I gather we are now doing global replace on 'QB goal line sweep' with 'Middle Overload'
Forum > Goal Line Blitz 2 > Middle Overload on Rookie level
HayRow
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Originally posted by Galithor
Here's a quick guide to picking the right plays:
1. Play must be 3/4WR.
2. WR3 must be first or second read.
3. WR3 route must be flag, streak, hook, out, wheel type routes. Nothing where they break to the inside.
4. Routes with a cut, like flag or out, need to make that break in the 5-7 yard range. Don't run deep corner where WR3 doesn't break outside till way late. Takes too long.
5. set flag route plays to the highest priority. hook routes second highest. out routes to the lowest (they don't gain enough yards).
6. Put your best two receivers at WR3. Preferably guys that can catch and have some sprinting and quickness. Give them high contracts if possible to improve heart for any drops.
How to build the QB:
1. Spend all initial points on Pass Awareness. Take Quick Read as your first SA. Should be able to get 32-33 depending on attributes and traits. Spend first several games on pass awareness. By game 4-5, you can have 40 pass awareness.
2. Get conditioning up to 35 or so next.
3. Definitely go with a high contract, and then get 25 heart next after conditioning. With high contract, that's 50 effective heart.
4. Now take awareness to 50.
5. Work on other passing skills. You should be nearly immune to M/O sacks by now. Your bigger issue will be drops and overthrows at this point.
wasn't this the type of shit you complained about in the QB rollout thread, having to build a specific way to beat ONE PLAY…so now we all complain about another play, lets eliminate it. I'm glad I've decided to not buy flex in over a year or 2. When it goes, it goes…the way they respond to bitching is pathetic haha
Here's a quick guide to picking the right plays:
1. Play must be 3/4WR.
2. WR3 must be first or second read.
3. WR3 route must be flag, streak, hook, out, wheel type routes. Nothing where they break to the inside.
4. Routes with a cut, like flag or out, need to make that break in the 5-7 yard range. Don't run deep corner where WR3 doesn't break outside till way late. Takes too long.
5. set flag route plays to the highest priority. hook routes second highest. out routes to the lowest (they don't gain enough yards).
6. Put your best two receivers at WR3. Preferably guys that can catch and have some sprinting and quickness. Give them high contracts if possible to improve heart for any drops.
How to build the QB:
1. Spend all initial points on Pass Awareness. Take Quick Read as your first SA. Should be able to get 32-33 depending on attributes and traits. Spend first several games on pass awareness. By game 4-5, you can have 40 pass awareness.
2. Get conditioning up to 35 or so next.
3. Definitely go with a high contract, and then get 25 heart next after conditioning. With high contract, that's 50 effective heart.
4. Now take awareness to 50.
5. Work on other passing skills. You should be nearly immune to M/O sacks by now. Your bigger issue will be drops and overthrows at this point.
wasn't this the type of shit you complained about in the QB rollout thread, having to build a specific way to beat ONE PLAY…so now we all complain about another play, lets eliminate it. I'm glad I've decided to not buy flex in over a year or 2. When it goes, it goes…the way they respond to bitching is pathetic haha
peeti
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Originally posted by Rom_Fox
I gather we are now doing global replace on 'QB goal line sweep' with 'Middle Overload'
Not at all. QB Rollout was one broken play where mayn ppl even asked to remove it from the game.
MO is just not doing what the playart says
I gather we are now doing global replace on 'QB goal line sweep' with 'Middle Overload'
Not at all. QB Rollout was one broken play where mayn ppl even asked to remove it from the game.
MO is just not doing what the playart says
Ancient Sith Lord
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Originally posted by Corndog
Yeah, I mean it sounds pretty simple.
Except I'd have to completely rewrite the blitzing code to account for waypoints, and then go through and add blitzing waypoints to play definitions, and then test them to make sure they look right.
And now it's suddenly not very simple.
