Warrior General Games

Sup Scott, been awhile Bro ;p... funny how i thought to check on the gold thread and i see your name pop up. I've been looking at your facebook from time to time making sure you're still alive. Shout at me sometime.

BTW one thing McCollums didn't mention was during the season that we won (Me and Dony) .. Scott was helping Dony with AI's. There is no doubt in my mind McCollums won whenever he put his mind to it, noone topped him when he had time/desire and the right builds.

Hello

I’m not dead yet. I still log in twice every month to check on my good old friends and just to extend ownership for the grenadiers team. How's everyone doing?

Last time I checked, this forum was a ghost town. I don’t know how I missed this one. This is an interesting topic that brings back a lot of good memories.

With all due respect to mccollums, his statements would hold more water if he had actually accepted my offer to become one of the staff members of the Grenadiers. Mccollums being my good old friend, I’m sure this wasn’t intentional but I just want to make sure people aren’t misled about it.

First, Grenadiers dynasty didn’t just “miraculously” happened in S20. It started in S18 when we swept everything but the gold league and it was back then when tournament games were extremely competitive. We actually had the recent win against FGC before the playoff started and a lot of people saw us as the favorite.

We lost the most important one and jkid deserves all the credit but people forget how dominant Maine and co were that season.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4342861

I don’t actually blame the people that remember FGC more that season and it’s actually the reason why we started focusing on winning the gold league only instead of trying to win everything. That’s when we went on a 4-peat run in gold league. And won our 5th title in S25 as Shy Town Bears, which ended up being the last competitive season.

S19 BNI
S20 Maine
S21 Maine
S22 Maine
S25 Shy Town

All in all, we were the defending champion when mccollums joined Maine in S20. Keep in mind, I didn’t go to him, he came to me.


I offered mccollums the co-owner job which he refused. I asked him if he wanted to be either OC or DC and share roles—he refused. He still wanted to contribute so we talked about builds for about little less than a week and then he went on a hiatus for the entire season and came back like couple hours before the final game. After congratulating me, he went on another hibernation that lasted 2 seasons. We had no interaction other than him signing in to assign SP for his players.

As much as I respect mccollums and what he has done for PW, I don’t see how his influence go beyond the 7-10 players he built for Maine and only around 3 in S22 considering how I ended up disagreeing with a lot of his idea. At the end of the day with the exception of his players and guzz where I gave absolute freedom I came up with all the build plans based on my own training method and my own idea on majority of the players which a lot of them turned out vastly different from his, with exception of couple of positions with obvious generic builds.

To break the myth, Mccollums builds were nothing extraordinary looking. What he did best was he knew how to optimize them better and had a rather peculiar build strategy where it only involved intense training and using BTs to buy superior equipments which I never implemented in my own build plans. I don’t want to go specific since I’m willing to keep my end of the promise.

I think mccollums real strength relies on his coordinating skills and overall knowledge of how the sim works, especially his DCing skills.

Once again this isn’t a knock on mccollums because I have a lot of respect for him but it’s about time I let people know what really happened behind the firmly closed door of Grenadiers locker room.

As Gerr said if we were to rank the owner/coordinators I wouldn’t mind people putting mccollums on top although I would definitely do my best to plead my case!

Originally posted by RaphaneKnight


First, Grenadiers dynasty didn’t just “miraculously” happened in S20. It started in S18 when we swept everything but the gold league and it was back then when tournament games were extremely competitive. We actually had the recent win against FGC before the playoff started and a lot of people saw us as the favorite.

We lost the most important one and jkid deserves all the credit but people forget how dominant Maine and co were that season.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4342861

I don’t actually blame the people that remember FGC more that season and it’s actually the reason why we started focusing on winning the gold league only instead of trying to win everything.

Well, there's a reason why FG never won a tournament until season 22, it's because that was when I started gameplanning for tournaments and had a separate AI and around when the tactics calendar came out. I gameplanned really hard for our playoff game and I didn't really care about anything else since I hadn't won a gold title yet. However, after a few seasons of failure, I decided to renew my focus on tournaments. All that being said though, I still managed a 10-10 record against Maine, so it's not like we were that bad. However, I give Maine all the credit, they were a better team where it counted and they deserve all the praise they have gotten.

