Warrior General Games

I agree I have spent 9 shopping tokens and have not found one good piece of Adv. equip yet.

Originally posted by Snaza
Has it been suggested to just let the Adv EQ be upgraded w/ $$ like normal?
You're gonna spend a TON of normal shopping tokens to really get good EQ anyway.
Example: you spend 10 shopping tokens to get a glove of +1 SA. Now you have to spend the $$ again, like you did already, to get the EQ it's + SP. It will make normal training happen much more, as ppl try to get all 4 EQ special. It won't take seasons to upgrade your Adv EQ (which just doesn't make sense). Intense is better for your players training, but Normal can give you the 'easily' upgraded Adv EQ. IF you can find it.
Why waste ALL that training bonus w/ Intense to find a piece of EQ that only gives you +1 SA that will take another 3 seasons to fully upgrade, which will ALSO cost your free SP from Intense training.
Just let us use $$ to upgrade the Adv EQ and it will fix everything IMHO.

EDIT - I really really think this will work. So PLEASE punch some holes in it if there are any.

If I understand your reply correctly you are suggesting spending game money on upgrading the adv. equipment to current equipment levels. Okay that is fine, but the complaint is you would have to be able to sell your current equipment at 100% return. Right now you do not get equal sell back. I agree right now the only thing that makes sense for players over level 10 is to train intense and not worry about the adv. equipment. Also, to upgrade adv. equipment now can only be upgraded by 10 bonus tokens.

Originally posted by didymus
Thanks for putting a nice spin on it.

In-game is only half what stamina meant before (game xp is capped after all). The other was training on normal / intense every day and still being at 100 for the next game while those who were out of shape had to take a day off. It used to mean 2-3 or more extra skill points per season from training.

I'm not crying, because I always bitch about those who whine about every rule change that doesn't suit them.

As I said, my new players are definitely NOT going to cap stamina first off.

Of course, you lost arounf 12-15 SP's in the beginning by capping Stamina in the first place. Those could have been used somewhere useful and you could have trained on Relaxed. You still haven't paid off that trade off, and wouldn't have until the end of Season 5 at best (If you started your player at the beginning of Season 1).

Training intense instead of relaxed was the extra handful of SP's per season I mentioned.
Don't forget: playing HARD for the team, and getting max game XP as well.

You are right - it was a career long investment. That crashed with the free 100 stamina. And the dis-association of stamina and training.

Ah well, I'll do the best I can from here out.

well I'm not sure I like the new store execution.

I was under the impression that there were going to be new slots opened up like wristbands, or shoulder pads or something...

It's going to take some real hard number crunching to show me that a 2 or 3% chance at something is going to be worth throwing away a $75k +4 item, let alone the bajillion dollar +5 item when I get there.

so yeah, my suggestion is:

Make new slots for the advanced items, make like: helmet, shoulder pads, elbow pads, and knee pads.

run 2 separate systems for the store so that each is equally valuable. Keep the new stuff upgradable with tokens (somehow) so that tokens don't become obsolete.

Easy way to balance new "equipment" with old and new players with old:

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1072230

Also includes sockets, progressive store, and useful spending of bonus tokens.

Originally posted by otto_g_2k8
SIMPLE SOLUTION FOR VETERANS REGARDING ADVANCED EQUIPMENT!

Problem: Newly created players will be able to upgrade advanced equipment at a pace that keeps up with regular equipment upgrades, making their advanced equipment more effective over time than the same equipment for a veteran.

EX:
LVL 1 LB get Superior Black Shoes: +1 Speed + 1, Defense General SA ... he is able to save enough tokens by the time he is LVL 8 to upgrade the +1 Speed to plus 2 and so on so that by the time he is LVL 24 he has Shoes that give him +4 Speed, +1 Defense General
Meanwhile LVL 24 LB gets Superior Black Shoes: +3 Speed, +1 Line general. He is clearly behind the curve of where the new player will be at LVL 24.

SOLUTION:
Since you can "roll over" five bonus tokens from season to season, just give each "veteran player" five bonus tokens for each COMPLETE season they have been around. Partial seasons do not count.

EX:
My CB Stanley Hendrix is currently LVL 29 and was created Season One Day 33. He has played 3 complete seasons: (2,3,4) and would receive 15 "retroactive" bonus tokens. Now if he happens upon Superior Orange Shoes: +3 Speed, +1 Shutdown Coverage, he can upgrade them right away to +4 Speed and by the time he hits LVL 32 he should have enough to make them +5 Speed. NOW his "Advanced Equipment" is actually better than his "Regular Equipment"

Just my thoughts!

