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ImTheScientist
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Originally posted by ImTheScientist
Lets look at the top 20 NFL QBs (taken from a FF list, so its a debatable top 20, but decent sample) How many of those played for successful big time college programs? Carson Palmer and Vince young...Peyton maybe. Look at how many came from smaller schools or schools where the QB didn't have the best talent on the field. Look at how many came from a spread offense.
Drew Brees NO QB
Aaron Rodgers GB QB
Peyton Manning IND QB
Tom Brady NE QB
Tony Romo DAL QB
Matt Schaub HOU QB
Philip Rivers SD
Brett Favre MIN QB
Jay Cutler CHI QB
Kevin Kolb PHI QB
Matt Ryan ATL QB
Eli Manning NYG QB
Joe Flacco BAL QB
Donovan McNabb WAS
Carson Palmer CIN QB 1
Chad Henne MIA QB
Matthew Stafford DET
Ben Roethlisberger PIT
Vince Young TEN QB
Alex Smith SF
The odds are against you jrry. Im provide facts while you blindly call me stupid. How do you think that makes you look?
Give me a QB from a Pro Set offense any day of the week over one that came from the Spread. The Spread is a college gimmick that doesn't translate to the NFL.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_football_win-loss_records
Lets just say you take the top 25 from that list. Unless someone knows a better way of managing it. Even at that you only have 6 QBs in that top 20. Im not counting Brady because he didn't play.
Fwiw....I don't consider some of the top 25 powerhouse...but I see a lot of homers in the crowd that would argue they are significant till their f5 button broke.
Lets look at the top 20 NFL QBs (taken from a FF list, so its a debatable top 20, but decent sample) How many of those played for successful big time college programs? Carson Palmer and Vince young...Peyton maybe. Look at how many came from smaller schools or schools where the QB didn't have the best talent on the field. Look at how many came from a spread offense.
Drew Brees NO QB
Aaron Rodgers GB QB
Peyton Manning IND QB
Tom Brady NE QB
Tony Romo DAL QB
Matt Schaub HOU QB
Philip Rivers SD
Brett Favre MIN QB
Jay Cutler CHI QB
Kevin Kolb PHI QB
Matt Ryan ATL QB
Eli Manning NYG QB
Joe Flacco BAL QB
Donovan McNabb WAS
Carson Palmer CIN QB 1
Chad Henne MIA QB
Matthew Stafford DET
Ben Roethlisberger PIT
Vince Young TEN QB
Alex Smith SF
The odds are against you jrry. Im provide facts while you blindly call me stupid. How do you think that makes you look?
Give me a QB from a Pro Set offense any day of the week over one that came from the Spread. The Spread is a college gimmick that doesn't translate to the NFL.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_football_win-loss_records
Lets just say you take the top 25 from that list. Unless someone knows a better way of managing it. Even at that you only have 6 QBs in that top 20. Im not counting Brady because he didn't play.
Fwiw....I don't consider some of the top 25 powerhouse...but I see a lot of homers in the crowd that would argue they are significant till their f5 button broke.
Edited by ImTheScientist on Jul 16, 2010 16:26:18
23yrwej
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Originally posted by ImTheScientist
Lets not forget, this is a Bradford debate and personally I would not feel good about paying a college spread offense QB, who hadn't played in a year, from a powerhouse school where he didn't get pass rushed that much money. Obviously time will tell, but maybe once every 10 years you get a John Elway or Peyton Manning at #1. Bradford is just going to be average, or will be out of the league due to injury. The rams are not good, and will not be good.
Question: Of the 31 games that Bradford started in college, how many did you watch? I have yet to see an argument against Bradford. You haven't critiqued any issue in his game, you have just rambled about spread QBs and powerhouse teams. Players don't fail because of their college scheme and they don't fail because of how good of a college team they were on. Players fail because they lack an ability or attribute needed to succeed in the NFL. What attribute does Bradford lack?
Lets not forget, this is a Bradford debate and personally I would not feel good about paying a college spread offense QB, who hadn't played in a year, from a powerhouse school where he didn't get pass rushed that much money. Obviously time will tell, but maybe once every 10 years you get a John Elway or Peyton Manning at #1. Bradford is just going to be average, or will be out of the league due to injury. The rams are not good, and will not be good.
Question: Of the 31 games that Bradford started in college, how many did you watch? I have yet to see an argument against Bradford. You haven't critiqued any issue in his game, you have just rambled about spread QBs and powerhouse teams. Players don't fail because of their college scheme and they don't fail because of how good of a college team they were on. Players fail because they lack an ability or attribute needed to succeed in the NFL. What attribute does Bradford lack?
GP1
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I can't believe his assertion that only top 25 schools are football power houses. Its mind numbingly stupid.
23yrwej
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Originally posted by ImTheScientist
Originally posted by ImTheScientist
Lets look at the top 20 NFL QBs (taken from a FF list, so its a debatable top 20, but decent sample) How many of those played for successful big time college programs? Carson Palmer and Vince young...Peyton maybe. Look at how many came from smaller schools or schools where the QB didn't have the best talent on the field. Look at how many came from a spread offense.
