Warrior General Games

Originally posted by nutrumpet
Wow I'm glad I know this now...I have serious issues with this.

How can I be expected to invest in something that will not show returns or be long term? We're talking about something I will have put a good 50-100 bucks in over a long stretch of time! That's like world of warcraft retiring your player after you played for 3 years because they wouldn't live that long...what a horrible thing.

From a consumer's standpoint, I do believe it is cheap. Who cares if I shoot back up? I put MY time and MY money into it and I should be rewarded accordingly, you just can't take it away because it's realistic or to give someone else a chance to be the best.

Use your brain? Ok tell me how this makes sense. I invest time and money into something for entertainment, and the level of my entertainment is (should be) directly related to the amount of time and money I invest. So you are telling me, that if I invest more time and money than other people, that you are going to take away %70 of my investment as well as all the aforementioned time put into that entertainment? That sounds like a scam to me ESPECIALLY considering I've put money into it already before I knew this.

You can guarantee that I will be much less likely to put my money into something that has diminishing returns, especially if it is for entertainment. To play warcraft you have to pay a monthly fee, genius. You arent forced to pay to play. If you want to buy flex points that up to you but you cant bitch about it either.

The problem is the game needs to bleed players at the top end to some extent, otherwise new players will find it pointless to be level 1 in 2-3 years time when third strings with 2 snaps a game are level 40!
WoW can just introduce better loot and bigger monsters to kill it with, ad nauseum. Their world and it's rules can expand to fit whatever they want, we're fixed with football rules - how would you feel if teams had to have 5 players per position and it was ruled that nobody could play more than 2 plays in a row?
Other than the constant introduction of more and more teams, there needs to be a way to release the higher level players or the top end will stagnate. Also once every team has all it's players capped, inevitable if you hit a plateau and then stay there forever... each game may as well be decided by tossing a coin.

I would suggest a reward system for when players retire due to age. If you stay active for the whole career, things like MORE flex points than you spent, halls of fame, special equipment (little things that give you an edge, not shoulder pads of crushing +20!), effectively veteran rewards.

But then I'm with JuniorMcSpiffy, for me it's more about the journey than the destination, so what do I know ;-)

A hall of fame would be freakin' sweet. I dont know if there are awards yet, but that would be great too.

My suggestion to those who don't want to start over when retirement comes is to start a new player after 3 or 4 seasons. that way you'll have somebody to fall back on.

Personally I think 1.5 years of actual time(not game time), is plenty of time to enjoy a player and I think I'll be ready to try out a different position anyway if I don't before that.

Honestly I don't know how anyone could play a football game and not realize that eventually players will have to retire. Calling them scam artists because you lack common sense is kinda stupid IMO.

Teams will have to rebuild, just like in the NFL. Would you watch the NFL if the same two teams were in the super bowl every year, and the same team won every year? Competitiveness is key.

Originally posted by Sizz06
Originally posted by nutrumpet

Wow I'm glad I know this now...I have serious issues with this.

How can I be expected to invest in something that will not show returns or be long term? We're talking about something I will have put a good 50-100 bucks in over a long stretch of time! That's like world of warcraft retiring your player after you played for 3 years because they wouldn't live that long...what a horrible thing.

From a consumer's standpoint, I do believe it is cheap. Who cares if I shoot back up? I put MY time and MY money into it and I should be rewarded accordingly, you just can't take it away because it's realistic or to give someone else a chance to be the best.

Use your brain? Ok tell me how this makes sense. I invest time and money into something for entertainment, and the level of my entertainment is (should be) directly related to the amount of time and money I invest. So you are telling me, that if I invest more time and money than other people, that you are going to take away %70 of my investment as well as all the aforementioned time put into that entertainment? That sounds like a scam to me ESPECIALLY considering I've put money into it already before I knew this.

You can guarantee that I will be much less likely to put my money into something that has diminishing returns, especially if it is for entertainment. To play warcraft you have to pay a monthly fee, genius. You arent forced to pay to play. If you want to buy flex points that up to you but you cant bitch about it either.


People who "bought" FP points before the forced retirement is implemented do have a right to bitch about it.....thats if forced retirement even happens. I know personally I wouldn't of bought any points if I knew there was a forced retirement and I'm sure I'm not alone

I'll have to agree with the no FORCED retirement crowd. And that there should be an age factor. I think the best version of the degrading performace model would involve. age excelleration factors. Like injuries and playing injured. And something about the number of plays in a season. So that like in the real game the player who has been setting on the bench or holding the clipboard isn't aged at the same rate as the one that plays every down.
This would be more realistic which is what makes a good game great. Really I just want to hear the grinding of the programers teeth.