Originally posted by jkid2
Well, there's a reason why FG never won a tournament until season 22, it's because that was when I started gameplanning for tournaments and had a separate AI and around when the tactics calendar came out. I gameplanned really hard for our playoff game and I didn't really care about anything else since I hadn't won a gold title yet. However, after a few seasons of failure, I decided to renew my focus on tournaments. All that being said though, I still managed a 10-10 record against Maine, so it's not like we were that bad. However, I give Maine all the credit, they were a better team where it counted and they deserve all the praise they have gotten.


Thanks I guess that's a mutual respect. But I agree you can't have them all. Since S19 we stopped caring too much about tournaments and focused solely on winning the gold championship. S25 is epitome of that where we slow build during the regular season and played with a 20 man type roster. We weren't just holding on to our boost but we weren't assigning SPs for a lot of the players. Our goal was to boost when we started losing which didn't happen and we surprisingly ended up finishing 1st in the west. What we did was try to limit the plays in 2WR formation so we won't get depleted. I know builds plays a huge factor but PW in my opinion is and always be a coordinator's league and it's what makes it a great league. It's too bad Bort couldn't make full advantage of this because he could have made this into something like chess, a life time hobby.

The potential was unfathomable. For instance, I can say for certainty that even in peak of my career which was S25 there were so much I could have done to improve and S25 shy town builds were unquestionably the most explosive builds ever seen at a PW level. If I had revealed my builds you guys wouldn't believe it. Crazy how there was still a lot of room to improve upon it. Builds were extremely complicated where it involved enhanced training where it went back and forth and involved all available training method from multiple training, intense/normal/light training. And I would constantly revised the build during the season (10 times total). I really made 68guns life a living hell for sure

And this is really nothing compare to the depth of scouting/game planning. The amount of discussion that went back and forth with jackson55555 we could probably write a book about it. When we are talking about DCing, we are talking about half of a dot, a quarter of a dot difference. That's the amount of details we put into this game. The eagles would actually open up the source and explain the sims in Xs and Ys and write an essay about it. There is a reason why we had the doors firmly closed since we wanted to enjoy that advantage.

It paid off and we ended up winning 5 gold titles, 4 Air attack tourneys, 5 silver tourneys, 6 major tournaments. (3 PW cup/official tournament, 2 addicts, 1 FTW) I know mccollums is saying how he and dony would have been unquestionably #1 but we beat them in our last game with both teams near their peak

http://goallineblitz.com/game/game.pl?game_id=1882937

It should have been 27-10 if we didn't kneel down at the end.

Anyways, I know the PW scene is nowhere competitive as it used to be but I have to give credit to those who are still playing. It's the only reason keeping the PW name alive, so keep it up guys! Every PWers get my respect.

Originally posted by RaphaneKnight
Thanks I guess that's a mutual respect. But I agree you can't have them all. Since S19 we stopped caring too much about tournaments and focused solely on winning the gold championship.

What happened was that in seasons 17 and 18, I saved some stuff that I didn't reveal all season just for you guys in the playoffs because I knew it was the only way I could win. After that, I didn't have anything left and you were too good for me by then. The reason why I eventually picked it up in tournaments in season 22 was because that season they put in new formations and plays. That allowed me to gameplan for tournaments without giving anything away because I knew that teams would still have weaknesses due to the increase in plays and more options. I wish you were still around now, I always loved competing against you. From your description of gameplanning, it sounds like you were really precise which explains why beating you was so hard.

Originally posted by RaphaneKnight

And this is really nothing compare to the depth of scouting/game planning. The amount of discussion that went back and forth with jackson55555 we could probably write a book about it. When we are talking about DCing, we are talking about half of a dot, a quarter of a dot difference. That's the amount of details we put into this game. The eagles would actually open up the source and explain the sims in Xs and Ys and write an essay about it. There is a reason why we had the doors firmly closed since we wanted to enjoy that advantage.