Quoted so hopefully Bort will see it!

i like this idea if i'm understanding it fully and correctly. i may be saying the same thing but....



a normal upgrade available for the special items using the existing money system so all it cost is money to catch up the new equipment to the old. theres also an additional upgrade option only available to speacial equipment which cost the bonus tokens. two trees of upgrades.

also i like the idea of using items as bartering tools. if you run accross a kick ass item you can at least buy it and trade or sell to someone with another kick ass item they can't use. my LB has an item thats ok for him but better for a CB. its +3 tackling & +1 Return Specialist SA. i bought it thinking i could spend money to upgrade it 3 times like my other item and put it all in the same stats i originally had so i actually gain something. as it stands now i can't. one is a visor and the other a doo rag. how bout being able to wear multiples in certain areas. 2 visors wouldn't make much sense but a visor and a doo rag would (also eye black). i understand there should be limitations like level requirement to wear certain things so.

also (again) the bartering system could/should some how use all pts + $$$ as an option. flex points, store tokens, bonus tokens, other items, money and even skill points could be involved. it would increase players interaction making it much more dynamic.







[/QUOTE=Enkidu98]Yeah, as a Test I just purchased som 'Advanced' Eyeblack. was only 600 bucks so I figured it was a good test. It had on it +1 Strength.

So, Purchased it.

Then I went to check out the equipment. It is essentially the same as a level 1 basic purchase. Cost 100$ more and it is NOT upgradeable unless I use the special equipment upgrades. That means for it to ever be worth something, as previously mentioned, I will have to spend a metric asstonne of points that will take more seasons then I have remaining just to make it worth the same as the basic equipment I have been upgrading.

This makes _zero_ sense.




When we purchase advanced equipment it should basically be considered a standard piece of equipment, meaning that it starts as 'basic' equipment that costs a bit more and has a bonus.

So, this eye black should have cost say 1500$ and had +1 strength and was equivalent to 'Level 1 Equipment'. Once it is in my possession I can then upgrade it by purchasing the standard Level 1 atrtribute bonus. This makes it actually superior to the standard Level 1 equipment, justifying its cost. Then, if my player is high enough I can upgrade to the Lvl 8, Level 16, Level 24 and Level 32 equipment by spending the cost I would normally spend to upgrade this. This adds _basic_ stats only, just like normal equipment.

Then when I earn enough bonus tokens I can _enhance_ that equipment, either adding a couple attribute points (that makes it worthwhile, if one bonus upgrade to the equipment provides say +2 attribute points) or a special ability, such as a bonus to a SA, or some of these various percentage bonus to footboall skills/actions etc.

As it is now. The Special 'Enhanced' Equipment is not as good as standard equipment and a high level player purchasing it ends up with worse stuff than they had before.

Recap:

All special equipment is considered 'Level 1 Equipment' with an additional random bonus. When purchased, player can spend an additional 500$ on it and add +1 to an attibuted.

If the player is of appropriate level, they can add +1 to an attribute for Level 8, Level 16 Level 24, Level 32 ETC bringing the equipment in line with 'standard' equipment' with just a small enhancement.

As the player earns bonus tokens they can _further_ upgrade the equipment with additional bonuses to their attributes (+2 to attributes in any combination for one bonus purchase) or to their SA's/Football Skills etc. (Bonus to be determined.. say one SA level or 2-3% to a skill like Deflections, Chance to cause fumble, etc)

I must say, most of the changes I like, but I really don't like these new shopping and equipment changes. There's to much randomness with the whole thing and Old players are pretty much stuck in the old system until they can afford to sell their old stuff to even consider buying the new stuff.

Originally posted by Jayme Thysell
I must say, most of the changes I like, but I really don't like these new shopping and equipment changes. There's to much randomness with the whole thing and Old players are pretty much stuck in the old system until they can afford to sell their old stuff to even consider buying the new stuff.

I think some of you are missing the idea here. If you have LVL 24 Equipment that is +4 To Attribute X, and you get a replacement in the advanced store that is +3 to that same attribute AND a +1 to a Special Ability, you come out ahead. I realize it may take a lot of tries to get something like that (Five of my six player haven't gotten anything worthwhile yet) but when you do, it's SO worth it. My LOT got extremely lucky and found TWO such pieces of Equipment in only four shopping trips.

Originally posted by otto_g_2k8
Originally posted by Jayme Thysell

I must say, most of the changes I like, but I really don't like these new shopping and equipment changes. There's to much randomness with the whole thing and Old players are pretty much stuck in the old system until they can afford to sell their old stuff to even consider buying the new stuff.

