Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Nif


Thanks to all who've offered to help. It only took me like 7 seasons to see the light

Yeah if the Test Dummies would have just beat you back in Silver 1 those guys would have left a lot sooner. So feel free to blame us and our failure of winning in the playoffs for 10 seasons.

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back
And the Gold league incest continues....why one guys 'deserves' to stay in Gold League is beyond me but i'm sure you guys know what you're doin.....

No one has said Lunch Box deserves to stay in Gold. We still have to win some games and hope the east keeps eating its own.

i think he was perhaps confused with this

Originally posted by Rizyx
absolutely, i hope we can keep LB in gold as Nif deserves a clean slate and im sure next season will be the start of great things for this team

i didnt mean deserves to stay in gold, i meant he deserves a fresh start from all the istoner bashings that him and his team got hooked in with

The main point was the incestuous nature of this recruitment - the same guys in different roles on different teams.

As an example, Rizyx you are already involved with plenty of Gold teams:

DC for SAS
OC for Crib Midgets
OC for Lunch Box

On top of all that you own one team in Silver#8 West and are also OC for another team in the same conference.

Its a ridiculous conflict of interests and competition.

Maybe nobody else see's an issue with all of this - other than potentially perverting the whole demotion process it certainly isn't going to help get any new blood into Pee Wee.

I think you're barking up the wrong tree here. Nothing sinister is going on and there is little benefit to them aside from the feel good vibes of having helped a struggling team out. I have in the past and can still run my own offense but currently I'm attempting to learn all things D AI related that I can with my silver team from Gerr so I don't have to rely on them or you or any more of stoners friends. If they want to stick around anyways them I'm happy to have them along regardless of other affiliations.

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back
The main point was the incestuous nature of this recruitment - the same guys in different roles on different teams.

As an example, Rizyx you are already involved with plenty of Gold teams:

DC for SAS
OC for Crib Midgets
OC for Lunch Box

On top of all that you own one team in Silver#8 West and are also OC for another team in the same conference.

Its a ridiculous conflict of interests and competition.

Maybe nobody else see's an issue with all of this - other than potentially perverting the whole demotion process it certainly isn't going to help get any new blood into Pee Wee.



i think we have been down this route before when manOg pointed it all out, and although i cant defend the fact i am helping on a few teams, i think the reasons why i am on these teams should be acceptable to everyone.

The main reason i DCed SAS was to help a friend on here free up some time for another team he was going to DC for in gold, truth be told i hate DCing lol as i have no clue what im doing half the time

On Crib Midgets i am a scout really as again a friend of mine needed RL time for more important things and so i said i would help out with scouting to make it easier on him to gameplan, i just chose Asst OC as thats what im doing Assisting him but only with scouting.

And lastly Lunch Box, everyone knows what they have been through these past seasons and Nif needed to learn the Defensive side of the ball so i said i would take over offense so he had the time to learn it, that is all

So as you can see i think i have a real weakness for helping people, shoot me.

As for the Silver Teams, i have told everyone that i am not trying with STBP until next season which is when i will be focusing on that team as a OC and DC so i wont have time to help everyone (although i hope that silver league gets more human teams), and as for the other silver team i dont OC them so i have no defense

but i have rambled far to much now, but i apologise to everyone who is unhappy with what i am doing but tough, i have said to these people that i will help them and that is what i am going to try and do.

and its funny you talk about new blood when you own two teams in 2 different silver leagues and are dominating both, where are you giving a chance to another person to step up? these teams i help have already made it so there is no preventing of new blood going on there and the silver team wont win it as you are in the same league as me, as are 3-4 other great teams so i dont think you should be preaching about new blood tbh

Originally posted by Rizyx
i think we have been down this route before when manOg pointed it all out, and although i cant defend the fact i am helping on a few teams, i think the reasons why i am on these teams should be acceptable to everyone.

Exactly, you can't defend it but you are going to list a whole bunch of mitigating nonsense to try and make yourself feel better.

Originally posted by Rizyx
The main reason i DCed SAS was to help a friend on here free up some time for another team he was going to DC for in gold, truth be told i hate DCing lol as i have no clue what im doing half the time

Originally posted by Rizyx
On Crib Midgets i am a scout really as again a friend of mine needed RL time for more important things and so i said i would help out with scouting to make it easier on him to gameplan, i just chose Asst OC as thats what im doing Assisting him but only with scouting.