Spaghetti code. Something as simple as changing a play shouldn't be hard to implement if you architect the code base properly.
Yeah, I mean it sounds pretty simple.
Except I'd have to completely rewrite the blitzing code to account for waypoints, and then go through and add blitzing waypoints to play definitions, and then test them to make sure they look right.
And now it's suddenly not very simple.
Spaghetti code. Something as simple as changing a play shouldn't be hard to implement if you architect the code base properly.
Galithor
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Originally posted by HayRow
wasn't this the type of shit you complained about in the QB rollout thread, having to build a specific way to beat ONE PLAY…so now we all complain about another play, lets eliminate it. I'm glad I've decided to not buy flex in over a year or 2. When it goes, it goes…the way they respond to bitching is pathetic haha
You don't build a QB with high pass awareness just for M/O. You build them that way right now to deal with all the blitzes. It's the same reason you prioritize blocking technique over blocking power. Power is worthless if you can't hold the block. For passing, Pass Accuracy is worthless if you can't throw a catchable ball (tech). Power is worthless if you can't hit your target, and none of the 3 are worth anything if you can't get the pass off before a sack.
MO is just the nastiest blitz of the bunch, but it comes with a hugely exploitable flaw. You can torch it with any playcall that will throw early to WR3 doing something to the outside. There's no LB at any tier that can get there quickly enough to save the day assuming you've got adequate builds at QB and the WR in question
wasn't this the type of shit you complained about in the QB rollout thread, having to build a specific way to beat ONE PLAY…so now we all complain about another play, lets eliminate it. I'm glad I've decided to not buy flex in over a year or 2. When it goes, it goes…the way they respond to bitching is pathetic haha
You don't build a QB with high pass awareness just for M/O. You build them that way right now to deal with all the blitzes. It's the same reason you prioritize blocking technique over blocking power. Power is worthless if you can't hold the block. For passing, Pass Accuracy is worthless if you can't throw a catchable ball (tech). Power is worthless if you can't hit your target, and none of the 3 are worth anything if you can't get the pass off before a sack.
MO is just the nastiest blitz of the bunch, but it comes with a hugely exploitable flaw. You can torch it with any playcall that will throw early to WR3 doing something to the outside. There's no LB at any tier that can get there quickly enough to save the day assuming you've got adequate builds at QB and the WR in question
Xavori
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Originally posted by Corndog
The "20 sacks a game" rookie metagame is pretty lame, whether it's MO or the half dozen other popular blitzes.
Right. Because what GLB2 needs now more than anything is for the passing game to get even stronger.
The "20 sacks a game" rookie metagame is pretty lame, whether it's MO or the half dozen other popular blitzes.
Right. Because what GLB2 needs now more than anything is for the passing game to get even stronger.
mrm708
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Originally posted by Corndog
I'd rather put a pin in blitz waypoints, and figure out how to make rookie QBs less apt at getting sacked.
The "20 sacks a game" rookie metagame is pretty lame, whether it's MO or the half dozen other popular blitzes.
Seems like a fair price to pay when rookie teams try to throw 60 times a game. The good teams don't get sacked that often, even early in rookie.
I'd rather put a pin in blitz waypoints, and figure out how to make rookie QBs less apt at getting sacked.
The "20 sacks a game" rookie metagame is pretty lame, whether it's MO or the half dozen other popular blitzes.
Seems like a fair price to pay when rookie teams try to throw 60 times a game. The good teams don't get sacked that often, even early in rookie.
TehKyou
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Originally posted by Galithor
Here's a quick guide to picking the right plays:
1. Play must be 3/4WR.
2. WR3 must be first or second read.
3. WR3 route must be flag, streak, hook, out, wheel type routes. Nothing where they break to the inside.
4. Routes with a cut, like flag or out, need to make that break in the 5-7 yard range. Don't run deep corner where WR3 doesn't break outside till way late. Takes too long.