I think some of you are missing the idea here. If you have LVL 24 Equipment that is +4 To Attribute X, and you get a replacement in the advanced store that is +3 to that same attribute AND a +1 to a Special Ability, you come out ahead. I realize it may take a lot of tries to get something like that (Five of my six player haven't gotten anything worthwhile yet) but when you do, it's SO worth it. My LOT got extremely lucky and found TWO such pieces of Equipment in only four shopping trips.

The problem is finding a piece that has a +3 to a useful attribute. could take 1/2 the season.

I think if the price to upgrade a piece of equipment was even reduced to 6 tokens it might be more reasonable. As it stands you can never catch up.

I bought a piece of adv. equipment but want bort to know I in no way endorse the current system. I will never upgrade it or use it if he doesn't change it. It was too good to pass up and I bought it having faith that changes will be made to balance this problem out for the high level players.

Originally posted by cclanconan
I think if the price to upgrade a piece of equipment was even reduced to 6 tokens it might be more reasonable. As it stands you can never catch up.

I bought a piece of adv. equipment but want bort to know I in no way endorse the current system. I will never upgrade it or use it if he doesn't change it. It was too good to pass up and I bought it having faith that changes will be made to balance this problem out for the high level players.

I have bought several new adv. equipment pieces, but I am just holding onto it until a decision is made by Bort

Originally posted by Bort
Originally posted by x21times20

it's not supposed to be easy to find some awesome upgrade as soon you open up the store for the first time, i think as long as there is some way for lvl 32+ players to upgrade equipment a couple levels without having to wait 2 seasons per piece that the current system is fine

really all that is needed is some kind of bonus token or attribute refund for selling normal equipment that will allow high-level players to put some of their money spent earlier on normal equipment into their new advanced stuff so that they aren't going to be retired before they can get their stuff upgraded to their character's level

i think somewhere around a 50% refund would be good because obviously allowing a level 32 player to just add +4 to advanced equipment right away would not be balanced at all, but if they can add +2 the equipment should be able to catch up to their player level in a reasonable amount of time

Hmm...what if you could "merge" like 50% of your existing item into an advanced? ex:

You have a basic shirt with +4 speed.
You buy a +2 speed, +1 SA advanced shirt.
You merge your basic into your advanced item, and now have a +4 speed, +1 SA item.

Could cost bonus tokens to keep it from being a loophole where you'd be able to upgrade all adv items super fast.

I guess that's kind of the "crafting" idea from earlier.

This exactly what I was thinking.

Originally posted by GoodEyeClosed
Originally posted by otto_g_2k8

Originally posted by Jayme Thysell


I must say, most of the changes I like, but I really don't like these new shopping and equipment changes. There's to much randomness with the whole thing and Old players are pretty much stuck in the old system until they can afford to sell their old stuff to even consider buying the new stuff.

I think some of you are missing the idea here. If you have LVL 24 Equipment that is +4 To Attribute X, and you get a replacement in the advanced store that is +3 to that same attribute AND a +1 to a Special Ability, you come out ahead. I realize it may take a lot of tries to get something like that (Five of my six player haven't gotten anything worthwhile yet) but when you do, it's SO worth it. My LOT got extremely lucky and found TWO such pieces of Equipment in only four shopping trips.

The problem is finding a piece that has a +3 to a useful attribute. could take 1/2 the season.

I think that is partially the idea. Like any RPG, you are not going to get the best item at the end of every "quest." You have to keep trying until you do. Then when you finally get that item, it's SO worth it. And the best will be when you get something that gives you a Special Ability that's not on your tree but still helps you. I'm hoping my girlfriends TE that plays on my team will find an item that gives her +1 Diving Catch. Now wouldn't that be nice!

Also, in case you haven't noticed, the items are scaled so that the best thing you can find is one less to your regular attribute than standard equipment would give, but that also has the Special Ability bonus. You just aren't going to get a +3 Blocking and +1 Protector SA Shirt for your LVL 8 OT. You are going to get +1 Blocking and +1 Protector SA, which is still better than your +2 Blocking Shirt, since it will take less SP to put back the one point in Blocking than to upgrade the Protector SA. If you then start training intense, you should have enough bonus tokens to upgrade it to +2 Blocking at about the same time you are able to upgrade your Standard EQ to +3.

THAT SAID, I still think we should get a few retroactive Bonus Tokens for established players, though I think the equipment is scaled like it is to represent those upgrades that you could have done if you used your tokens all along.