No offence, but I haven't, and don't intend to, read the previous 150+ posts, but if a player retires (I have yet to retire one), will you get all the flex points spent on him back, I know you get the points for his creation back, but I'm speaking of the points for all level boosts spent on him & any custom equipment for him.

If you are left without all those flex points, then I don't see how forced retirement could be enforced fairly.

Originally posted by Robm78
Originally posted by Sizz06

Originally posted by nutrumpet


Wow I'm glad I know this now...I have serious issues with this.

How can I be expected to invest in something that will not show returns or be long term? We're talking about something I will have put a good 50-100 bucks in over a long stretch of time! That's like world of warcraft retiring your player after you played for 3 years because they wouldn't live that long...what a horrible thing.

From a consumer's standpoint, I do believe it is cheap. Who cares if I shoot back up? I put MY time and MY money into it and I should be rewarded accordingly, you just can't take it away because it's realistic or to give someone else a chance to be the best.

Use your brain? Ok tell me how this makes sense. I invest time and money into something for entertainment, and the level of my entertainment is (should be) directly related to the amount of time and money I invest. So you are telling me, that if I invest more time and money than other people, that you are going to take away %70 of my investment as well as all the aforementioned time put into that entertainment? That sounds like a scam to me ESPECIALLY considering I've put money into it already before I knew this.

You can guarantee that I will be much less likely to put my money into something that has diminishing returns, especially if it is for entertainment. To play warcraft you have to pay a monthly fee, genius. You arent forced to pay to play. If you want to buy flex points that up to you but you cant bitch about it either.


People who "bought" FP points before the forced retirement is implemented do have a right to bitch about it.....thats if forced retirement even happens. I know personally I wouldn't of bought any points if I knew there was a forced retirement and I'm sure I'm not alone



You should have known there would be changes seeing as it is a game still in BETA.

Originally posted by Robm78
Originally posted by Sizz06

Originally posted by nutrumpet


Wow I'm glad I know this now...I have serious issues with this.

How can I be expected to invest in something that will not show returns or be long term? We're talking about something I will have put a good 50-100 bucks in over a long stretch of time! That's like world of warcraft retiring your player after you played for 3 years because they wouldn't live that long...what a horrible thing.

From a consumer's standpoint, I do believe it is cheap. Who cares if I shoot back up? I put MY time and MY money into it and I should be rewarded accordingly, you just can't take it away because it's realistic or to give someone else a chance to be the best.

Use your brain? Ok tell me how this makes sense. I invest time and money into something for entertainment, and the level of my entertainment is (should be) directly related to the amount of time and money I invest. So you are telling me, that if I invest more time and money than other people, that you are going to take away %70 of my investment as well as all the aforementioned time put into that entertainment? That sounds like a scam to me ESPECIALLY considering I've put money into it already before I knew this.

You can guarantee that I will be much less likely to put my money into something that has diminishing returns, especially if it is for entertainment. To play warcraft you have to pay a monthly fee, genius. You arent forced to pay to play. If you want to buy flex points that up to you but you cant bitch about it either.


People who "bought" FP points before the forced retirement is implemented do have a right to bitch about it.....thats if forced retirement even happens. I know personally I wouldn't of bought any points if I knew there was a forced retirement and I'm sure I'm not alone



If you really thought your player would live forever, you're an idiot.

To all of you haters about the 70% back after forced retirement:

How do you expect new players to ever catch up if the first season guys are continually around forever? Forced retirement will be around 8-10 seasons away. By then if you had 1 glamour positions and spent every season for 9 seasons:

900 (custom equip)
900*9

=9000 Flex Points

9000x.7=6300 Flex Points. So now you have enough to create a new glamour, get the custom equipment, and boost him for 6 seasons.


Maybe here is the trick. It may not be "FORCED" retirement, but your skills will begin to decline faster than you can train, and eventually much faster. Maybe you would rather get nothing out of it and have a level 1 again by season 20?

Frankly, some sort of retirement has to happen in this game. It isn't like World of Warcraft where a new player can catch up eventually. There NEEDS to be an attraction for new players, and that is the promise that eventually they will be on top. The fact that they will give you ANYTHING in return is quite good in my opinion.

thinking this much into it totally takes the fun out of the game. Just get your guy ready to play every game and hope for the best!

I havent even considered the thought of when retirement is coming, im having too much fun with the game now.

But if there is gonna be a retirement it should be based on a certain level, not how old your player is. Like once you get to level 100 you are forced to retire.