Drew Brees NO QB
Aaron Rodgers GB QB
Peyton Manning IND QB
Tom Brady NE QB
Tony Romo DAL QB
Matt Schaub HOU QB
Philip Rivers SD
Brett Favre MIN QB
Jay Cutler CHI QB
Kevin Kolb PHI QB
Matt Ryan ATL QB
Eli Manning NYG QB
Joe Flacco BAL QB
Donovan McNabb WAS
Carson Palmer CIN QB 1
Chad Henne MIA QB
Matthew Stafford DET
Ben Roethlisberger PIT
Vince Young TEN QB
Alex Smith SF
The odds are against you jrry. Im provide facts while you blindly call me stupid. How do you think that makes you look?
Give me a QB from a Pro Set offense any day of the week over one that came from the Spread. The Spread is a college gimmick that doesn't translate to the NFL.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_football_win-loss_records
Lets just say you take the top 25 from that list. Unless someone knows a better way of managing it. Even at that you only have 6 QBs in that top 20. Im not counting Brady because he didn't play.
Shows what you know, Brady did play at Michigan. That's 7 out of the top 20 or 35% of the list in 25 of 224 Div. 1 programs or 11% of the programs.
Originally posted by ImTheScientist
Lets look at the top 20 NFL QBs (taken from a FF list, so its a debatable top 20, but decent sample) How many of those played for successful big time college programs? Carson Palmer and Vince young...Peyton maybe. Look at how many came from smaller schools or schools where the QB didn't have the best talent on the field. Look at how many came from a spread offense.
Drew Brees NO QB
Aaron Rodgers GB QB
Peyton Manning IND QB
Tom Brady NE QB
Tony Romo DAL QB
Matt Schaub HOU QB
Philip Rivers SD
Brett Favre MIN QB
Jay Cutler CHI QB
Kevin Kolb PHI QB
Matt Ryan ATL QB
Eli Manning NYG QB
Joe Flacco BAL QB
Donovan McNabb WAS
Carson Palmer CIN QB 1
Chad Henne MIA QB
Matthew Stafford DET
Ben Roethlisberger PIT
Vince Young TEN QB
Alex Smith SF
The odds are against you jrry. Im provide facts while you blindly call me stupid. How do you think that makes you look?
Give me a QB from a Pro Set offense any day of the week over one that came from the Spread. The Spread is a college gimmick that doesn't translate to the NFL.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_football_win-loss_records
Lets just say you take the top 25 from that list. Unless someone knows a better way of managing it. Even at that you only have 6 QBs in that top 20. Im not counting Brady because he didn't play.
Shows what you know, Brady did play at Michigan. That's 7 out of the top 20 or 35% of the list in 25 of 224 Div. 1 programs or 11% of the programs.
23yrwej
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Originally posted by GP1
I can't believe his assertion that only top 25 schools are football power houses. Its mind numbingly stupid.
It really is but ITS doesn't want to look at it on a case by case basis or else he'd have to realize that many of those players were starters when the college program had its most talented teams.
I can't believe his assertion that only top 25 schools are football power houses. Its mind numbingly stupid.
It really is but ITS doesn't want to look at it on a case by case basis or else he'd have to realize that many of those players were starters when the college program had its most talented teams.
ijg
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Originally posted by jrry32
I'll take the better QB. Now, big time schools:
Brady - Michigan
Manning - Tennessee
Young - Texas
Stafford - UGA
Rodgers - Cal
Henne - Michigan
McNabb - Syracuse
Palmer - USC
Drew Brees - Purdue
All of those schools were elite schools when those guys played there.
c'mon, jrry. Cal, Purdue, Syracuse as big time schools? Big conference doesn't = big school or else we have to put Jay Cutler and Vandy on the list. And hard to count Brady when he was the backup. I'd give him an asterisk.
Not that I agree with ITS either, but use the real big time schools.
I'll take the better QB. Now, big time schools:
Brady - Michigan
Manning - Tennessee
Young - Texas
Stafford - UGA
Rodgers - Cal
Henne - Michigan
McNabb - Syracuse
Palmer - USC
Drew Brees - Purdue
All of those schools were elite schools when those guys played there.
c'mon, jrry. Cal, Purdue, Syracuse as big time schools? Big conference doesn't = big school or else we have to put Jay Cutler and Vandy on the list. And hard to count Brady when he was the backup. I'd give him an asterisk.
Not that I agree with ITS either, but use the real big time schools.
ImTheScientist
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Originally posted by jrry32
Question: Of the 31 games that Bradford started in college, how many did you watch? I have yet to see an argument against Bradford. You haven't critiqued any issue in his game, you have just rambled about spread QBs and powerhouse teams. Players don't fail because of their college scheme and they don't fail because of how good of a college team they were on. Players fail because they lack an ability or attribute needed to succeed in the NFL. What attribute does Bradford lack?
I watch a ton of college football and a good number of his games. I think he will be average. Its my opinion. I think its going to take him a long time to develop if he does because he was in the spread, didn't have to read defenses, etc. He has the attributes, but so did Jamarcus Russel, Akili Smith, etc.......all first round QBs have the attributes.
