Warrior General Games

I personally like a version of something that affects training. I think Kentrol was too cautious while Saga went too far, but in the middle we have something like a good system of training VA's:

Each attribute could have a training VA, and when it's trained as part of intense training, there could be a +3%/level bonus to breakthrough chances and a +1%/level bonus to the amount gained in the attribute in any case. The key is to limit it enough it doesn't become universally used, but still make it useful if there's an attribute you want to train a lot. Prereq: 35 in that attribute (so you can't use it to get very low attributes up to decent really fast).

----

I also like Headline Maker in some form, but more along the lines of:

3%/level each off day during the season to increase fan support by 1 point in a random income group, plus gain +5 fame for the player....

But 1%/level each off day during the season that he says something to the press that angers his teammates and causes a 2 point chemistry drop for his team (both in overall and the unit he's on).

Prereq: 900 Fame, 50 Confidence.

Originally posted by Kody 17
Edit to existing: Make Bruiser prerequisite 50 strength and not carrying

Only if you can't complain about fumbling if you don't have at least 50 Carrying.

A lot of the more powerful VA's require something you wouldn't normally have. In this case, the prerequisites are probably doing you a favor.

Originally posted by SAGA45
Hulk (Offense)
This player's psyche is rather disturbing as he absolutely loves being hit and taking punishment. The harder he's hit, the more fired up he becomes. Each level of Hulk grants the player a +5% chance for a +15 morale and +15 energy increase each time he absorbs a Monster Hit, Big Hit, or Big Sack from a defender.

Requirements: 50 Stamina and 50 confidence


Originally posted by SAGA45
Bad Memory(General)
This player refuses to let a bad play effect him mentally. Each level of Bad Memory reduces the morale and energy effects of negative plays (ints, deflections, sacks, fumbles, missed tackles, catches against, pancakes, etc) by 5% when they happen to this player.

requirements: 40 confidence


Could I get some feedback on these two?

Originally posted by SAGA45
Broken Will (Offense/RB)
Defenders absolutely loathe tackling this powerback in the second half. Each level of Broken Will grants a +5% chance to cause a 2nd half -10 morale loss, -10 energy loss, -10% tackle chance, and -10% to the effectiveness of Monster/Big Hit for every tackle that defender misses against that back in the 1st half due to a stiff arm, lowered shoulder, or power through.

Requires 800 fame, 60 strength, and/or 50 carrying

edit: increased penalties to 10% and added penalty to monster/big hit SA effectiveness

Would like comments on this one as well

Originally posted by SAGA45
Originally posted by SAGA45

Hulk (Offense)
This player's psyche is rather disturbing as he absolutely loves being hit and taking punishment. The harder he's hit, the more fired up he becomes. Each level of Hulk grants the player a +5% chance for a +15 morale and +15 energy increase each time he absorbs a Monster Hit, Big Hit, or Big Sack from a defender.

Requirements: 50 Stamina and 50 confidence

Oppose. You shouldn't be able to turn defenders' good abilities against them.

Originally posted by SAGA45

Bad Memory(General)
This player refuses to let a bad play effect him mentally. Each level of Bad Memory reduces the morale and energy effects of negative plays (ints, deflections, sacks, fumbles, missed tackles, catches against, pancakes, etc) by 5% when they happen to this player.

requirements: 40 confidence

And this differs from just getting more Confidence in what way?

Originally posted by SAGA45

Broken Will (Offense/RB)
Defenders absolutely loathe tackling this powerback in the second half. Each level of Broken Will grants a +5% chance to cause a 2nd half -10 morale loss, -10 energy loss, -10% tackle chance, and -10% to the effectiveness of Monster/Big Hit for every tackle that defender misses against that back in the 1st half due to a stiff arm, lowered shoulder, or power through.

Requires 800 fame, 60 strength, and/or 50 carrying

edit: increased penalties to 10% and added penalty to monster/big hit SA effectiveness

Would like comments on this one as well

Not exactly balanced, compared to a VA that grants defenders a 3%/level chance of -3 on Morale/Energy (and a bonus to Big/Monster Hits). I think you have a chip on your shoulder about these abilities actually working.

