Ok, you do that.
Forum > Goal Line Blitz 2 > Vet Ladder Talk 8/12
jfbueno
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Originally posted by Cuivienen
lolwat
May I suggest a visit to the Derek Zoolander School For Kids That Can't Read Good And Want To Do Other Things Good Too?
Further gradation of SP in blocking would negatively effect running more than passing since only marginal pass blocking is needed compared to run blocking.
lolwat
May I suggest a visit to the Derek Zoolander School For Kids That Can't Read Good And Want To Do Other Things Good Too?
Further gradation of SP in blocking would negatively effect running more than passing since only marginal pass blocking is needed compared to run blocking.
Cuivienen
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Originally posted by jfbueno
Further gradation of SP in blocking would negatively effect running more than passing since only marginal pass blocking is needed compared to run blocking.
So you're confirming that you didn't read the part where I said adjust that stuff on the back end good. Cool.
Further gradation of SP in blocking would negatively effect running more than passing since only marginal pass blocking is needed compared to run blocking.
So you're confirming that you didn't read the part where I said adjust that stuff on the back end good. Cool.
jfbueno
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Originally posted by Cuivienen
So you're confirming that you didn't read the part where I said adjust that stuff on the back end good. Cool.
I read the whole thing and I disagree with it. Even an adjustment on the back end probably wouldn't be enough to offset SP gradation changes. Stop with the snide remarks. You're slowly entering Peeti territory of backhanded comments.
So you're confirming that you didn't read the part where I said adjust that stuff on the back end good. Cool.
I read the whole thing and I disagree with it. Even an adjustment on the back end probably wouldn't be enough to offset SP gradation changes. Stop with the snide remarks. You're slowly entering Peeti territory of backhanded comments.
Galactic Empire
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Originally posted by Aeir
Forums seem awfully chippy today
It's playoff time!
Forums seem awfully chippy today
It's playoff time!
Xars
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Originally posted by McGruffHawk
Running sucks. You just can't win at the top level just running the ball, but yoou can just passing the ball.
I know this is the prevailing view, but let's look at some things.
GA is ranked higher than LZ, New England and Mercy Flush on the Ladder. All of them are top Passing teams.
GA is second in Points Allowed at 316 while facing 17 Pass teams vs. 11 Run-orientated teams. If Passing was so OP, how come you aren't giving up more points?
GA held LZ, DA and Mercy Flush to 24 points. Madison scored 17. New England scored zero.
GA beat New England and Mercy Flush and Madison. GA has lost to DA and LZ.
GA is 6th in Scoring Differential in Vet.
Running sucks? Isn't that just a little overboard? Does DE blocking need a fix? YES.
The only Pure Passing teams ahead of GA are DA and Madison on the Ladder. Ever think it's their DEFENSE that has them at the top of the Ladder?
Running sucks. You just can't win at the top level just running the ball, but yoou can just passing the ball.
I know this is the prevailing view, but let's look at some things.
GA is ranked higher than LZ, New England and Mercy Flush on the Ladder. All of them are top Passing teams.
GA is second in Points Allowed at 316 while facing 17 Pass teams vs. 11 Run-orientated teams. If Passing was so OP, how come you aren't giving up more points?
GA held LZ, DA and Mercy Flush to 24 points. Madison scored 17. New England scored zero.
GA beat New England and Mercy Flush and Madison. GA has lost to DA and LZ.
GA is 6th in Scoring Differential in Vet.
Running sucks? Isn't that just a little overboard? Does DE blocking need a fix? YES.
The only Pure Passing teams ahead of GA are DA and Madison on the Ladder. Ever think it's their DEFENSE that has them at the top of the Ladder?
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 10:51:54
Cuivienen
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Originally posted by jfbueno
I read the whole thing and I disagree with it. Even an adjustment on the back end probably wouldn't be enough to offset SP gradation changes. Stop with the snide remarks. You're slowly entering Peeti territory of backhanded comments.
I love the ridiculous assumption that I care about your opinions at all, let alone enough to take orders from you.
I read the whole thing and I disagree with it. Even an adjustment on the back end probably wouldn't be enough to offset SP gradation changes. Stop with the snide remarks. You're slowly entering Peeti territory of backhanded comments.
I love the ridiculous assumption that I care about your opinions at all, let alone enough to take orders from you.
jfbueno
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Rushing offenses have a much higher propensity for being contained/shutdown by good defenses than passing offenses so you'll have a hard time convincing me that it's the defenses of the top ladder teams that are the main deciding factor.
jfbueno
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Originally posted by Cuivienen
I love the ridiculous assumption that I care about your opinions at all, let alone enough to take orders from you.
Thanks for proving my point.
I love the ridiculous assumption that I care about your opinions at all, let alone enough to take orders from you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Xars
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Originally posted by jfbueno
Rushing offenses have a much higher propensity for being contained/shutdown by good defenses than passing offenses so you'll have a hard time convincing me that it's the defenses of the top ladder teams that are the main deciding factor.
I don't disagree that has been the case, but that may be because teams built Defenses to stop the Run whereas more teams Pass now.
Defense:
GA against the Pass: 4.8 YPA on 48% completion
DA against the Pass: 4.1 YPA on 42% completion
That's .7 YPA and 6% of completion%. (The YPC is GA 10.8 vs DA 11.1 - seems very close - a First Down is a First Down.)
