Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Xars
Weather should be removed at this point.

Playoff/ SHIP games are dominated by Power backs while Elusive backs get shutdown easily.



I think power backs are just generally better. Our RBs on BSB don't have crazy high power or anything. It also looks like NPWs elusive backs played well against Dream Team which was the heavy snow day. I believe power backs have a general edge due to the contact that they take on and when they put a defender on his back it is a much larger hit to morale/energy than say an elusive HB juking and avoiding the contact altogether. The additional morale loss with cold weather might compound a bit so I definitely see where your theory comes from but I am not sure if it is as lopsided as you make it sound or if it is that much bigger of a seperation between cold/snow and not having it. I am too lazy to dig through all of the games played in snow the past few seasons. Keeping morale up is a big key no matter the weather though. Any game is capable of spiraling the wrong way for any team.

Originally posted by Xars
Weather should be removed at this point.

Playoff/ SHIP games are dominated by Power backs while Elusive backs get shutdown easily.



I don't think its that big of difference, but if anything its prob has to do with morale.

Also, I've shut down power backs easier in the snow because of the same thing with decent intimidation on my defense all around.

Originally posted by Myrik_Justiciar
I think its that big of difference, but if anything its prob has to do with morale.

Also, I've shut down power backs easier in the snow because of the same thing with decent intimidation on my defense all around.

I think this is a good point... it's not elusive backs that are penalised, just high sprinting, so if you have high footwork and quickness, those aren't affected?

Also power backs are so much less effective this season than last, it's a really nice balance on offense now, that I like for sure! I can see they use the weather to mimic the nfl season with it colder towards the end, but last 2 championship games have both been in cold, yet clear weather

Originally posted by Detroit Leos
I think power backs are just generally better. Our RBs on BSB don't have crazy high power or anything. It also looks like NPWs elusive backs played well against Dream Team which was the heavy snow day. I believe power backs have a general edge due to the contact that they take on and when they put a defender on his back it is a much larger hit to morale/energy than say an elusive HB juking and avoiding the contact altogether. The additional morale loss with cold weather might compound a bit so I definitely see where your theory comes from but I am not sure if it is as lopsided as you make it sound or if it is that much bigger of a seperation between cold/snow and not having it. I am too lazy to dig through all of the games played in snow the past few seasons. Keeping morale up is a big key no matter the weather though. Any game is capable of spiraling the wrong way for any team.

NPW scored 31 points against Dream Team - 14 of those points were from the Power HB on Punt Returns. Also, NPW shutdown Dream's Offense for the first three Qtrs to the tune of 89 yards. 17 points scored by Elusive backs in a Playoff game isn't impressive when the Defense shutdowns the opponent.

Did you watch the game or just look at the stats to make your point???

Originally posted by Myrik_Justiciar
I think its that big of difference, but if anything its prob has to do with morale.

Also, I've shut down power backs easier in the snow because of the same thing with decent intimidation on my defense all around.

Watch the NPW Xenos SHIP game. Their HB had 10 yards rushing pre-contact and 290 yards after contact. Our tackling is fine all season long and then blows in cold weather against Power HBs. See NPWs Punt Return TDs against Dream in the playoff game.

Originally posted by Xars
NPW scored 31 points against Dream Team - 14 of those points were from the Power HB on Punt Returns. Also, NPW shutdown Dream's Offense for the first three Qtrs to the tune of 89 yards. 17 points scored by Elusive backs in a Playoff game isn't impressive when the Defense shutdowns the opponent.

Did you watch the game or just look at the stats to make your point???



In fairness here, you went full zone and shut down all dream team's screens, in the hope the passing game didnt catch fire outside the screens, which is why they struggled so much, as well as the effectiveness of defense on both teams, which are incredible

Originally posted by jakedood
I think this is a good point... it's not elusive backs that are penalised, just high sprinting, so if you have high footwork and quickness, those aren't affected?

Also power backs are so much less effective this season than last, it's a really nice balance on offense now, that I like for sure! I can see they use the weather to mimic the nfl season with it colder towards the end, but last 2 championship games have both been in cold, yet clear weather

Nice balance??? What planet are you on??

Outside rushing for most teams is averaging something like 10 yards per carry.

The whole game is broken.

Originally posted by jakedood
In fairness here, you went full zone and shut down all dream team's screens, in the hope the passing game didnt catch fire outside the screens, which is why they struggled so much, as well as the effectiveness of defense on both teams, which are incredible

You've really missed the point. Going full zone isn't and wasn't the issue.

Shutting down their O to maximize our O is the point, And NPWs O scored all of 17 points in a game where their defense dominated.

And you couldn't say that maybe their defense was dominant as wel (barr return TD's). For instance, our high footwork adn quickness returner on xenos does better in snow that any other weather, because it doesnt have as much an effect in slowing him down. Need a little more data than just one game to highlight this. You could also say the rain cand its added fumble potential really limits power HB's, who are known to fumble more than elusives? IM jsut postualting here, that there's pros and cons to all weather situations. The main thing with snow however, is its ability to kill sprinting. So it affect the high sprint, high power running HB's as well, its not just the elusives that are fast

Originally posted by Xars
Watch the NPW Xenos SHIP game. Their HB had 10 yards rushing pre-contact and 290 yards after contact. Our tackling is fine all season long and then blows in cold weather against Power HBs. See NPWs Punt Return TDs against Dream in the playoff game.



