Warrior General Games

You do realize that there is more than one player on the field. No one is saying that winning doesn't matter. In fact, considering the Colts have won at least 12 games in each of the last 7 seasons, many would say that Manning has done a pretty good job of winning games. We've been through this before and I have no need to rehash tired arguments with you when your blatant homerism doesn't allow you to see anything with an objective eye. The ONLY thing that Brady has on Manning is Super Bowl Rings. But just because Robert Horry has more NBA championship rings than Michael Jordan, it does not mean he is a better player.

Sure, QBs are pretty important to a team, but to sit here and say that you would take Ben over Peyton shows how pathetic you've become in this argument. Ben had a solid Super Bowl run last season, but the year before he had a solid 3 INT performance to help his team get knocked out in the first round. The season before that, the Steelers missed the playoffs and Big Ben had a solid 18 TD 23 INT season. Or maybe it was his first Super Bowl where he lead his team to victory behind 123 passing yards, 2 INTs, 0 TDs and a 22 QB rating.

To sit here and talk about choking after the bomb Brady dropped in the first round this season is pretty typical of your arguing style.

inb4, but he's got more rings d00d!

I have alwyas found it funny when people put Superbowl rings as the #1 defining statistic as to how good a QB is. How many times have you heard "oh Ray Lewis is a great LB, but Ken Norton Jr. has more rings"? Yes, QB's are the most important part of the OFFENSE, but I'm pretty sure that offense is only half the game. (or a third if you count ST's) To make Superbowl wins as THE mesure of a QB's success is just ignorant.

For the record, I think both Manning and Brady are first ballot hall of fame players. But to discount Mannings play tonight as an "epic choke" is a bit much. He was 31/45 for 333 yards with a TD and a pick. Hardly an epic choke.

The Colts had more rushing yards, passing yards, first downs, better Third Down Efficiency, and avg gain per play. Manning made his share of mistakes, but he didn't miss that FG, or drop the passes that his WR's did. (his last pass went right through Reggie Wayne's hands). He also didn't play in the colts secondary and let the Saits WR's catch any and everything they wanted.

Oh, and also for the record, I didn't care who won the game tonight. I'm a Seahawks fan (yeah, I know).

This has nothing to do with homerism and everything to do with winning in the clutch, that is what separates the best athletes from achieving greatness. Some people can get it done when it counts, others don't. Manning falls into the category of not being able to get it done when it counts. Brady has led his team to countless playoff victories in the 4th quarter including all 4 Superbowls, yes including the Giants game. That is what defines greatness. For this season Brady seemed to fall off and lose some of that 4th quarter magic, while Manning appeared to have gotten over that hump, that is until he failed in the biggest moment of his career. There are many others I would put ahead of Manning, in that moment (Montana to Taylor comes to mind). You seem to miss the point that I am saying he is the best regular season QB in the game, but facts are facts and he just doesn't have the playoff resume in my mind to be the best ever.

DS, he did choke because he is the player on the field who gets paid the most money and has the ball in his hands every play he is on the field. Stats are for losers, and the only one that matters is winning. Without a doubt Manning is a first ballot Hall of Famer but my point remains, in the biggest drive of his career he choked, throwing a crucial INT to kill any chance for his team to tie the game up. And I called it before the game was even played just like I did with Favre.

probably just a bad playoff sim for the Colts...

Originally posted by GMathiasf
probably just a bad playoff sim for the Colts...

I like Manning, his throw to Clark on the run was just flat out filthy but in the end he just needed more Heart of a Champion...On to season 14 where like Manning, the GRiTs are consistently there but just can't seem to win the title (I know Manning has one)! Hoping to change that this season...

Originally posted by rjssob
Yup, nobody thinks highly of Brady and the 3 Superbowl rings that he has brought to Boston. What is Manning in the playoffs now, 9-9 with an epic choke on the biggest stage tonight? What basis does anyone have to take Manning? His playoff performances have been average at best...Are you that foolish? Plus, in a big game I would take a few others over Manning as well, players that can perform in the clutch. Big Ben last season, when he led his team to a huge 4th quarter victory and Brees today. Manning is just another Marino, a stat whore in the regular season who couldn't get it done in the playoffs. You people have to start separating fantasy football from real football and the fact that winning counts....

So Brady is tied with Aikman...first QB to win 3 Sb's in 4 years.

Honestly, what killed the Colts was being unable to cover the Saints HB in the passing game. That's pretty much all the Saints did to get themselves back into the game.

Originally posted by palmer_garnett_95
Honestly, what killed the Colts was being unable to cover the Saints HB in the passing game. That's pretty much all the Saints did to get themselves back into the game.

That is what winning QB's do, go to your check downs and throw the ball to the open man or if you are a one and done type Super Bowl QB you throw a game ending INT (see Favre and Manning)....I also disagree in that Colston and Henderson had 14 catches for about 140 yards, so to say it was just the passing to the RB's is more or less wrong.

Originally posted by rjssob
That is what winning QB's do, go to your check downs and throw the ball to the open man or if you are a one and done type Super Bowl QB you throw a game ending INT (see Favre and Manning)....I also disagree in that Colston and Henderson had 14 catches for about 140 yards, so to say it was just the passing to the RB's is more or less wrong.

I agree that Colston and Henderson did damage, but what really hurt the Colts was getting the Saints down and then it seemed like couldn't stop the Saints from getting first downs because of passing to the RBs. Seemed like when the Colts could've put the game almost out of reach, the passing to the RBs turned the tide after that onside kick. Again, don't get me wrong, not saying Colston and Henderson didn't do their part, but I think the inability of the Colts to stop passes to those RBs helped to free up Colston and Henderson even more.

3rd Down Conversions are huge and I don't know the numbers, but I would guess that the Saints did pretty well there. What amazes me about Manning is his ability to sit on the bench for what seems like forever and then come in and 6 or 7 plays later they score and he is back on the bench. Sometimes their own ability to score so quick hurts them if that makes any sense...

Originally posted by rjssob
3rd Down Conversions are huge and I don't know the numbers, but I would guess that the Saints did pretty well there. What amazes me about Manning is his ability to sit on the bench for what seems like forever and then come in and 6 or 7 plays later they score and he is back on the bench. Sometimes their own ability to score so quick hurts them if that makes any sense...

Yes it does. Need to keep your own defense off the field and rest them a little.

Originally posted by rjssob
3rd Down Conversions are huge and I don't know the numbers, but I would guess that the Saints did pretty well there. What amazes me about Manning is his ability to sit on the bench for what seems like forever and then come in and 6 or 7 plays later they score and he is back on the bench. Sometimes their own ability to score so quick hurts them if that makes any sense...

I bet this trend of his play, if you look back through his history, would support this statement. Even back to the UT days.