War and Peace has nothing on those topics. My game planning for Maine those first 3 seasons was absurd, glad I'm never doing that again. Also, I am glad we never discussed builds much, outside of our test builds, since all of that would have probably burned me out before the season started.

Originally posted by Jackson55555
War and Peace has nothing on this topics. My game planning for Maine those first 3 seasons was absurd, glad I'm never doing that again. Also, I am glad we never discussed builds much, outside of our test builds, since all of that would have probably burned me out before the season started.



You sound like you killed yourself over this game. I never did that with gameplanning, but I couldn't considering how many players I've always had and how I always am part of non pee wee teams.

I'm extremely lazy, so what I consider absurd might be considered normal to other people. I also spread things out over the course of a day or two, since I did it at work.

Yeah, it’s not how long you game plan but how fast and efficiently you can do it. At the highest level you’ll need to make snap decisions after snap decisions in order to constantly update your large AI or else be content with smaller lesser detailed AI.

Problem is people put too much time in game planning and less time honing their actual game planning/scouting skills or obtaining knowledge. It should be opposite.

Someone like Jackson would do things in 30 min what lesser experienced coords will do in 2-3 hours.

Originally posted by jkid2
What happened was that in seasons 17 and 18, I saved some stuff that I didn't reveal all season just for you guys in the playoffs because I knew it was the only way I could win. After that, I didn't have anything left and you were too good for me by then. The reason why I eventually picked it up in tournaments in season 22 was because that season they put in new formations and plays. That allowed me to gameplan for tournaments without giving anything away because I knew that teams would still have weaknesses due to the increase in plays and more options. I wish you were still around now, I always loved competing against you. From your description of gameplanning, it sounds like you were really precise which explains why beating you was so hard.

Well I'm retired for good.

I won't lie, I'm going to miss competing/game planning against you guys (good memories!) but past is past, and sometimes you just have to move on. Besides I'm way too busy in RL to have any serious hobby now. I started golf recently but I rarely have the time to practice lol

Originally posted by RaphaneKnight
Well I'm retired for good.

I won't lie, I'm going to miss competing/game planning against you guys (good memories!) but past is past, and sometimes you just have to move on. Besides I'm way too busy in RL to have any serious hobby now. I started golf recently but I rarely have the time to practice lol


I for one would love to see you come back. One obvious way to revive the competition level in pee wee is having some of the top owners and coordinators return. I wasn't any where near good enough to play in gold back in those days, so I know you wont know me but I did keep an eye on gold and watched a ton of the games and not to mention admired how talented everyone was.

89Stepside... what's up!

JStrong... I'll send ya a message to update you on my new life...lol


RK, that's why I said lightly influenced Remember, we exported spreadsheets and compared rosters after S19 - that alone was worth it's wait in Gold ( no pun intended ) ... I still have those spreadsheets too I think we both learned alot about builds when we shared them.... and like I mentioned, when you gave up being OC and DC - you were able to spend more time to work on builds... and you and Guzz had some phenomenal builds. I think our conversations helped you (me too)- how could it not? Remember, Tombstone/Goats/Crackertown CB builds were always top notch.

I still remember the builds on BNI - I really liked the Dline builds on that team. I really liked that Crackertown team though.... we got upset because of bad coordinating on my part. I should have pinched the DTs and DEs in the first quarter and called more Singleback pitch left sweeps and we would have won against Sons of Anarchy pretty easily. I think the strength of those Crackertown builds were DBs, coverage LBs, and WRs.

I did start quad training when the accelerated development came out.. but before that I would create a couple of specialty players that were game changers. I remember in S20, before accelerated player dev .. i had a HB that had 87 speed 46 agility. When he got loose, he was GONE.