5. set flag route plays to the highest priority. hook routes second highest. out routes to the lowest (they don't gain enough yards).
6. Put your best two receivers at WR3. Preferably guys that can catch and have some sprinting and quickness. Give them high contracts if possible to improve heart for any drops.
How to build the QB:
1. Spend all initial points on Pass Awareness. Take Quick Read as your first SA. Should be able to get 32-33 depending on attributes and traits. Spend first several games on pass awareness. By game 4-5, you can have 40 pass awareness.
2. Get conditioning up to 35 or so next.
3. Definitely go with a high contract, and then get 25 heart next after conditioning. With high contract, that's 50 effective heart.
4. Now take awareness to 50.
5. Work on other passing skills. You should be nearly immune to M/O sacks by now. Your bigger issue will be drops and overthrows at this point.
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw. Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
Here's a quick guide to picking the right plays:
1. Play must be 3/4WR.
2. WR3 must be first or second read.
3. WR3 route must be flag, streak, hook, out, wheel type routes. Nothing where they break to the inside.
4. Routes with a cut, like flag or out, need to make that break in the 5-7 yard range. Don't run deep corner where WR3 doesn't break outside till way late. Takes too long.
5. set flag route plays to the highest priority. hook routes second highest. out routes to the lowest (they don't gain enough yards).
6. Put your best two receivers at WR3. Preferably guys that can catch and have some sprinting and quickness. Give them high contracts if possible to improve heart for any drops.
How to build the QB:
1. Spend all initial points on Pass Awareness. Take Quick Read as your first SA. Should be able to get 32-33 depending on attributes and traits. Spend first several games on pass awareness. By game 4-5, you can have 40 pass awareness.
2. Get conditioning up to 35 or so next.
3. Definitely go with a high contract, and then get 25 heart next after conditioning. With high contract, that's 50 effective heart.
4. Now take awareness to 50.
5. Work on other passing skills. You should be nearly immune to M/O sacks by now. Your bigger issue will be drops and overthrows at this point.
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw. Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
Edited by TehKyou on May 28, 2014 10:49:18
Galithor
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Originally posted by TehKyou
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw. Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
You know what'd work is they could cut it down a bunch by reordering 4 WR Unders from SB spread to go to WR3 second instead of WR4. It's too rare that the QB makes it to the 4th read to rely on 4 WR Unders in my experience. Though I should probably test that more now that my team is seasoned and our QB is significantly better.
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw. Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
You know what'd work is they could cut it down a bunch by reordering 4 WR Unders from SB spread to go to WR3 second instead of WR4. It's too rare that the QB makes it to the 4th read to rely on 4 WR Unders in my experience. Though I should probably test that more now that my team is seasoned and our QB is significantly better.
Edited by Galithor on May 28, 2014 11:20:25
bhall43
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We definitely don't need to make WR Unders more awesome by hitting the guy with Slot Machine first. 
bhall43
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Originally posted by TehKyou
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw.
First of all you are running a lot of plays right into the FS which also take considerable amounts of time. Example HB Clear sends WR3 directly at the FS and takes a long time to develop. Also a lot of your sacks are coming from 2nd and 3rd and really long. You have rushed the ball twice all this season. You are basically asking for this sort of treatment.
Originally posted by TehKyou
Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Ya no DC wants to see this.
Originally posted by TehKyou
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
Definitely not the most effective play. Especially at the Sophmore level.
Originally posted by TehKyou
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
I am assuming this was the playbook you used against Shangri-La. From quick scouting that plan it has the problems I mentioned above.
Believe me, I've tried that. The FS covers too much ground to make wr3 a threat, passes often end in a knock loose or a trailing deflection, until the FS's run out of energy. honestly I'd like to see the free safety line up over the top like a cover 1, but still do man, that way the WR3 has the ability to try to drag or slant inside for a quick throw.
