User Pass
Home Sign Up Contact Log In
Forum > Goal Line Blitz 2 > Shifting the Meta
Page:
 
MileHighShoes
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by Galactic Empire
Cov tech would have helped with those come back routes. 4 out of 6 ain't good.


I think his low quickness, footwork, and sprinting had more to do with those comeback routes than coverage tech.

But in fairness, I decided to watch my other CB's recent loss (13-17), who has 80 coverage tech to see if I could discern a difference in movement, although my other CB has more speed, quickness, footwork, deflecting, and man awareness, since he's at Vet and my 0 cov tech CB is at Pro. Also the Vet CB has relevant coverage SA's, while the 0 cov tech CB just has run-D SA's since he was a joke build.

This is the game link.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/game/278490

This is the player link.
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/139776

The opposing team had 2 S* TE's, and 3 S* WR's.

Both TE's had open builds, one had 77 route tech and 77 route elusiveness, the other had 65 route tech and 66 elusiveness. Both had Gold Head Fake.

I understand its possible this may be an unfair comparison, as the team my other CB faced had closed builds so I cannot answer if the other WR's were equally equipped, and this team all the WR's have closed builds as well so I can't say whether or not they had any route elusiveness or not. Also I don't think the TE builds mattered much, I didn't see my CB in coverage on the TE's more than twice in the entire game.

The first half my CB was targeted 4 times and allowed 4 receptions. However I don't think they are relevant towards this comparison. 2 of the targets were WR screens, on one my CB made a TFL, on the other he was blocked and the LOLB made a tackle for a 2 yd gain. On one reception he was in zone coverage and far enough away not to be able to impact the pass, but close enough to still count as a target. And there was one route where the WR made a quick come-back and my CB here looked exactly like my professional CB with no coverage tech and was out of position, but it was only a 3 yard gain. In the first half they ran 32 plays while my CB was on the field, 24 of which were pass plays. 4 of which targeted my CB for 4 receptions.

In the second half my CB was targeted 7 times, and allowed 4 receptions. I'm not sure how relevant most are to this comparison though. 2 of the targets were screens, one resulted in my CB forcing a TFL, the other my CB forced an unable to secure by being on top of the WR. One target was a poorly thrown ball that landed in the grass. One target was a deep pass that the SS deflected as my CB was a step or two behind. Two targets my CB was in good coverage on the TE, who caught the ball anyways both times, perhaps more deflecting would've done the trick. One target my CB was in zone on the WR and bit underneath but didn't make the animation for attempting an interception but instead made the deflect animation, but it went over his head and the Wr caught it for 5 yards.

In the second half they ran 45 plays with my CB on the field. 36 were pass plays. My CB was targeted 11 times, 2 were in zone and may not have counted though as the player page said there were only 8 targets while on replays I saw 11 where my player appeared to be in coverage on the receiver. 8 receptions were allowed, player page only says 6, again 2 of those may not have counted because of the zone coverage.

My impression from watching this game is that my older CB moves very similarly to my younger CB who has 0 coverage tech. I definitely am not getting a good impression of coverage tech so far, but am willing to watch more games of my 0 coverage Tech CB to see how he does when facing quality human competition.

 
Link
 
There are no targets in zone coverage.
 
Rob.
offline
Link
 
I have shifted away from going too heavy in coverage tech personally. I think it has some usefulness but doesn't seem to be as important as I originally expected.

This was my first one: http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/139572
He had no coverage tech for his first few seasons then I added a little. He ended up not getting a ton of playing time in his later seasons.

This guy is a zone defender: http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/156340
Since he's zone there aren't targets/receptions allowed but he has had a lot of success getting interceptions.

http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/165363
Had a nice season last season with 10 interceptions. Coverage tech is low but obviously I invested some in it.
 
MadCow420
offline
Link
 
Intercepting makes sense, but it's expensive and needs a lot to be effective. But intercepting does make sense, but isnt tech needed for INts?
 
Majestic Gent
offline
Link
 
I'm thinking investing all of what would have been invested in coverage tech into physical attributes would probably balance out. With a S* could invest even more in run stopping skills.

Probably 30 - 40 would be good. right before it starts to get really expensive.
Edited by Majestic Gent on Feb 9, 2016 21:39:46
 
GoGetta
offline
Link
 
I tend to agree with MileHigh on this.


http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/player/146535

My latest corner. Career 41.6% receptions allowed. That's pretty good, although there's certainly better. I've always built my corners the with the same basic structure: about 75/75/70 physicals, high deflection, capped man awareness. This is probably the lowest I've gone with tech, but it doesn't seem to deter him. If I were to change the build (and to answer the question as to what to do with those extra points from lower cov tech) I'd have not invested anything into intercepting, and I'd bring his run defense skills up. I don't like having players that are ONLY good against 100% run or pass teams, worthless against the opposite, and can be exploited vs. balanced teams. So I'd definitely put those points from cov tech (in this build they're in intercepting) into higher balance, BRB, and hold ground.

Also, I hate comparing corners more than most any other position, because there's undoubtedly better builds out there that allow higher completion rates due to playing for better defenses. Doesn't seem to matter how good the build is, you're only as good as the rest of the defense allows you to be (due to amounts of QB pressure and morale rates).
 