Then you can have the satisfaction of leveling up to the highest point and getting to end on a high note.

Originally posted by nutrumpet
Wow I'm glad I know this now...I have serious issues with this.

How can I be expected to invest in something that will not show returns or be long term? We're talking about something I will have put a good 50-100 bucks in over a long stretch of time! That's like world of warcraft retiring your player after you played for 3 years because they wouldn't live that long...what a horrible thing.

From a consumer's standpoint, I do believe it is cheap. Who cares if I shoot back up? I put MY time and MY money into it and I should be rewarded accordingly, you just can't take it away because it's realistic or to give someone else a chance to be the best.

Use your brain? Ok tell me how this makes sense. I invest time and money into something for entertainment, and the level of my entertainment is (should be) directly related to the amount of time and money I invest. So you are telling me, that if I invest more time and money than other people, that you are going to take away %70 of my investment as well as all the aforementioned time put into that entertainment? That sounds like a scam to me ESPECIALLY considering I've put money into it already before I knew this.

You can guarantee that I will be much less likely to put my money into something that has diminishing returns, especially if it is for entertainment.

Heaven forbid you buy madden or ncaa yearly and complain about the decline in value of the game on a yearly basis. Heaven forbid you own a home, especially one bought just before the market became flooded with bank owned properties and builder inventory homes. Heaven forbid you own a car who depreciates greatly the moment you drive it off the lot. I'm sure you and everyone else here have only spent money on things that appreciate and have never spent money on entertainment things such as movies, bowling, miniature golf, etc...

Originally posted by JuniorMcSpiffy
I like this game. I will keep playing this game. And I have only one issue with the content of this thread. (Note: only through four pages of it... maybe this comes up later.)

Does nobody enjoy the process of creating a player, only in the end result? When LaMont Cranston has to take up a rocking chair on the front porch, I will get points back from the site to turn over into creating a new player. Maybe I'll turn those points over and get a team instead. But whatever I do, the game gives me points back for doing it. Then I will get to watch as another unknown old-time-radio star becomes a football immortal and I get to sculpt his progression. I could experiment with his skills... try one player on mostly physical stats... another on mostly special abilites.... and continue the process of creating.

Or, there could be no retirement, and I could log on every other day. "Yep. He's still incredibly good. Joy of a thousand lifetimes."

And I guess that's what a lot of this comes down to for me. Are you here because you love the aspect of the game where you get to build and create, or are you here because you need another corner of the internet where you have something ungodly that mere mortals tremble before? Myself, I'm comfortable with who I am and don't need to beg admins to create another set of levels once I max out so I can be even the bestester and keep feeling good about myself. I'll take my points, turn them over, and enjoy the thrill of concocting a new player, of struggling up through the ranks again. If there are a few dollars that I don't see again, I'm fine with that.

Excuse me. I have to go call a few casinos in Vegas. While I enjoyed sitting at their tables and working on my meager card-counting skills, I think it's unfair that they got to keep some of my money while I was doing it.

Post of the thread.
Sorry to all you guys (and gals) that spent money on entertainment just to find out that you can't get a refund when your done. I will spend money on this site after testing is done, and if I get any return when I retire a player it will be more than I was expecting.

i don't really get what you are all complaining about.

entertainment is the return on your "investment"

its not even really an investment. you are paying for entertainment. you don't go to a strip club, pay $50 for a lap dance, and then ask for $40 back after you get your jollies off.

and once you get to the top (say you get to level 90 or something) how much fun is it really to stay there? Isn't part of the fun of the game the journey to get to the top? once you can win every game you play in, doesn't that get boring after a while? i know it does for me in other games.

this is a game, not a stock, and the fact that you get any money back on what you paid is more than you should expect.

you pay money, get entertained. at the end, you get 70% of what you paid back to invest in another player. that 70% could pay for the next 6 seasons of that next player, meaning that you only have to pay 30% for the second player that you paid for the first.

to put it in actual terms. say you put in $100 for your first player. he gets to level 65 in those 10 years or however many years they set it at. he retires. you get $70 back to start your next player with. so your second player only costs $30 to get to the same level as the first player did.

i have paid money for this game, and am waiting to buy a team. when i heard that i would be getting 70% of my purchase back, i was happy, because thats more than you get in any other game i've ever played.

Originally posted by kasu327
i don't really get what you are all complaining about.

entertainment is the return on your "investment"

its not even really an investment. you are paying for entertainment. you don't go to a strip club, pay $50 for a lap dance, and then ask for $40 back after you get your jollies off.


I'd go more often if that was the case....lol