First of all you are running a lot of plays right into the FS which also take considerable amounts of time. Example HB Clear sends WR3 directly at the FS and takes a long time to develop. Also a lot of your sacks are coming from 2nd and 3rd and really long. You have rushed the ball twice all this season. You are basically asking for this sort of treatment.
Originally posted by TehKyou
Or give QBs a pre-snap ability to let change progression order to target any receiver not directly covered first, regardless of the play call
Ya no DC wants to see this.
Originally posted by TehKyou
Currently the most effective play I've seen vs MO is wr3 screen out of the spread. wr4 pulls the SS safety over to the far side, and if the WR3 can catch the pass without falling down (big if) can get at least a 10 yards minimum if WR1 blocks his guy. However any other play that has a defender actually line up on WR3 renders the screen useless.
Definitely not the most effective play. Especially at the Sophmore level.
Originally posted by TehKyou
I have a playbook and depth chart dedicated to beating Middle Overload, if I spot it during scouting I'll use it. Unfortunately if they don't use Middle Overload at least 80% of the time it's useless
I am assuming this was the playbook you used against Shangri-La. From quick scouting that plan it has the problems I mentioned above.
bhall43
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When you are using plays that your team isn't properly built for it becomes problematic. Example: me using 2 WR deep plays in rookie right now.
TehKyou
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Yeah, I used it against shangrila and this game http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/game/63936
HB Clear isn't in my anti-MO playbook. At least it's not now when I just checked. Since I've only used it twice so far I'm still tweaking it.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63936/713365 this is the desired effect of the WR3 screen.
We probably could have done better on some plays if the QB had more than just 25 passing power, especially if he could actually lead the receiver, but the investment we needed in pass awareness, pocket awareness, accuracy and passing technique are more important to our team. I'll also concede we had some bad luck early in the game with drops, early sacks, and other shenanigans you risk by being a 99.95% passing team.
I fully anticipate people stacking their defenses against my passes. You think I'm surprised by the amount of blitzing I face? I've been building my team to combat blitzes since day 1 of rookie. We thrive on one on one interactions between WRs and CBs (if the QB gets the ball off and it's on target)We are actually starting to suck more vs. 3-4 rushers and high coverage defenses. MO is the play we struggle the most against though. The OLBs go around the tackles so quickly (LOT usually goes straight for the DE) and the FS covers the WR3 better than I expected.
I only commented on this because someone else brought it up about it's strength vs. outside runs. But since I run an entirely passing team my experience with Middle Overload happens to be with it's proficiency against the pass. Middle Overload should be absurdly good against inside rushes. Absurdly weak to outside rushes (pitches) and screens. I also feel that if it is used against multi-WR sets, especially if one of those receivers is uncovered there should be a chance to make a play to the initially uncovered receiver.
That's all, not really whining, you guys can carry on with the MO vs. pitch play discussion. Just wanted to throw my opinion on the play vs. the pass out there
HB Clear isn't in my anti-MO playbook. At least it's not now when I just checked. Since I've only used it twice so far I'm still tweaking it.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63936/713365 this is the desired effect of the WR3 screen.
We probably could have done better on some plays if the QB had more than just 25 passing power, especially if he could actually lead the receiver, but the investment we needed in pass awareness, pocket awareness, accuracy and passing technique are more important to our team. I'll also concede we had some bad luck early in the game with drops, early sacks, and other shenanigans you risk by being a 99.95% passing team.
I fully anticipate people stacking their defenses against my passes. You think I'm surprised by the amount of blitzing I face? I've been building my team to combat blitzes since day 1 of rookie. We thrive on one on one interactions between WRs and CBs (if the QB gets the ball off and it's on target)We are actually starting to suck more vs. 3-4 rushers and high coverage defenses. MO is the play we struggle the most against though. The OLBs go around the tackles so quickly (LOT usually goes straight for the DE) and the FS covers the WR3 better than I expected.
