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william78
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Provide the following gameplay enhancements and player levers to pull on (especially for VETs)
I’ve commented somewhat enough on my opinion of season 9 sim changes and its been mentioned a few times that VET players don’t have enough to do. So here are my suggestions for both gameplay and player settings changes / additions.

QB Play
Change: (Allow hits after completion)

• Allow hits and knockdowns for up to 7 ticks after the ball is released.
• Track hits and knockdowns in the stat sheet as well as allowing them, in combination with sacks and hurries, to start the QB’s “rattle setting”.

Reason: QB’s don’t only get rattled from sacks being hit and hurried in passing often causes rattled effects and failure to notice defenders or to read properly. Toughness could be the counter-balance force to the rattled technique; a tough QB with a lot of heart like a Brett Farve might simply “shrug off” a hit, while a Jay Cutler type becomes rattled and flings the ball inaccurately all over the place.

Change: (Make scrambling realistic)

• Make QB Scramble more realistic by instead of “side stepping” his way out of the pocket, the QB drops off a few yards back and rolls outside the pocket.
• Change block type at the time the QB starts rolling to run blocking technique and treat play as outside run (IE give bonus to contain expert to try to keep the QB in the pocket).
• Add setting box of “Scramble to run/ Scramble to throw” to the QB. A QB on Scramble to run will drop his eyes and look for some open field. A QB on scramble to throw will keep his eyes downfield to look for an open receiver.
• Apply accuracy penalty to throwing back across their body (IE roll is right throw is on the left side of the field decrease accuracy to compensate and vice versa roll left throw across field right).

Reason: Rollouts right now and scramble frequency look goofy because the QB tries to side step to the outside until he is completely outside the pocket. This will create more broken plays (a good and bad thing for both sides).

Change: (Apply common sense on QB hurries)

• Force the QB to pass a “reset” roll before delivering the ball after being hurried or suffer a penalty for accuracy and pass velocity.

Reason: Right now every GLB2 QB has nearly flawless mechanics. That’s not ideal or desired. Steve Young has commented that he could watch a game from his waist down and tell you his completion percentage for that game. Even when being hurried GLB2 QB’s are resetting too quickly, make footwork that reset roll. Either its passed or apply the penalty.

Change: (Make Drop Back Power Viable)

• Allow QB’s in the middle of being sacked a Drop Back Power roll to get a pass off to the checkdown back. The pass would be with reduced accuracy and power.
• Provide a QB setting to do this (Never/Sometimes/As often as possible)
Reason: Aside from Drop Back Power being fairly useless at the moment , this happens in gameplay a defender is in the middle of sacking the QB , the QB one arms it to a checkdown option. Make this with greatly reduced ball velocity and accuracy. IE Stronger arm QBs with big drop back power should execute this well(mostly) but no one else.

Change: (Create Setting for 3rd down passing options)

• Create Setting for 3rd Down Passing read (Only to sticks/Primaries to sticks/Ignore)
o Only to sticks preserves the current GLB2 setting which emphasizes QBs only throwing to WR’s on 3rd down who are beyond or at the 3rd down marker
o Primaries to sticks, preserves the settings for the QBs first two reads but turns it off once they’ve gone to their 3rd option
o Ignore, QB ignores GLB2 programming to throw to receivers on 3rd down beyond or within a yard of the 3rd down marker.
Reason: Primaries is perhaps the most realistic but this is a game same may always want to go for the sticks some maybe happy with the completion. It allows for teams with a so-so QB and great YAC WR’s to be viable on 3rd down passing.

Wide Receivers/TE’s
Change: (Add rattled receiver to game effects)

• Introduce “Rattled” mechanic on WR’s and TE’s who suffer KL’s and to a lesser extent monster hit
• Allow Toughness roll to ignore effects
• A rattled receiver or TE would suffer a penalty to receiving hands and catch in traffic
Reason: Should be fairly obvious but getting beat up produced “alligator arms” its an offset for pure speedsters who may not have the time to devote to toughness.

Offensive Lineman
Change: (Change break point for increased SP costs)

• Change the “break point” of skill stacking to 40 (actually do this universally for blocking)
• Allow a one time reset for those 4 skills effected. Advertise the change in advance of season 10 as “coming” that’ll give everyone enough time to realize they need to log in in the off-season.
Reason: Being debated already but 40 is a more reasonable point to allow for offensive lineman to be “decent” at both.

Runningbacks
Change: (Add Cutback Setting)

• Provide Setting for “Cutback” (Never, Sometimes, Always). Right now the RB always follows the play pathing (outside the WR) on outside runs. If its 3rd down and the runningback is close to the sticks, allow an awareness check if there is no defender between the runningback and the first down marker to churn upfield for it.
Reason: Even on north/south the runningback is still looking for the big play on every sweep where it might behoove the offense to have the runningback looking inside to convert the first down. Less prominent on strong side runs but happens a fair amount on the weak side.

