Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Djinnt
I believe that I am much further to the right than Trump, and possibly as far to the right as you can go depending on interpretation. On the other hand, Trump is much more authoritarian than I am, which is not at all.

My particular stance(s) can be defined by many labels:
right, libertarian, individualist, capitalist, anarchist, classical liberal, isolationist, reactionary, and probably a few more


here's the issue, snowflake. you're hardly unique in having some nuance. welcome to the biggest club ever.

your second mistake is a variation of the first. you need to recognize that there is no laundry-list of positions that all trump supporters must uphold else they are not trump supporters.

if it helps, i spent a lot of time on these forums using "labels" to explain to people how i am not a liberal. the nuance was lost on most everyone, but they were not wrong in saying that i was an obama supporter. did i vote for him? no. am i much farther to the left than him? hell yes. is that relevant? of course not.

here, real talk -- you are indeed one of the more articulate and intelligent people here, but (and here comes the backhand) the way you approach some of these concepts belies your lack of formal education in political science. try to wrap your head around the fact that you could disagree with most of trump's actions and still be a trump supporter. remember we live in a universe of limited alternatives, there's not some trump2 out there that's closer to your preferences and thus wholly superior for you.

Originally posted by Djinnt
I'm also somewhat of a civic nationalist, although I don't embrace social contract theory

who does, except to use it as a whipping boy with their very next breath

Originally posted by Catullus16


here, real talk -- you are indeed one of the more articulate and intelligent people here...

Can you list, in order of most to least, the articulate and intelligent people here ...

I need to know where I land so I can agree and/or argue.

Originally posted by Catullus16
here's the issue, snowflake. you're hardly unique in having some nuance. welcome to the biggest club ever.

your second mistake is a variation of the first. you need to recognize that there is no laundry-list of positions that all trump supporters must uphold else they are not trump supporters.

if it helps, i spent a lot of time on these forums using "labels" to explain to people how i am not a liberal. the nuance was lost on most everyone, but they were not wrong in saying that i was an obama supporter. did i vote for him? no. am i much farther to the left than him? hell yes. is that relevant? of course not.

here, real talk -- you are indeed one of the more articulate and intelligent people here, but (and here comes the backhand) the way you approach some of these concepts belies your lack of formal education in political science. try to wrap your head around the fact that you could disagree with most of trump's actions and still be a trump supporter. remember we live in a universe of limited alternatives, there's not some trump2 out there that's closer to your preferences and thus wholly superior for you.

Agree - a Trump supporter means choosing what you perceived to be the lesser of two evils

Can still disagree with a lot of Trumps actions

Almost impossible to find a candidate out there to agree with all the time - he'll, even some of the time

Originally posted by BigMex73
Can you list, in order of most to least, the articulate and intelligent people here ...

I need to know where I land so I can agree and/or argue.

i'd say you're the wittiest person here, so upper echelon.

at least, you make me laugh the most. lots of types of intelligence out there.

Originally posted by reddogrw
Agree - a Trump supporter means choosing what you perceived to be the lesser of two evils

Can still disagree with a lot of Trumps actions

Almost impossible to find a candidate out there to agree with all the time - he'll, even some of the time


similar to how many people who support the ACA would've completely preferred a different system.

Originally posted by Catullus16
here's the issue, snowflake. you're hardly unique in having some nuance. welcome to the biggest club ever.

your second mistake is a variation of the first. you need to recognize that there is no laundry-list of positions that all trump supporters must uphold else they are not trump supporters.

if it helps, i spent a lot of time on these forums using "labels" to explain to people how i am not a liberal. the nuance was lost on most everyone, but they were not wrong in saying that i was an obama supporter. did i vote for him? no. am i much farther to the left than him? hell yes. is that relevant? of course not.

here, real talk -- you are indeed one of the more articulate and intelligent people here, but (and here comes the backhand) the way you approach some of these concepts belies your lack of formal education in political science. try to wrap your head around the fact that you could disagree with most of trump's actions and still be a trump supporter. remember we live in a universe of limited alternatives, there's not some trump2 out there that's closer to your preferences and thus wholly superior for you.

What is the criteria to be a Trump supporter? To prefer him as President over Hillary?
If that is the case, then I am one. But if we broaden it out further, I would have preferred Gary Johnson over both of them, even if he doesn't know what Aleppo is (lol.) I don't consider myself a supporter of him either though.
The reason I object to the charge of being his supporter is because that's not at all my criteria. Bullshit candidates are foisted on us every couple years and I don't like almost any of them.
Another reason I object is that while I may have some overlap with his policies, I don't want to be associated with him in general. That's too easily a basis for writing off everything I say despite the fact that there's not that much overlap, especially when it comes to more substantive matters. I'd rather stick to dealing with ideas.
My criteria, at least the first one, would be a willingness to acknowledge in any venue that you do actually support someone, as you have with Obama. If you can't even do that, how are you a supporter?

You're right about a formal education in political science. I didn't study it because it's boring and lacked any challenge in the introductory courses. That's not a brag, just the truth. I obviously have an independent interest though.

