation to find out that we pulled an Ali and shocked the world lol. Great game Nites!! I can't wait to sit down and watch it.

Originally posted by killertoad
HOLY MOLY!! I just got back from my mini vacation to find out that we pulled an Ali and shocked the world lol. Great game Nites!! I can't wait to sit down and watch it.

Good Game!!! I wouldnt say we were shocked. Ya'll have a great team and are always one we have marked on the calendar.

I just read through the forums and just want to say for the record, there was no inner team discussion about saving our bonus for this game. I for one use mine as soon as they are available just so I can use the +1 permanent attribute, none of my 6 players used any boost for the Nites game, because I had none available.

I really don't think they affect the game as much as people think. I used them twice this year, we lost one game and won the other.

I have no idea who used them for the Titans for this game. We just don't discuss them actually.

I give credit to this win to the offensive gameplanning of kogrady. I just slightly adjusted the defense to counter what you guys exploited against us in the past. That's pretty much it. The overhaul was all done on offense, hats off to Kev.

I just think that teams work extra hard to play you guys. You are THE team to beat in this league so you always get everyones A game. That comes with being the Champs I guess

Hoping that this is done now

GG Jakarta

Originally posted by The Lurker
Originally posted by beenlurken

Originally posted by The Lurker


Basically, the system isn't perfect, but it's the only thing we have that equates to a real life motivation boost. We have no other way of making our dots play harder.

I understand what you what you are saying. I just feel that by adding this attempt at a real life motivational boost brings more flaws to the game than there are without it. Why introduce more problems? Why not add more AI options to allow the truly motivated teams to gain an advantage by super customizing the game plans?

Because the boosting idea was easier to implement Seems like all the best ideas and improvements are put on the back burner for long periods of time in favor of more stop gap and quick fix-it ideas. Five seasons in and we still don't have full depth chart control, such as situational players (3rd down back, switch between blocking/receiving TE's, many more examples). We still can't dictate which direction we want to run the football. There are tons of other things more important that temporary boosting that the game is missing, but it is what it is. It's already here and we might as well roll with it like steelerblitz said.

If we're gonna keep playing, we're gonna have to roll with it. I have a couple of issues with the tokens as well.

- Gives a GREAT advantage to those owners/agents who have 20+ players on 1 team (or those who own the entire team). It's hard enough to coordinate personal tactics for some people, nevermind a grand scale token boost!

- Do they actually help? I've seen arguments about building in "ratios" (1:1 speed:agility, 2:1 speed:agility....). I can't say whose, if any, theory is correct BUT if they are, do these token boosts throw off an entire build to the point that the player is less effective?

- With Bort's implementing a "token refund" to "balance" intense training with normal training (shopping tokens), we now have entire teams who can save tokens via equipment and unleash 1/2+ season's worth of boosts 2-3 season away. Who would want to do this and who does it benefit the most? Current slow build teams. They have no real use for the +5 bonus now. Hell, even rebuild teams who can avoid relegation for a season or 2 can benefit from this. While they can't be used in the playoffs, having 1-2 teams with 7-10 games worth of boosts can greatly affect playoff seeding.


Overall I think they're a bad idea for football. The truth is, though, that this is a football role playing game. Bort will continue to introduce RPG aspects as he sees fit (EQ, Boosts, Potions, Magic spells, Ranger and Thief classes, Humanoid players, Dragons, Clerics on the sidelines, Water-Elemental Boys......). We're just stuck with it I guess

Originally posted by CableJelly
Originally posted by The Lurker

Originally posted by beenlurken


Originally posted by The Lurker



Basically, the system isn't perfect, but it's the only thing we have that equates to a real life motivation boost. We have no other way of making our dots play harder.

I understand what you what you are saying. I just feel that by adding this attempt at a real life motivational boost brings more flaws to the game than there are without it. Why introduce more problems? Why not add more AI options to allow the truly motivated teams to gain an advantage by super customizing the game plans?

Because the boosting idea was easier to implement Seems like all the best ideas and improvements are put on the back burner for long periods of time in favor of more stop gap and quick fix-it ideas. Five seasons in and we still don't have full depth chart control, such as situational players (3rd down back, switch between blocking/receiving TE's, many more examples). We still can't dictate which direction we want to run the football. There are tons of other things more important that temporary boosting that the game is missing, but it is what it is. It's already here and we might as well roll with it like steelerblitz said.

If we're gonna keep playing, we're gonna have to roll with it. I have a couple of issues with the tokens as well.

- Gives a GREAT advantage to those owners/agents who have 20+ players on 1 team (or those who own the entire team). It's hard enough to coordinate personal tactics for some people, nevermind a grand scale token boost!

- Do they actually help? I've seen arguments about building in "ratios" (1:1 speed:agility, 2:1 speed:agility....). I can't say whose, if any, theory is correct BUT if they are, do these token boosts throw off an entire build to the point that the player is less effective?

- With Bort's implementing a "token refund" to "balance" intense training with normal training (shopping tokens), we now have entire teams who can save tokens via equipment and unleash 1/2+ season's worth of boosts 2-3 season away. Who would want to do this and who does it benefit the most? Current slow build teams. They have no real use for the +5 bonus now. Hell, even rebuild teams who can avoid relegation for a season or 2 can benefit from this. While they can't be used in the playoffs, having 1-2 teams with 7-10 games worth of boosts can greatly affect playoff seeding.


Overall I think they're a bad idea for football. The truth is, though, that this is a football role playing game. Bort will continue to introduce RPG aspects as he sees fit (EQ, Boosts, Potions, Magic spells, Ranger and Thief classes, Humanoid players, Dragons, Clerics on the sidelines, Water-Elemental Boys......). We're just stuck with it I guess


I don't think Bort wants to get into an RPG fight with the Dungeon Master.



Either way, I just think the boner tokens are a stupid concept. If you want to make it realistic to actual football where a lower ranked team gets up to play a heavy favorite, give the lesser team a huge morale boost or an addition to chemistry. A widespread +5 speed or whatever equates to a hell of a lot more than "getting up" to play a good opponent.

The point is, the top teams are likely to take their opponents +5 boost each week, while they simply don't have the ability to match it week in and week out. If that costs a team playoff revenue by not having home field in the playoffs, etc then I think it's a terrible addition that is basically a quick-fix solution to teams with bad builds, etc. It's for the same people that complain enough for Bort to nerf good players.


the pussification of America continues.

Originally posted by Jukin Jive

the pussification of America continues.


....so we will all still get participation awards after the season? YAY!


Next thing we'll have to staff our teams using boy-girl-boy-girl or the 1-2-1-2-1-2 methods. No favoritism or picking the best players any more! WE ARE ALL EQUAL!


Remember, you're unique...just like everyone else

the majority of the mustangs are saving up tokens for adv items...

you dont have to worry about us boosting all at once..

my team is pretty rich already...but theres always holes...

once u plug one another one opens up.....borts changes arent that big..some players just lack some essentials

My Seahawks could use some bonus tokens.

Originally posted by McGruffHawk
My Seahawks could use some bonus tokens.

Even if they boosted every game it wouldn't help

Originally posted by SCACE
Originally posted by McGruffHawk

My Seahawks could use some bonus tokens.

Even if they boosted every game it wouldn't help

Sad thing is, I agree