Warrior General Games

I would laugh if he turned off elusive SA's again.

looks like its back to powerbacks for season 11.....

Originally posted by mikeandbrooke07
looks like its back to powerbacks for season 11.....

Receiving backs ldo.

Originally posted by Rage Kinard
Originally posted by jrry32



Agreed. Which was my suggestion on using angles instead of just allowing him to fake 1 guy and Bort said he was considering it. Check back around page 13-15...I'd love to hear your thoughts Rage.


I like your input, but I think I may be talking about something a little different. I think yours was dealing more with who HB could see to try and fake. IMO there should be-

1. A max range for head fake/juke to work in. The farther away a defender is from the ball carrier, the less likely he is to be effected.

2. I like your cone idea, but I'm not sure if this is part of it, but head fake should only have about a 120 deg cone of effectiveness and juke about a 150 degree cone of effectiveness (60/75 degrees to either side of front of HB). A player behind or beside a HB is not going to stop because of one of these moves.

Also, I'm thinking that the quick cut SA should not only allow a player to change direction with less loss of speed, but should also be an SA that makes ball carriers plant and changing direction more. This would have more of an effect on defenders farther away as it would cause defenders to overshoot by having an improper angle.

From my football experience

head fake = HB moving head opposite body to try and get defender to follow head. Defenders are taught early to look at torso instead of head so this should be least effective against defenders with higher vision.

juke = shuffling feet and moving hips side to side. Vision isn't enough to combat this. High agility is also needed to be able to move which ever way the HB moves, but this move also forces HB to slow down.

quick cut = ability to plant foot and change direction on a dime. This move is more effective the faster the defender is moving toward the HB, because it uses defenders momentum against him. Like spin, this should be more effective based on the HBs agility, but this should also require a lot of vision in the HB to effectively calculate the angle defenders are taking to make the tackle.

this is very good. please take note Bort.

Originally posted by Iceman16
Originally posted by mikeandbrooke07

looks like its back to powerbacks for season 11.....

Receiving backs ldo.

Or possibly throwing deep to WRs for the first time in 4 seasons?

Originally posted by pottsman
Originally posted by Iceman16

Originally posted by mikeandbrooke07


looks like its back to powerbacks for season 11.....

Receiving backs ldo.

Or possibly throwing deep to WRs for the first time in 4 seasons?

http://goallineblitz.com/images/plays/74.gif will work wonders.

Originally posted by boognish

Ditto. I've been nerfed.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/player_game_log.pl?player_id=39804



If you consider having to play against better opponents nerfing, then yes you got nerfed.

An Hb tries to juke the nearest perceived threat.. if safeties across the field are the ones blinking, then that's just silly. I havent seen that happen though

Originally posted by Rage Kinard
Originally posted by jrry32



Agreed. Which was my suggestion on using angles instead of just allowing him to fake 1 guy and Bort said he was considering it. Check back around page 13-15...I'd love to hear your thoughts Rage.


I like your input, but I think I may be talking about something a little different. I think yours was dealing more with who HB could see to try and fake. IMO there should be-

1. A max range for head fake/juke to work in. The farther away a defender is from the ball carrier, the less likely he is to be effected.


I don't think that the issue is with how far away the player being juked is per se. Just because he is farther away does not make him any smarter. What it does do, is mute his reaction to the juke. If your 20 yards away, even the greatest juke in the history of man kind is only going to change my angle of deflection slightly when I am trying to take an pursuit angle on you down field. However the same juke would have a devastating effect on anyone within 5 yards of the RB because it causes such a drastic change in the the perceived angle that the RB has taken, the difference between a juke and a cut however is that with the juke, the RB returns to the original path or even a direction farther away from the direction of the juke, where is a cut is just a turn that is so sharp, a defender does not have the reaction time, and strength to change his inertia to be able to make a play on the ball carrier.

Originally posted by Rage Kinard

2. I like your cone idea, but I'm not sure if this is part of it, but head fake should only have about a 120 deg cone of effectiveness and juke about a 150 degree cone of effectiveness (60/75 degrees to either side of front of HB). A player behind or beside a HB is not going to stop because of one of these moves.

Also, I'm thinking that the quick cut SA should not only allow a player to change direction with less loss of speed, but should also be an SA that makes ball carriers plant and changing direction more. This would have more of an effect on defenders farther away as it would cause defenders to overshoot by having an improper angle.


I think a blanket cone is not the "best" solution. Though it is a partial one.

Originally posted by Rage Kinard


From my football experience

head fake = HB moving head opposite body to try and get defender to follow head. Defenders are taught early to look at torso instead of head so this should be least effective against defenders with higher vision.

juke = shuffling feet and moving hips side to side. Vision isn't enough to combat this. High agility is also needed to be able to move which ever way the HB moves, but this move also forces HB to slow down.

quick cut = ability to plant foot and change direction on a dime. This move is more effective the faster the defender is moving toward the HB, because it uses defenders momentum against him. Like spin, this should be more effective based on the HBs agility, but this should also require a lot of vision in the HB to effectively calculate the angle defenders are taking to make the tackle.

The fact is that different types of "jukes" work better in different situations.

A head fake, works well against a player who is directly in front of the RB and has the advantage of being able to maintain the highest level of speed if it is effective. It does not work well against defenders coming from right angles or paralleling the RB and hardly at all against people from the rear. It also has the advantage of needing less agility for the RB to make it work. It is mostly a head game, rather than a physical one.