I only commented on this because someone else brought it up about it's strength vs. outside runs. But since I run an entirely passing team my experience with Middle Overload happens to be with it's proficiency against the pass. Middle Overload should be absurdly good against inside rushes. Absurdly weak to outside rushes (pitches) and screens. I also feel that if it is used against multi-WR sets, especially if one of those receivers is uncovered there should be a chance to make a play to the initially uncovered receiver.
That's all, not really whining, you guys can carry on with the MO vs. pitch play discussion. Just wanted to throw my opinion on the play vs. the pass out there
Edited by TehKyou on May 28, 2014 12:16:27
Galithor
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Originally posted by TehKyou
Yeah, I used it against shangrila and this game http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/game/63936
HB Clear isn't in my anti-MO playbook. At least it's not now when I just checked. Since I've only used it twice so far I'm still tweaking it.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63936/713365 this is the desired effect of the WR3 screen.
We probably could have done better on some plays if the QB had more than just 25 passing power, especially if he could actually lead the receiver, but the investment we needed in pass awareness, pocket awareness, accuracy and passing technique are more important to our team.
I fully anticipate people stacking their defenses against my passes. You think I'm surprised by the amount of blitzing I face? I've been building my team to combat blitzes since day 1 of rookie. We thrive on one on one interactions between WRs and CBs (if the QB gets the ball off and it's on target). MO is the play we struggle the most against. The OLBs go around the tackles so quickly and the FS covers the WR3 better than I expected.
I only commented on this because someone else brought it up. Middle Overload should be absurdly good against inside rushes. Absurdly weak to outside rushes (pitches) and screens. I also feel that if it is used against multi-WR sets, especially if one of those receivers is uncovered there should be a chance to make a play to the initially uncovered receiver.
Have you tried Diamonds from SB Spread? It's like a poor mans version of 4 WR Unders and it looks at WR 3 first. Unfortunately I've not had the chance to view my anti-MO passing packages yet this season in action.
Originally posted by bhall43
We definitely don't need to make WR Unders more awesome by hitting the guy with Slot Machine first.
Does that SA even work? I can't recall ever having see it actually fire on Air Raid's slot receiver that has it. I think it's broken like Coverage Commander. And, uh, disagree. Yes we do
Yeah, I used it against shangrila and this game http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/game/63936
HB Clear isn't in my anti-MO playbook. At least it's not now when I just checked. Since I've only used it twice so far I'm still tweaking it.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/63936/713365 this is the desired effect of the WR3 screen.
We probably could have done better on some plays if the QB had more than just 25 passing power, especially if he could actually lead the receiver, but the investment we needed in pass awareness, pocket awareness, accuracy and passing technique are more important to our team.
I fully anticipate people stacking their defenses against my passes. You think I'm surprised by the amount of blitzing I face? I've been building my team to combat blitzes since day 1 of rookie. We thrive on one on one interactions between WRs and CBs (if the QB gets the ball off and it's on target). MO is the play we struggle the most against. The OLBs go around the tackles so quickly and the FS covers the WR3 better than I expected.
I only commented on this because someone else brought it up. Middle Overload should be absurdly good against inside rushes. Absurdly weak to outside rushes (pitches) and screens. I also feel that if it is used against multi-WR sets, especially if one of those receivers is uncovered there should be a chance to make a play to the initially uncovered receiver.
Have you tried Diamonds from SB Spread? It's like a poor mans version of 4 WR Unders and it looks at WR 3 first. Unfortunately I've not had the chance to view my anti-MO passing packages yet this season in action.
Originally posted by bhall43
We definitely don't need to make WR Unders more awesome by hitting the guy with Slot Machine first.
Does that SA even work? I can't recall ever having see it actually fire on Air Raid's slot receiver that has it. I think it's broken like Coverage Commander. And, uh, disagree. Yes we do
Edited by Galithor on May 28, 2014 12:15:46
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