I could see a 3%/level chance of a -5 morale/energy hit when the player breaks a player's tackle through Lower the Shoulder or Power Thru (Stiff Arms don't hurt, so wouldn't be in that category), but that would be the most.

Hey guys, sorry I haven't kept up with this. I like the new suggestions coming out. I'd like to request some help in balancing out the current VAs as well. I know there are a few that need changes or need a balance on the other side of the ball.

Originally posted by Ken1

Not exactly balanced, compared to a VA that grants defenders a 3%/level chance of -3 on Morale/Energy (and a bonus to Big/Monster Hits). I think you have a chip on your shoulder about these abilities actually working.

Not exactly. Just don't see any counters against them. Thick Skin counters the intimidator SA's but there's nothing against Big/Monster Hit - yet there's a VA that amplifies their affects. My examples are extreme simply because I like to work down to something reasonable and workable. The premise behind 'Hulk' and 'Broken Will' IMO are sound but the numbers arguably could use some adjusting.

Originally posted by Ken1

Originally posted by SAGA45


Bad Memory(General)
This player refuses to let a bad play effect him mentally. Each level of Bad Memory reduces the morale and energy effects of negative plays (ints, deflections, sacks, fumbles, missed tackles, catches against, pancakes, etc) by 5% when they happen to this player.

requirements: 40 confidence

And this differs from just getting more Confidence in what way?

It directly impacts the penalties regardless of the level of competition and directly counters offensive and defensive VA's/SA's that demoralize based on deflections, pancakes, sacks, etc.

Originally posted by SAGA45
Originally posted by Ken1


Not exactly balanced, compared to a VA that grants defenders a 3%/level chance of -3 on Morale/Energy (and a bonus to Big/Monster Hits). I think you have a chip on your shoulder about these abilities actually working.

Not exactly. Just don't see any counters against them. Thick Skin counters the intimidator SA's but there's nothing against Big/Monster Hit - yet there's a VA that amplifies their affects. My examples are extreme simply because I like to work down to something reasonable and workable. The premise behind 'Hulk' and 'Broken Will' IMO are sound but the numbers arguably could use some adjusting.



No, they really don't need a counter against them, and certainly don't need something that turns them into negatives. Hulk is beyond awful.

If someone invests points to get Big Hit and Monster Hit, they should get a significant bonus when those SA's go off, not in fact give a bonus.

I'm perceived as pro-offense, but I'm pro realism and balance. Defenses adapted to power backs, as people like me said and power backs should now need a lot of Confidence too succeed. You really seem to want to weaken Big Hit and Monster Hit, when they're functioning only well enough, certainly not too well.

Originally posted by Ken1

No, they really don't need a counter against them, and certainly don't need something that turns them into negatives. Hulk is beyond awful.

While I'll agree about turning them against themselves. I disagree that there doesn't need to be a counter, especially considering there's a VA that amplifies their effects.

Originally posted by Ken1
I'm perceived as pro-offense, but I'm pro realism and balance.

lol!...I'll leave that one alone, brotha.

Originally posted by Ken1
You really seem to want to weaken Big Hit and Monster Hit, when they're functioning only well enough, certainly not too well.

It's not a personal agenda or anything. Just suggesting something that would hopefully provide some balance and counter against VA's that amplify those SA's affects as there currently isn't one.

I believe that something similiar have been suggested, but I've not seen it on the list except in a quote.
But a VA to decreasae out of position penalty. Though it should variate from what positions you play.
I know that something like that was suggested, but I really think we should work on that one, I think it could help create more variation at defenses etc. specially the 3-4!

Saga, my basic problem is that any SA that works tends to have people wanting to nerf it.

There is a counter to it: High Confidence. You also had one in there to cause everything but intimidation that costs morale to have a lesser effect, not just Big/Monster Hits.