Originally posted by Rizyx
And lastly Lunch Box, everyone knows what they have been through these past seasons and Nif needed to learn the Defensive side of the ball so i said i would take over offense so he had the time to learn it, that is all

Originally posted by Rizyx
So as you can see i think i have a real weakness for helping people, shoot me.

These are all great excuses, but they don't change the fact that you are ruining the competitive balance of a the league.

Co-ordinating for two teams in the same conference is going to lead to issues - where do your loyalties lie?

Could you use one set of tactics against an opponents to set them up for another one of your teams?

Imagine Bill Belichick deciding to 'help out' with the Buffalo Bills in the last half of the season (right before they have to play the Jets twice) - if Bill told people that he was 'just helping a friend out' I think we'd all laugh our asses off.

Sure, no-one is saying this is anything like the NFL in terms of seriousness, but we all pay to play and i'd rather not see you, and others like you, ruining the balance of the game by being...well...so gosh darn friendly....you ever say no to anyone?

Originally posted by Rizyx
As for the Silver Teams, i have told everyone that i am not trying with STBP until next season which is when i will be focusing on that team as a OC and DC so i wont have time to help everyone (although i hope that silver league gets more human teams), and as for the other silver team i dont OC them so i have no defense

You are down as asst OC.

Originally posted by Rizyx
but i have rambled far to much now, but i apologise to everyone who is unhappy with what i am doing but tough, i have said to these people that i will help them and that is what i am going to try and do.

Your apology means nothing if you don't think what you are doing is wrong, or worse, don't care that it is wrong.

Originally posted by Rizyx
and its funny you talk about new blood when you own two teams in 2 different silver leagues and are dominating both, where are you giving a chance to another person to step up? these teams i help have already made it so there is no preventing of new blood going on there and the silver team wont win it as you are in the same league as me, as are 3-4 other great teams so i dont think you should be preaching about new blood tbh

Really?

Haha.

I was wondering if you'd be lame enough to try that angle - both my Silver teams are in different leagues so there is no conflict of interest - unlike your situation where you are involved with teams who are not only in the same league, but the very same conference.

I should also point out to you that there are multiple CPU teams in both of those leagues so i'm not stopping anyone from owning a team in either.

As a side point, the 2nd team was originally going to be called Kings of Cu, they were going to be a copper team until the reshuffle after I bought them.

You really don't have a leg to stand on.

ive said all i have to say on the matter, you and others decide what you want to believe but nothing is going to change what i am doing this season.

oh and i didnt realise i was Asst OC because i dont do anything on that team but again believe what you want

Originally posted by Rizyx
ive said all i have to say on the matter, you and others decide what you want to believe but nothing is going to change what i am doing this season.

oh and i didnt realise i was Asst OC because i dont do anything on that team but again believe what you want


Maybe you'll give it a rethink for next season because what you are doing is patently wrong,

Then again, maybe you are one of those guys who needs everything spelled out to him in a massive rule book to show him the difference between right and wrong in every single circumstance.

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back

Maybe you'll give it a rethink for next season because what you are doing is patently wrong,

Then again, maybe you are one of those guys who needs everything spelled out to him in a massive rule book to show him the difference between right and wrong in every single circumstance.

Run a screen pass about it

Originally posted by Deluca0903
Run a screen pass about it

Maybe I will

Its a natural counter to the multiple DB sets that all you Gold league guys copied off each other.

Empire the problems with your points are this:

1. This is no conflict of interest from being an OC on two different teams. Your goal would still be to score as many points as you can regardless of who you are playing against
2. Last time I looked the same amount of teams get demoted. So no matter how many coor's are in gold the chance for "new blood" remains the same. Since most gold teams would not hire "new blood" as a coor.

The problem for new blood would be more of "gold" talent flooding the silver leagues since that is what controls who moves to gold. But then again if they are not good enough to beat the "gold" talent there maybe they don't deserve to be in Gold. And at the end of the day the most "competitive" teams are in gold. Whether it is 1 guy doing all the coor or 64 guys. So in the "interest" of competition it should be that way......

The bottom line is this. If you are good enough you will get to gold. And if you are good enough you will stay in gold. And if you are good enough you will be competitive in gold.