When you want to project a QB there are a few things that concern me.
1) Spread Offense
2) Didn't play under pressure due to dominating line's
3) Superior talent he played with causing game tape which may be misleading (then again it might not be)
4) Ability to adjust to the NFL game due to the offense he was in for the last few years.
He may turn out, if he does....good for you. I just would never want my favorite team drafting a spread QB.
Question: Of the 31 games that Bradford started in college, how many did you watch? I have yet to see an argument against Bradford. You haven't critiqued any issue in his game, you have just rambled about spread QBs and powerhouse teams. Players don't fail because of their college scheme and they don't fail because of how good of a college team they were on. Players fail because they lack an ability or attribute needed to succeed in the NFL. What attribute does Bradford lack?
I watch a ton of college football and a good number of his games. I think he will be average. Its my opinion. I think its going to take him a long time to develop if he does because he was in the spread, didn't have to read defenses, etc. He has the attributes, but so did Jamarcus Russel, Akili Smith, etc.......all first round QBs have the attributes.
When you want to project a QB there are a few things that concern me.
1) Spread Offense
2) Didn't play under pressure due to dominating line's
3) Superior talent he played with causing game tape which may be misleading (then again it might not be)
4) Ability to adjust to the NFL game due to the offense he was in for the last few years.
He may turn out, if he does....good for you. I just would never want my favorite team drafting a spread QB.
StoutOne
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Originally posted by StoutOne DTD
Card Shark!
And he's only 5'11", what's the general consensus on that?
Card Shark!
And he's only 5'11", what's the general consensus on that?
ImTheScientist
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Originally posted by GP1
I can't believe his assertion that only top 25 schools are football power houses. Its mind numbingly stupid.
List me your powerhouse schools then. Its easy to call someone dumb when you are not bringing anything credible to the table.
Provide a list of your powerhouse schools....anyone. Then take that top 20 and show me more than 7 that fit it. Max you get 6 out of 20 and I was being nice to give you 6 imo.
I can't believe his assertion that only top 25 schools are football power houses. Its mind numbingly stupid.
List me your powerhouse schools then. Its easy to call someone dumb when you are not bringing anything credible to the table.
Provide a list of your powerhouse schools....anyone. Then take that top 20 and show me more than 7 that fit it. Max you get 6 out of 20 and I was being nice to give you 6 imo.
Edited by ImTheScientist on Jul 16, 2010 16:35:51
Edited by ImTheScientist on Jul 16, 2010 16:35:33
23yrwej
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Originally posted by ijg
Originally posted by jrry32
I'll take the better QB. Now, big time schools:
Brady - Michigan
Manning - Tennessee
Young - Texas
Stafford - UGA
Rodgers - Cal
Henne - Michigan
McNabb - Syracuse
Palmer - USC
Drew Brees - Purdue
All of those schools were elite schools when those guys played there.
c'mon, jrry. Cal, Purdue, Syracuse as big time schools? Big conference doesn't = big school or else we have to put Jay Cutler and Vandy on the list. And hard to count Brady when he was the backup. I'd give him an asterisk.
Not that I agree with ITS either, but use the real big time schools.
To explain, right now Boise State is one of the top teams, are they not? Historically, they are not but isn't Kellen Moore(BSU QB) playing for a top talented team?
During Brees's time at Purdue, they won the Big 10 and went to the Rose Bowl. During McNabb's time at Syracuse, they went to the Orange Bowl and won 35 games in 4 years. Cal went to a bowl during both Rodger's seasons, upset USC, defeated Va Tech in a Bowl and nearly went to the Rose Bowl but Texas was chosen over them. Sounds like a pretty talented team.
These weren't guys playing for terrible teams. As for Tom Brady, he started TWO seasons at Michigan. He wasn't a backup.
Originally posted by jrry32
I'll take the better QB. Now, big time schools:
Brady - Michigan
Manning - Tennessee
Young - Texas
Stafford - UGA
Rodgers - Cal
Henne - Michigan
McNabb - Syracuse
Palmer - USC
Drew Brees - Purdue
All of those schools were elite schools when those guys played there.
c'mon, jrry. Cal, Purdue, Syracuse as big time schools? Big conference doesn't = big school or else we have to put Jay Cutler and Vandy on the list. And hard to count Brady when he was the backup. I'd give him an asterisk.
Not that I agree with ITS either, but use the real big time schools.
To explain, right now Boise State is one of the top teams, are they not? Historically, they are not but isn't Kellen Moore(BSU QB) playing for a top talented team?
During Brees's time at Purdue, they won the Big 10 and went to the Rose Bowl. During McNabb's time at Syracuse, they went to the Orange Bowl and won 35 games in 4 years. Cal went to a bowl during both Rodger's seasons, upset USC, defeated Va Tech in a Bowl and nearly went to the Rose Bowl but Texas was chosen over them. Sounds like a pretty talented team.
These weren't guys playing for terrible teams. As for Tom Brady, he started TWO seasons at Michigan. He wasn't a backup.
StoutOne
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A school usually only produces 1 QB every 2 years at best.....so these powerhouse schools can only put out so many of them, ldo.
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