The Traditional Juke takes more agility on the behalf of the RB, as it is in effect 1 quick cuts in rapid succession. The agility of the RB also dictates just how much of a deviation they are capable of. The effectiveness of a traditional juke is that it uses the defenders own momentum against them in such a way as to put them out of position to make the tackle. It works the best against aggressive over pursuing defensive players. In GLB these players fall down on the spot, but in real life unless they slip trying to make the cut back, they more often just run past the RB (and then fall down ). The Traditional juke is very effective against people from the front or back as it relies more on momentum as a mechanism than it does in mentally "Faking" the defender.

The Quick Cut "Juke" relies almost entirely on the RB's ability to maintain a high speed while making a cut that changes the angle of pursuit for the defender to something they can not achieve. This juke is good from all sides as it is a purely physical juke, where deception is not the aim. The Quick Cut juke is used when a player just thinks he can outrun the defender.

A Spin is more like a Quick Cut "juke" in that it relies on a sharp directional change to throw off the defender, with the added bonus that the spinning action makes it more difficult to tackle the RB. It does have the major disadvantage of loss of speed. The spin juke is most often used as the last resort juke when a defender is too close to be affected by any of the other jukes.

And I would add 1 more juke to the mix though, it was one of the more difficult ones to pull off. The high-step juke made famous by Neon Deon Sanders, was a side angle juke that worked because when done correctly created an illusion that the RB was running slower than they really are. This caused the defenders to select poor pursuit angles, and ultimately fail to make the tackle.

A juke should affect ANYONE who witness it. Weather or not they were the intended target of the juke. The witness area for a head fake by its nature would probably be less than for any other type simply because it is harder to see.

But beyond that. What a successful "juke" does is makes a defender change his angles. The farther away you are from the juke, the less your angle is going to change regardless of how bad you fail against the juke.

Beyond that, "Juking" is an action by the RB which has an effect on his momentum and speed that because if its high tie into agility we rarely see a RB penalized for in GLB, and each juke has an in play endurance toll that we clearly are not seeing so far in the sim, where a RB takes off on an outside pitch then basically farts out a juke every tick till he gets to the endzone.

Originally posted by Iceman16
Originally posted by mikeandbrooke07

looks like its back to powerbacks for season 11.....

Receiving backs ldo.

Elusive backs = Receiving backs

You don't need 60 catching to dominate as a RB

Perhaps this has been asked and answered in the last 24 pages, but here goes.

I'm assuming that before the change was made to one juke per tick there was nothing coded that dictated which defenders got juked other than whatever defenders fell in the juke "radius". So we saw multiple defenders getting juked at the same time.

If all Bort did was change the code to say one per tick now instead of multiple per tick was there really any thought (coding) put in to determine who gets juked?

Or maybe it was already coded in, but just not implemented prior to this change?

Originally posted by wombat killer
Perhaps this has been asked and answered in the last 24 pages, but here goes.

I'm assuming that before the change was made to one juke per tick there was nothing coded that dictated which defenders got juked other than whatever defenders fell in the juke "radius". So we saw multiple defenders getting juked at the same time.

If all Bort did was change the code to say one per tick now instead of multiple per tick was there really any thought (coding) put in to determine who gets juked?

Or maybe it was already coded in, but just not implemented prior to this change?

Bort said that the decision is made somewhat randomly, taking into account which defensive player is first to act on a make tackle roll. Check back around page 14(?) for some Bort input.

Originally posted by snoridr16
Originally posted by wombat killer

Perhaps this has been asked and answered in the last 24 pages, but here goes.

I'm assuming that before the change was made to one juke per tick there was nothing coded that dictated which defenders got juked other than whatever defenders fell in the juke "radius". So we saw multiple defenders getting juked at the same time.

If all Bort did was change the code to say one per tick now instead of multiple per tick was there really any thought (coding) put in to determine who gets juked?

Or maybe it was already coded in, but just not implemented prior to this change?

Bort said that the decision is made somewhat randomly, taking into account which defensive player is first to act on a make tackle roll. Check back around page 14(?) for some Bort input.

My question here is not really who gets selected, but how this was implemented if all he did was change the code to say one per tick. Does the above mean that Bort had it coded like this (first player to act) before the change, but it was just never used because multiple defenders could get juked at the same time? Or maybe it was used, but it went through a progression of multiple defenders?

Originally posted by Rage Kinard

headfake and juke (especially head fake) should not have an effect on a defender more than 3 yards away, and head fake should never and juke rarely have an effect on a defender that is behind or to the side of the HB.


I disagree... We have videos here of players being juked from 5+ yards.

3 yards isn't much, and if you bothered to look at replays you'd realize that a head fake from 3 yards means the HB still gets tackled.

Originally posted by taurran
A few highlights from the first video I watched:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtnhwaffAnU&feature=fvst

Head fake on a player BEHIND him at 00:46

Juke on TWO players at 00:56


This stuff is possible in real life.

That wasn't a head fake at 46 seconds. That was him looking to the side. It had no effect on the defender who was already starting to dive at his legs.

At 56 seconds, he actually beats them with the quick cut. The juke occured 54/55 second mark, the first defender was frozen by it, the second defender still maintained his pursuit angle. At 56, Barry then makes a quick cut and uses high acceleration to beat the second defender who is unable to change the pursuit angle. He was not faked out by the juke move.