Warrior General Games

Ok, you dont get my point

You are talking about things that don't matter. Weight doesn't matter because you are one weight. Your weight doesn't change. Conditioning and agility doesn't change your max speed. Sprinting is the only change to max speed. Thus the % does increase sprinting.

I get what peeti is saying. It doesn't really increase sprinting attribute itself. What it does is that it increases whatever max velocity a player has from his sprinting, whether it's already 100 or not.

Comparably, punt power and punt velocity (which gets boosted by punter SAs) are two different things.

You may or may not argue that abilities can go over 100, but until you really know the answer, it is safe to just assume that they don't. Somebody just has to prove that 100 is better than 100 + 15 for an ability where you can clearly see the difference.

Originally posted by Sean1995
I get what peeti is saying. It doesn't really increase sprinting attribute itself. What it does is that it increases whatever max velocity a player has from his sprinting, whether it's already 100 or not.

Comparably, punt power and punt velocity (which gets boosted by punter SAs) are two different things.

You may or may not argue that abilities can go over 100, but until you really know the answer, it is safe to just assume that they don't. Somebody just has to prove that 100 is better than 100 + 15 for an ability where you can clearly see the difference.

In terms of max speed, yes it absolutely does

You don't know if sprinting 110 is faster than 100. (I realize that no SAs increases sprinting by a certain number, but let's just say)
You do know if a guy is faster when he fires an SA that give 10% boost to his max speed.

No other attribute effects max speed. If you have a higher max speed than normal and are already at 100 sprinting, your sprinting is in fact higher than 100 when it fires.

OK. What you think is true is what you think is true. Just know that some people might disagree with that assessment.

Originally posted by bhall43
In terms of max speed, yes it absolutely does


In a sense, it is the difference between "increasing the skill above the cap" and "altering the outcome to something that could not be achieved by altering the cap".

First Step increases acceleration by up to 150% and increases max running speed by 8%. It does not indicate that it is increasing sprinting it is indicating that it is altering the effects of sprinting. There is a big difference, because it in no way proves that an SA can take a skill over the 100 hard cap.

Essentially what First Step tells you is that every bot has a max running speed. This max running speed is likely 99% linked to sprinting. What First Step does not do is increase Sprinting by 8% or by any fixed number.

Contrast that with Tunnel Vision:

+10 Pass Rush Technique, Power, Sprinting, and Quickness.
All Pass Rush Power rolls are guaranteed to be at least 75% of Max.
-20 Blitz Awareness.

It doesn't say that max running speed is increased or acceleration is increased, it increases skills.
It then puts a floor on the pass rush power rolls, making your power moves more consistent while active.

If you saw someone with 100 sprinting/quickness activate tunnel vision and then speed up, it would answer the question. First Step answers nothing.

Dude, dont try. Idiots just wont listen

Originally posted by Time Trial
In a sense, it is the difference between "increasing the skill above the cap" and "altering the outcome to something that could not be achieved by altering the cap".

First Step increases acceleration by up to 150% and increases max running speed by 8%. It does not indicate that it is increasing sprinting it is indicating that it is altering the effects of sprinting. There is a big difference, because it in no way proves that an SA can take a skill over the 100 hard cap.

Essentially what First Step tells you is that every bot has a max running speed. This max running speed is likely 99% linked to sprinting. What First Step does not do is increase Sprinting by 8% or by any fixed number.

Contrast that with Tunnel Vision:

+10 Pass Rush Technique, Power, Sprinting, and Quickness.
All Pass Rush Power rolls are guaranteed to be at least 75% of Max.
-20 Blitz Awareness.

It doesn't say that max running speed is increased or acceleration is increased, it increases skills.
It then puts a floor on the pass rush power rolls, making your power moves more consistent while active.

If you saw someone with 100 sprinting/quickness activate tunnel vision and then speed up, it would answer the question. First Step answers nothing.

It doesn't give you a set value because it's based on what your current max speed is. Sprinting is the only attribute that effects max speed post creation.

You can't put it in the same context as tunnel vision as you aren't going to say +8% to your pass rushing speed. Nobody will understand that because that is truly effected by several different attributes. Your max speed is not.

Originally posted by peeti
Dude, dont try. Idiots just wont listen

Sorry but your explanation of several things weighing in on max speed is incredibly wrong. That's not how it works at all.

Don't expect proof because you aren't going to get that without Bort's tongue.

First Step pushing you above the normal boundary of 100 sprinting leads me to believe that you can exceed 100 in an attribute. It woulnd't be one way and not the other. Not that First Step is literally a boost to sprinting, but it's correlated in terms of sprinting and max running speed.

My two cents. Again, you can dispute it because there's no such thing as proof here, but I'd put my eggs on yes.

Originally posted by bhall43
Sorry but your explanation of several things weighing in on max speed is incredibly wrong. That's not how it works at all.

I only mentioned weight there, cause it says so in player creation...but thats not even close to my main point I brought

Originally posted by peeti
I only mentioned weight there, cause it says so in player creation...but thats not even close to my main point I brought

You said weight, conditioning, etc. weight has no bearing on this as you are a fixed weight. That doesn't change. Conditioning changes over the course of the game but your max is still your max. If first step fires and you hit a maximum speed at that point higher than what you have gone without it that is all sprinting in charge of that max and quickness allowing you to reach that max instantly.