The championship day weather was cloudy (no snow penalties), 17 degrees (some additional morale drain for everybody) and 17mph wind (passing/kicking and not related). I agree that I have seen a few more broken tackles at the end of the season by power backs so there is certainly some difference here. I still think that the biggest difference is play calling though. I watched some of the NPW games though to see how my G is performing but do not typically watch full games or anything. I would have to look at what defensive plays were called in the game. Maybe their defense was in good position to stop your HBs. Maybe their builds allowed the to shed blocks at key positions. There are multiple variables other than weather. I admittedly do not have an elusive HB though so thoughts on them are going to be limited data wise. I do see power backs breaking a few more tackles in the cold though. Toughness and morale may have a little bit more weight on defensive builds. SAs like Stiff Arm and Power Through hurt defenders morale/energy by themselves. Additional morale loss in the cold seems to amplify that a bit. I am still not sure that the weather creates that much more seperation between the build types though due to limited data and interest to find all of the data. We would have to know who all the elusive HBs have been since weather was installed and comb over all of the games. I believe elusives are inferior to power regardless of what type of weather there is. There are also far more power builds out there than elusives.

Al look at just the Xenos/NPW games shows that their HB Jakinator had 27 broken tackles in both games. He had 26 rushes in the ship game and 37 earlier in the season. The small sample size shows an uptick in broken tackles per rush. What I do not know is what positions missed those tackles, what was different with play calling on both sides between the two different games and other stuff like that.

Originally posted by Detroit Leos
The championship day weather was cloudy (no snow penalties), 17 degrees (some additional morale drain for everybody) and 17mph wind (passing/kicking and not related). I agree that I have seen a few more broken tackles at the end of the season by power backs so there is certainly some difference here. I still think that the biggest difference is play calling though. I watched some of the NPW games though to see how my G is performing but do not typically watch full games or anything. I would have to look at what defensive plays were called in the game. Maybe their defense was in good position to stop your HBs. Maybe their builds allowed the to shed blocks at key positions. There are multiple variables other than weather. I admittedly do not have an elusive HB though so thoughts on them are going to be limited data wise. I do see power backs breaking a few more tackles in the cold though. Toughness and morale may have a little bit more weight on defensive builds. SAs like Stiff Arm and Power Through hurt defenders morale/energy by themselves. Additional morale loss in the cold seems to amplify that a bit. I am still not sure that the weather creates that much more seperation between the build types though due to limited data and interest to find all of the data. We would have to know who all the elusive HBs have been since weather was installed and comb over all of the games. I believe elusives are inferior to power regardless of what type of weather there is. There are also far more power builds out there than elusives.

Al look at just the Xenos/NPW games shows that their HB Jakinator had 27 broken tackles in both games. He had 26 rushes in the ship game and 37 earlier in the season. The small sample size shows an uptick in broken tackles per rush. What I do not know is what positions missed those tackles, what was different with play calling on both sides between the two different games and other stuff like that.

I think another thing that maybe helps power back, is that its a little harder to swarm them, and gang tackle (which always cuts them down) but even so, I've been working some intimidation on him for just this kind of situation, to wear down a defense, and then use the morale drops to compete better

Its tough to know really, but I do like the weather idea, as it does make you play with a little more variety

Originally posted by BoDiddley
Fair enough. I think like most things in GLB2, it comes to the eyes of the beholder, lol. Too bad Stobie's tool doesn't have weather filters though. Would tell us alot.

I actually mentioned this to him about a week ago lol

In regards to snow and elusives, the big nerf is to sprinting. For a speed RB, the ability to get outside fast, and hit spots quickly is critical(gotta beat the defensive angles). It's why HB ypc goes up from Rookie to Vet so dramatically. Also slows down speed WRs, TEs, and speed defenders. Fast powerbacks are slowed by snow too, but they're success is more based on breaking tackles so they're able to handle it well.

And again, I don't mind weather or snow in principle. It's the way late season league/ladder games tend to favor snow, that puts speed build teams at a disadvantage. Would be no different for passing teams if late games were heavy rain & windy. Which again, is why it would be great if homefield determined weather. If a team has the better record and wants a Packer styled home advantage, then that would actually make seeding important for a change. A high powered Rams styled offense built team conversely, may want the dome.

Originally posted by BoDiddley
In regards to snow and elusives, the big nerf is to sprinting. For a speed RB, the ability to get outside fast, and hit spots quickly is critical(gotta beat the defensive angles). It's why HB ypc goes up from Rookie to Vet so dramatically. Also slows down speed WRs, TEs, and speed defenders. Fast powerbacks are slowed by snow too, but they're success is more based on breaking tackles so they're able to handle it well.

And again, I don't mind weather or snow in principle. It's the way late season league/ladder games tend to favor snow, that puts speed build teams at a disadvantage. Would be no different for passing teams if late games were heavy rain & windy. Which again, is why it would be great if homefield determined weather. If a team has the better record and wants a Packer styled home advantage, then that would actually make seeding important for a change. A high powered Rams styled offense built team conversely, may want the dome.

This does make sense.. I think its keyed to the weather patterns by season that you'd get in an NFL season, so its more likely to be hot in late summer than in winter where its more likely to snow.. however I'd say you're right that it shouldnt be totally predictable, that you can still get some unreasonable weather, like In northern ireland, it rains more in bloody summer than in winter lol. Some more unpredictability in weather does make sense, so +1

I see the point about speed hurting elusives in the snow, but I just know I spent a full run to Vet going against Trogodor (usually 3 times in a season) and I always did best putting a huge wall on him in snow games. That being said, my KY team's have had 50 minimum intimidation to drain his morale in bad weather. If not for the snow, I was not able to slow him down... our nice weather games he ran all over me.