Let's look at Fail rates:
Against GA, a Passing O fails 14.06% of the time. The average Passing drive against GA is 7.1 First Downs.
Against DA, a Passing O fails 19.5% of the time. The average Passing drive against DA is 5.1 First Downs.
Did I convince you yet?
(For reference LZ is at 13.2% with average Passing Drive of 7.53 First Downs. My Pass D has sucked.)
Rushing offenses have a much higher propensity for being contained/shutdown by good defenses than passing offenses so you'll have a hard time convincing me that it's the defenses of the top ladder teams that are the main deciding factor.
I don't disagree that has been the case, but that may be because teams built Defenses to stop the Run whereas more teams Pass now.
Defense:
GA against the Pass: 4.8 YPA on 48% completion
DA against the Pass: 4.1 YPA on 42% completion
That's .7 YPA and 6% of completion%. (The YPC is GA 10.8 vs DA 11.1 - seems very close - a First Down is a First Down.)
Let's look at Fail rates:
Against GA, a Passing O fails 14.06% of the time. The average Passing drive against GA is 7.1 First Downs.
Against DA, a Passing O fails 19.5% of the time. The average Passing drive against DA is 5.1 First Downs.
Did I convince you yet?
(For reference LZ is at 13.2% with average Passing Drive of 7.53 First Downs. My Pass D has sucked.)
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 11:05:35
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 11:05:10
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 11:04:55
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 11:02:04
Edited by Xars on Aug 19, 2015 11:00:03
bhall43
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Originally posted by Xars
I know this is the prevailing view, but let's look at some things.
GA is ranked higher than LZ, New England and Mercy Flush on the Ladder. All of them are top Passing teams.
GA is second in Points Allowed at 316 while facing 17 Pass teams vs. 11 Run-orientated teams. If Passing was so OP, how come you aren't giving up more points?
GA held LZ, DA and Mercy Flush to 24 points. Madison scored 17. New England scored zero.
GA beat New England and Mercy Flush and Madison. GA has lost to DA and LZ.
GA is 6th in Scoring Differential in Vet.
Running sucks? Isn't that just a little overboard? Does DE blocking need a fix? YES.
The only Pure Passing teams ahead of GA are DA and Madison on the Ladder. Ever think it's their DEFENSE that has them at the top of the Ladder?
fwiw, GA never played the NE you are talking about.
That being said I haven't switched my defense all season so it is pretty likely I would have failed there too.
I know this is the prevailing view, but let's look at some things.
GA is ranked higher than LZ, New England and Mercy Flush on the Ladder. All of them are top Passing teams.
GA is second in Points Allowed at 316 while facing 17 Pass teams vs. 11 Run-orientated teams. If Passing was so OP, how come you aren't giving up more points?
GA held LZ, DA and Mercy Flush to 24 points. Madison scored 17. New England scored zero.
GA beat New England and Mercy Flush and Madison. GA has lost to DA and LZ.
GA is 6th in Scoring Differential in Vet.
Running sucks? Isn't that just a little overboard? Does DE blocking need a fix? YES.
The only Pure Passing teams ahead of GA are DA and Madison on the Ladder. Ever think it's their DEFENSE that has them at the top of the Ladder?
fwiw, GA never played the NE you are talking about.
That being said I haven't switched my defense all season so it is pretty likely I would have failed there too.
Aeir
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Originally posted by Xars
Against GA, a Passing O fails 14.06% of the time. The average Passing drive against GA is 7.1 First Downs.
Against DA, a Passing O fails 19.5% of the time. The average Passing drive against DA is 5.1 First Downs.
5.1 first downs on average per drive against one of the top teams in the game??
Seeing as though 10 yards is a first down, that's a minimumof 50 yards...which means on average your at the 30 yard line of the opponents (FG range) when a drive stalls, if you started at the 20.
If the average first down is more like 11 yards gained (sometimes 10, sometimes 11, sometimes 12, sometimes more etc..), that puts the average offense at the 24 when a drive stalls (chip shot FG range).
So unless I'm totally missing this...that seems to be quite high in my opinion, and (IMO) needs to be toned down to about 4ish for the best defenses (which @ 11 yards puts it around the 36 when a drive stalls)
I'd be curious to see the same but with running (average first downs per drive)
Against GA, a Passing O fails 14.06% of the time. The average Passing drive against GA is 7.1 First Downs.
Against DA, a Passing O fails 19.5% of the time. The average Passing drive against DA is 5.1 First Downs.
5.1 first downs on average per drive against one of the top teams in the game??
Seeing as though 10 yards is a first down, that's a minimumof 50 yards...which means on average your at the 30 yard line of the opponents (FG range) when a drive stalls, if you started at the 20.
If the average first down is more like 11 yards gained (sometimes 10, sometimes 11, sometimes 12, sometimes more etc..), that puts the average offense at the 24 when a drive stalls (chip shot FG range).
So unless I'm totally missing this...that seems to be quite high in my opinion, and (IMO) needs to be toned down to about 4ish for the best defenses (which @ 11 yards puts it around the 36 when a drive stalls)
I'd be curious to see the same but with running (average first downs per drive)
Edited by Aeir on Aug 19, 2015 11:54:14
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