Detroit Leos
offline
Link
 
CBs are a bit more unreliable than any other defender IMO. I am speaking solely to their pass defense. Some games even good builds will perform well and as expected and others they will get smoked. It really depends on the WR that they are matched up against. Does the WR have high physicals, does he have a high head fake build. Hard to build a pass coverage CB that will not meet his match against some WR at some point. You can build them to defend what majority of people are building on their WRs which is physicals with little to no route elusiveness. There will always be a WR out there that gets the best of any CB. I definitely agree in getting some run support skills on CBs though. It is essential for slowing down these outside runs right now even if he just gets trucked he might just buy the necessary amount of time for help to get there.
 
MadCow420
offline
Link
 
ok well it sounds like they need to buff Coverage tech a bit huh?
since it doesnt sound like its working.
 
Absolut Zero
offline
Link
 
This thread is whack, not every CB slot needs the same amount of coverage tech. CB1, CB2, CB3, etc need different amounts of coverage tech depending on defensive playcalling vs the offensive playcall.

Builds need to match up with defensive plays vs offensive plays. Not every corner should be built identically.
 
doobas

offline
Link
 
Originally posted by Absolut Zero
Excellent point.


Couldn't agree more. We need to get away from cookie cutter builds.

doobas™

 
Rob.
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by Absolut Zero
This thread is whack, not every CB slot needs the same amount of coverage tech. CB1, CB2, CB3, etc need different amounts of coverage tech depending on defensive playcalling vs the offensive playcall.

Builds need to match up with defensive plays vs offensive plays. Not every corner should be built identically.


You also build your whole teams yourself. Most people can't control where their CB's will play. I would guess very few CB's across the game play in the same spot all game/all season. Those type of things are much easier to align if you build the entire defense yourself, which is how you currently view things. Not saying it's wrong, it definitely a very good way of doing things. It's just that most don't have that luxury.
Edited by Rob. on Feb 10, 2016 11:39:36
Edited by Rob. on Feb 10, 2016 11:38:49
 
Absolut Zero
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by Rob.
You also build your whole teams yourself. Most people can't control where their CB's will play. I would guess very few CB's across the game play in the same spot all game/all season. Those type of things are much easier to align if you build the entire defense yourself, which is how you currently view things. Not saying it's wrong, it definitely a very good way of doing things. It's just that most don't have that luxury.


Yup, understood. Assuming active coordinators and agents, it's possible to tailor build paths and depth charts. Shits time consuming, so I fully understand how some teams can't quite manage that.

The one spot where coverage tech seems imperative is CB3. TE Post out of 3WR formations can be brutal with a well placed QB throw. It's useful against TE Drive as well, but that route from TE Post against low coverage tech could be an instant touchdown.

Case in point:
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/277337/263724
 
MileHighShoes
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by Absolut Zero
Yup, understood. Assuming active coordinators and agents, it's possible to tailor build paths and depth charts. Shits time consuming, so I fully understand how some teams can't quite manage that.

The one spot where coverage tech seems imperative is CB3. TE Post out of 3WR formations can be brutal with a well placed QB throw. It's useful against TE Drive as well, but that route from TE Post against low coverage tech could be an instant touchdown.

Case in point:
http://glb2.warriorgeneral.com/game/replay/277337/263724


How much coverage tech does that CB have?
 
Absolut Zero
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by MileHighShoes
How much coverage tech does that CB have?


At the time of that, either right at 50 or just under. If it's under it would still be high 40's. Keep in mind that's a S* WR he's up against.

Having said that, there are some CB spots where you don't even need that much coverage tech. You can "hide" some of these low cover tech guys well against certain teams.
 
Nyria
offline
Link
 
Originally posted by HayRow
I think cov tech counters route tech/quickness, and man aware counters the route elusive (fakes).


This is my impression also. If someone has reason to think this is wrong, I'd be happy to accept the correction, but here's my interpretation (with far less experience than some here have):

Route Tech essentially is a substitute/enhancement for Quickness, and probably Footwork as well that only helps when running routes. If I'm right, a receiver with really high Route Tech could go with very low Quickness and Footwork and run routes about as well. However, he wouldn't have as many physical tools to adjust to an off-target pass or get YAC. A high Quickness/solid Footwork receiver wouldn't need much, if any; but of course it's cheaper than those.

Coverage Tech is similar for defense, though given that On An Island, which only kicks in when the ball is near, gives it a bonus, I'd assume it also helps at least a bit in making a play on the ball-- though, given the OP's experiment, maybe not.

Route Elusiveness, on the other hand, is the chance to lose the defender when making a cut. As in the quoted post, I see it as matched up against Man Awareness. Man Awareness is much cheaper, but that doesn't make Route Elusiveness worthless because not everyone maxes Man Awareness and even if they did, a Route Elusiveness of even, say, 60 will at times defeat a Man Awareness of 80. Head Fake, by putting a floor on the roll, improves that chance (it may also give an extra roll that would not otherwise be made, though I'm really speculating here).

RE may also match up against Zone Awareness when the cover man is playing zone.

Another reason to explain why why RE can be worthwhile despite the cost difference with man awareness is just like...Power Tackling and Strip Tech are much more expensive than Carrying Grip, but it still can be worth the investment, well, for the same reasons as given for RE.

I would say that there's no point, from my theory, in putting a little in RE. Either it should be at least 50 at the end or ignored. I doubt below 50 is enough to beat opponents' awareness more than once in a big while (unlike with Power Tackling or Strip Tech, where you won't do anything a reasonably built running back with 40 in one of them, but you might cause a receiver or QB to fumble).

That's my theory; I definitely could be wrong.
 
Page:
 


You are not logged in. Please log in if you want to post a reply.