SA's shouldn't be magic bullets that allow people to get by with low numbers in stats like Confidence.

Originally posted by Ken1

There is a counter to it: High Confidence.

Are you serious? That'd be the same argument against Thick Skin, would it not? Yet there it is - a viable and available VA counter against Snarl, Growl, Trash Talk and Glare.

Plus, wouldn't 'Higher Carrying' make 'Mr. Reliable' obsolete? Wouldn't 'Higher Strength/Carrying' make Bruiser obsolete? 'Higher Catching' a counter against Long reach? Yet we still have Bruiser, Mr. Reliable, and Sure Hands.

Really, is a counter to Helmet Crash really all that tooth-pulling difficult to imagine being added to the list? I think not. I know my original idea to have Big/Monster Hit be turned against themselves was arcadish - but realistically - a VA counter to Big/Monster Hit that dampens their morale effects isn't too much to ask for and should be implemented when you consider there exists no counter to them currently and there's a VA that doubles their effectiveness (tired of stating this to be honest). You know I'm right, especially if you're as much of an advocate of balance as you claim to be.


Originally posted by Ken1
You also had one in there to cause everything but intimidation that costs morale to have a lesser effect, not just Big/Monster Hits.

You must be referring to 'Broken Will'. Here it is again:

----
Broken Will (Offense/RB)
Defenders absolutely loathe tackling this powerback in the second half. Each level of Broken Will grants a +5% chance to cause a 2nd half -10 morale loss, -10 energy loss, -10% tackle chance, and -10% to the effectiveness of Monster/Big Hit for every tackle that defender misses against that back in the 1st half due to a stiff arm, lowered shoulder, or power through.

Requires 800 fame, 60 strength, and/or 50 carrying
----

For one it's 5% chance VA that would take a lot to even be made available - 800 fame + 60 strength + 50 carrying. On top of that it'd only affect the defender(s) who missed a tackle against that back in the 1st half. As for penalties, are they too extreme? Should confidence - say 50 or so - be added as a pre-requisite? I'd rather discuss it and work toward something more doable. As I stated earlier, I'm open to dialogue on these and finding a way where they could be implemented into the game.


Originally posted by Ken1

SA's shouldn't be magic bullets that allow people to get by with low numbers in stats like Confidence.

Which is why in my original post of the Hulk idea, it's stated that the proposed prerequisite for it was 50 confidence and 50 stamina. So It's not as if it'd be a SA easily made available, especially for people who want to "get by with low numbers in stats like Confidence" or stamina - people like those who've invested VP in and maxed out Helmet Crash, for example, since Helmet Crash has no confidence or stamina (mental attributes) requirement. Yet it doubles the morale(mental) effects of Big/Monster hit? C'mon Ken1...really? At the very least, each level of Hulk should dampen the effects of Big/Monster hit by 5%. I don't see how you couldn't find that agreeable.

Originally posted by Ken1

I also like Headline Maker in some form, but more along the lines of:

3%/level each off day during the season to increase fan support by 1 point in a random income group, plus gain +5 fame for the player....

But 1%/level each off day during the season that he says something to the press that angers his teammates and causes a 2 point chemistry drop for his team (both in overall and the unit he's on).

Prereq: 900 Fame, 50 Confidence.

the idea is to help teams gain income, and while yes, fan support helps I'd also like to see a bit added to concession sales of the jerseys etc

I like the Streaky VA and have used it some of my guys, but I have always felt it wasn't implemented the right way. The way it is now I feel like you have to max it or not have it at all. Instead of each point of streaky increasing the chance of a hot streak by 2%, I'd rather see Streaky players always have a 75% hot streak change (25% cold streak chance), but each point adjusts the attributes by 0.3% or 0.4%. If maxed, it would have basically the same effect as it does now. But in-between, it would seem more realistic... players with a few points in it would only have their play be somewhat streaky and players with it maxed would have far streakier performances. (Whereas now players with 1 point in it are wildly streaky and players with 15 points in it are actually more consistent.)