Pointing out the nuance, as you took it, had nothing to do with drawing a distinction between myself and Trump and everything to do with defining how and whether I am on the right when that issue was raised. Whether or not I am a Trump supporter is already a settled matter as far as both of us are concerned apparently.

Originally posted by Sooner_Nation
disagree with you on every other point you made. I can't remember ever disagreeing on so many different points with someone who claims to be right wing?

I felt this brought into question whether I was on the right at all, which I believe I firmly am.
My response makes perfect sense in that context - one where I further define my position.

Comparison to Trump was the context in which it was initially raised so it was a relevant jumping off point.
Obviously Trump could be defined as some of those labels as well, namely capitalist, isolationist, reactionary, and nationalist (although he leans much more toward cultural nationalist.) I wasn't showing a wider breadth of labels to highlight any divide. It was to make my overall position as clear as possible.

I've already clarified that supporting someone (in my view) comes down chiefly to whether or not you can even say you support them, in any venue. If not anonymously where it matters very little, where else? Secretly inside my head? I'm not a coward with my viewpoints. Even if I were a neo-Nazi, I'd be open about it. If I had arrived at a position, it would be because I found it defensible. I know, I know, alarms blaring about how I can't be objective at all because I have a bias. But that is how I operate. I am a slave to what I find to be a good idea.

I would defend Hillary if someone called her racist on the grounds of association too. Yet I'm not a Hillary supporter. Or am I? If I made a few posts defending Hillary from what I find to be bogus claims, would that make me both a Hillary and Trump supporter in your view?

There's a person named Ben Shapiro, who was openly anti-Trump despite being a prominent right-wing speaker.
He received many remarks over twitter, including the most anti-semitic remarks levied against anyone over the same period, and from whom he claims to be the alt-right, and people who were Trump supporters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX5dBzxKNOw

He's on the right though, and on a few instances he has said that he agrees with this or that policy which Trump has enacted.

Is he a Trump supporter?
I'm just not sure what criteria we're supposed to be using here.

Originally posted by Catullus16
lots of types of intelligence out there.

Very true, but when you try so hard on here in always trying to prove to us that you are an intellectual, you end up always throwing common damn sense out the window. just sayin...

Originally posted by Djinnt
There's a person named Ben Shapiro, who was openly anti-Trump despite being a prominent right-wing speaker.
He received many remarks over twitter, including the most anti-semitic remarks levied against anyone over the same period, and from whom he claims to be the alt-right, and people who were Trump supporters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX5dBzxKNOw

He's on the right though, and on a few instances he has said that he agrees with this or that policy which Trump has enacted.

Is he a Trump supporter?
I'm just not sure what criteria we're supposed to be using here.

Point well taken. When is the last time you watched some of the old speeches of John F. Kennedy on Youtube?

I swear the dude's points he makes and the way he sounds reminds me of Ronald Reagan. He may of been a Democrat, but he sounded Republican down to the bone.

Originally posted by Sooner_Nation
Point well taken. When is the last time you watched some of the old speeches of John F. Kennedy on Youtube?

I swear the dude's points he makes and the way he sounds reminds me of Ronald Reagan. He may of been a Democrat, but he sounded Republican down to the bone.



Well yeah, liberalism isn't necessarily at odds with conservatism and allows for plenty of overlap. Progressivism on the other hand... Those people are just fucking crazy.

Originally posted by Djinnt
Well yeah, liberalism isn't necessarily at odds with conservatism and allows for plenty of overlap. Progressivism on the other hand... Those people are just fucking crazy.

I suppose it happens...




Originally posted by Sooner_Nation
it's the objective truth that you're not.

Xzibit A = Catullus, the great intellectual says you are.

Originally posted by Djinnt
What is the criteria to be a Trump supporter? To prefer him as President over Hillary?
If that is the case, then I am one. But if we broaden it out further, I would have preferred Gary Johnson over both of them, even if he doesn't know what Aleppo is (lol.) I don't consider myself a supporter of him either though.
The reason I object to the charge of being his supporter is because that's not at all my criteria. Bullshit candidates are foisted on us every couple years and I don't like almost any of them.
Another reason I object is that while I may have some overlap with his policies, I don't want to be associated with him in general. That's too easily a basis for writing off everything I say despite the fact that there's not that much overlap, especially when it comes to more substantive matters. I'd rather stick to dealing with ideas.
My criteria, at least the first one, would be a willingness to acknowledge in any venue that you do actually support someone, as you have with Obama. If you can't even do that, how are you a supporter?

You're right about a formal education in political science. I didn't study it because it's boring and lacked any challenge in the introductory courses. That's not a brag, just the truth. I obviously have an independent interest though.

Not how it works, if you object to anything Democrat, you are not just a Republican, you are a Trump Republican. That being the case, you are required to own every policy Trump makes, his statements are your statements, no exceptions. It isn't about the actual details, if you don't love Hilary, Reid and Pelosi and thought that Obama wasn't super awesome, you are a racist. Ha-Ha!

I voted for Johnson as well, not necessarily as a vote of support but more of a middle finger to Hilary and Trump but I also had the luxury of knowing that it was a meaningless vote. That being said, I voted so in the eyes of many, I have the right to bitch about what ever I feel like bitching about.