I do remember the S25 game - and I remember us PMing before you announced that you were the DC - - but I was not at my peak as a coordinator. I didn't even know some of the new plays because I didn't pay attention during the season. I even told you that Crackertown was going to lose that game because the coordinators of Shy Town had a better handle on the sim then I did. I wanted to see if I could play a gold season and coast and still have fun.... the truth is, it wasn't fun because when the playoffs rolled around there were too many changes in the sim that season... That's the tough part about this game and the main reason I retired.. it took too much effort to stay on top... I wish I would have saved the Crackertown S25 builds - they were pretty awesome too - I just half assed the AI and it showed. S24 Crackertowns were pretty good too, I believe that was the first season of accelerated player dev. S24 Crackertown had one of the most dominant playoffs runs... similar to s17 Goats and Maine dynasty run...S21 Maine that dominated? can't remember.

Maine is #1 on this list and should be. I just wanted to throw another wrinkle in there since I believe Crabs and the coaches/agents played a big role in Gold.. but since this topic was always based on franchises ( and it should be) .. the Crabs/Tombstone/Goats/Crackertown could never be considered.

a few other thoughts...

I do agree with RK.. builds are important .. but AI is more important. Guzz and Jackson did a GREAT job when they took over the Maine AI.

Luck plays a part in alot of seasons too. I squeeked by a few games early in my Gold career that should have been losses.. and the game is based on football w/ auto adjust... best team doesn't always win and sometimes the best AI doesn't win.

Mccollums,

So do I get the lightly influenced credit for S24 crackertown win as well then? It's all good. You know I respect you a lot. It's just that I didn't feel like you were really part of our team since you were pretty much absent throughout our entire dynasty run with Maine other than you logging in and assigning SPs for the players you built for us.

Honestly speaking, the short period of time you and I discussed during off-season is really insignificant compare to the time me, the eagle, guzz, jackson, and shink spent together in our maine's locker room. You wouldn't have known since you were never part of it and I understand why you would come up with such conclusion.

The conclusion I got from the 5ish-day session we had is that I felt we just had completely different philosophy on how we run teams. It's why vast majority of the builds ended up different, some polar opposite. Not to mention how different your training method was.

All in all, I'm sure we learned from each other and it ended up being valuable experience for both of us but in your original post you sounded like you had some kind of a midas touch and everything you touched turned into gold lol I just had to point out the flaws and as much as I respect you the tide was already turning in S18. By the time you join Maine we were already the defending champion and one of the most successful tournament teams of all time. There was no midas touch, let's just make that clear. Maine would have won with or without you.

A lot of whatifs and shoulda/coulda scenario when you failed to win gold in S19 and later in S25 but if we start playing that game it becomes an endless battle. We can only judge from what happened not what would have happened. For instance, Maine was always riddled with bad builds because we were a team with multiple agents that ranged from 15-25. That's already a major disadvantage compare to a team like yours where you always had less than 5 agents with maybe the exception of your original crabs team.

We never faced each other in peak of our career but I believe S25 was closest to it. In fact you had an advantage being the defending champion. Remember, I was on a 5-season break from game planning. It was also the first time I had anything close to an one-man's team.. something you enjoyed your entire career.

Now I'm not saying we are the greatest and we have the biggest E-penis lol but I feel obliged to at least defend my team. In my humble opinion, there were 3 dynasty in PW history.

Pre-gold league era= Short Bus Crew
1st half of the gold league era=Crabs and co
2nd half of gold league era= Maine and co

If you ask me though I would say LSM is #1. Without them there is no Maine. They are the biggest reason why I started PW. They were so much ahead of their time it wasn't even funny. They really set the blue print in PW gold as the first gold league champion.

BTW: 87 speed 46 agility? Nice but I actually liked that agility heavy centered back I came up with They were more consistent. My balanced HB would have been great in S20 as well if Bort didn't radically change the sim since it was awesome in S19. Later guzz came out with this brilliant idea to maximize the speed where I combined it with my agility build. It was ridiculous in S22 and even more ridiculous in S25. No offense but those builds were far more explosive than yours, it's why we had a breakout offensive season in S22. I think guzz really came up with some of the most innovated builds. His scrambling/short passing QB in S22 is the single best build I've seen. With the right scheme it was pretty much unstoppable.

Only problem I had with Guzz was that he was lazy and would sometime go inactive without notice lol. Thank god we had the eagle to back him up!