Originally posted by Bevo05
Empire the problems with your points are this:

1. This is no conflict of interest from being an OC on two different teams. Your goal would still be to score as many points as you can regardless of who you are playing against

Ha. Interesting perspective...if people were robots.

Rizyx is such a nice guy that I find it hard to believe he'd go all out against one his friends teams (in an OC capacity) if it was likely to relegate them.

If it was a match-up with both of his teams whats to stop him letting the team with demotion worries win by calling a good game for that team and a bad one for the other (lets say the other team are middle of the table).

The problem isn't that this is whats happening, just that it can happen - and that my friend, is a conflict of interests and a pretty obvious one at that.

Originally posted by Bevo05
2. Last time I looked the same amount of teams get demoted. So no matter how many coor's are in gold the chance for "new blood" remains the same. Since most gold teams would not hire "new blood" as a coor.

Well, look at Lunchbox, it appears they are owned by a guy who can't co-ordinate either side of the ball despite them being in Gold League - why should he automatically get a couple of experienced co-ords to help him out?

What about the other teams fighting Lunchbox to stay in Gold league - aren't they being disadvantaged by all of this?

Originally posted by Bevo05
The problem for new blood would be more of "gold" talent flooding the silver leagues since that is what controls who moves to gold. But then again if they are not good enough to beat the "gold" talent there maybe they don't deserve to be in Gold. And at the end of the day the most "competitive" teams are in gold. Whether it is 1 guy doing all the coor or 64 guys. So in the "interest" of competition it should be that way......

This is a matter of opinion. I stated in another thread that i'm not aware of other promotion/demotion scenario's in the real world that require you to be better than the guys in the league above.

You just have to be better than those in your league - thats silver league talent coaching Silver league Dots with Silver league owners.

Originally posted by Bevo05
The bottom line is this. If you are good enough you will get to gold. And if you are good enough you will stay in gold. And if you are good enough you will be competitive in gold.



Its not really a bottom line though is it?

Its not just about being 'good enough' its about doing things the right way.

Everybody acknowledges that there is an issue recruiting new owners/coaches to Pee-Wee yet they won't stop doing all the things that are causing the situation in case it ruins their fun.

Personally speaking I'd love to get one of my teams to Gold, but I won't be boosting this season or any season in the future - its a ridiculously large investment every 40 days.

If I miss out to a genuine Silver team who boosts then thats fine by me - why we have gold league coaches owners coming down to Silver and then compounding that by boosting is beyond me.

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back


As a side point, the 2nd team was originally going to be called Kings of Cu, they were going to be a copper team until the reshuffle after I bought them.



true

Originally posted by Rizyx
you and others decide what you want to believe

am i part of the others ? if yes i believe you on this one

i know.......nobody cares...

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back



Rizyx is such a nice guy that I find it hard to believe he'd go all out against one his friends teams (in an OC capacity) if it was likely to relegate them.

If it was a match-up with both of his teams whats to stop him letting the team with demotion worries win by calling a good game for that team and a bad one for the other (lets say the other team are middle of the table).

The problem isn't that this is whats happening, just that it can happen - and that my friend, is a conflict of interests and a pretty obvious one at that.




i agree


Originally posted by Bevo05


The bottom line is this. If you are good enough you will get to gold. And if you are good enough you will stay in gold. And if you are good enough you will be competitive in gold.



not true, read next

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back


Well, look at Lunchbox, it appears they are owned by a guy who can't co-ordinate either side of the ball despite them being in Gold League - why should he automatically get a couple of experienced co-ords to help him out?

What about the other teams fighting Lunchbox to stay in Gold league - aren't they being disadvantaged by all of this?



not he only ones

Originally posted by Empire_Strikes_Back


Personally speaking ..... I won't be boosting this season or any season in the future - its a ridiculously large investment every 40 days.



agree, for the peewee leagues, look at the CE, it is now to rent, why not just take it off?

The bottom line is this: GLB allows us to own and coordinate multiple teams in one conference. Don't pick on Riz for being one of the many to take advantage of this rule.

A lot of suggestions have been posted as to how to change things to improve the balance of the game, including limiting owners and/or coordinators to one team per league. Talk to Gerr and then go stir up the suggestions forum to try to fix it (ahem..."Do or do not. There is no try." doubly fitting considering your GLB account name ).

The points Bevo brought up are pretty consistent with Bort's point of view...and unless somebody makes an argument that he finds compelling, his current opinion is pretty much all that matters.