Defensive (Global)
Change: (Create Tee Off Setting to anticipate passing)

• Provide a setting for “tee off” (Frequently, Situational, Never). This would allow the defensive player to “tee off” against the pass based on game events.
o Frequent: After 3 consecutive passes are thrown defenders could be placed in tee off mode and as long as the offense remains more than 70% pass would stay that way.
o Situational: Defender would be in tee off mode on 3rd and long , 4th and long, and two minute drill situations unless the offensive team has run more than 70% running up to that point.
o Never: Defender would ignore tee off mode.
• A defender in tee off mode receives a bonus pass rush technique, pass rush deflection, man awareness, and zone awareness; while suffering a penalty to hold ground, break run block, tackling technique, and blitz awareness. If play is run provide penalty to snap reaction, if play is pass provide bonus to snap reaction.

Change: (Create Stack Setting to anticipate rushing)

• Provide “stack” setting for each defensive player. (Frequently, Situational, Never). This would allow the defensive player to “stack” against the run based on game events.
o Frequent: After 3 consecutive running plays defenders could be placed in stack mode and as long as the offense remains more than 70% run would stay that way.
o Situational: Defender would be in stack mode on 3rd and very short , 4th and short, and goalline situations unless the offensive team has passed more than 70% up to that point.
o Never: Defender would ignore stack mode.
• A defender in stack mode receives a bonus break run block, hold ground, tackling grip, and blitz awareness; while suffering a penalty to pass rush technique, pass rush deflection, intercept, and coverage technique. If play is run provide bonus to snap reaction, if play is pass provide penalty to snap reaction.

Reason(s): This would add some realistic situational awareness to the defenders without being exorbitantly overpowering. It would also be pretty realistic in terms of giving the defenders some anticipation that playing 3rd and 13 is different than 1st and 10; also playing a pass dominated team is different than balanced or run dominated. Likewise a heavy run team would see defenders more dedicated to stopping the run as would teams playing 3rd and 1.

Back 7 (LB’s, CB’s , S’s)
Change: (Change DB Positioning prior to snap)

• Add coverage shell alignment pre-snap. Position defenders in man coverage more correctly based on the coverage shell (0,1,2,3,4) behind them.
o In Man Coverage on WR1 or WR2, while playing Cover 0 or Cover 1, align defender off the outside shoulder of the WR and slightly off.
o In Man Coverage on the WR1 or WR2, while playing Cover 2, 3, or 4 align defender on the inside shoulder of the WR.
o In Man Coverage on the WR3, WR4, or WR,5 while playing Cover 0 align defender dead onto WR.
o In Man Coverage on WR3, WR4, or WR5 while playing Cover 1 or Cover 2 align defender inside of the WR.
o In Man Coverage on WR3, WR4, or WR5 while playing Cover 3 or Cover 4 align defender on the outside shoulder of the WR.
Reason: This is more realistic and while NFL and college teams “fake” these reads occasionally to confuse the QB; its not really necessary in GLB since the QB isn’t making a presnap read.

Change: (Add Coverage Shell recognition)

• Add Setting “Play to Coverage Shell” (Yes/No) allow the defenders technique in man or zone to account for the coverage shell behind him ignoring this value for any safety or CB in “Deep Zone” who would default to over technique (IE try not to let anyone behind him). Once the defenders backpedal is completed the defender will attempt to adjust. A defender with this mode activated will attempt to play situationally based on the coverage shell behind him.
o In Cover 0 the defender will cover as they always have in GLB2.
o In Cover 1, outside the hash marks (or for simplicity guarding a WR outside the cover 1 if drawn vertically backwards and covering the full field) will attempt to stay behind and to the outside of the WR. A defender inside of this gap will attempt to stay a step behind and underneath the WR.
o In Cover 2, a defender outside the hash marks will attempt to stay slightly behind and between the QB and WR. A defender inside the hash marks will attempt to stay over the top of the WR.
o In Cover 3 and Cover 4, all defenders in man coverage will attempt to stay underneath the WR (between the receiver and the QB).
Reason: This is more intelligent play and can be proxied simply with slight different coverage vectors and the defender calling the correct module once his back pedal is completed. All that would be needed is a preplay set condition defining the coverage shell which should already be loaded with the defensive play, then running a man awareness check based on where he is on the field once his back pedal terminates. Also entirely possible teams may want to ignore this setting when facing a running team.

Change: (Add moving depth to lineup assignments prensnap)

• Add setting “Adjust Lineup Depth” (Frequently/Frequently with Situations/Situational/Never). Presnap this would allow anyone in man coverage to creep up between -1 yards and 7 yards deep allowing the defender more time to be in backpedal and playing the QB not the WR. (Ideally this will create more plays on the ball).
o Never, Ignores this setting leaves defenders in default position.
o Situational, Defenders will align up to 7 yards deep but not further than the line to gain (first down marker) while playing man or zone coverage on 3rd or 4th down or in the red zone ; IE keeping your feet pinned to the goalline).
o Frequently, Defenders will react to the passing game of the offense. If more than 4 passes of 20+ yards have been completed in the past defenders will give the offense the maximum 7 yard cushion.
o Frequently with Situations, If more than 4 passes of 20+ yards have been completed in the past defenders will give the offense the maximum 7 yard cushion except on 3rd or 4th down where they will align with their feet on the yard to gain.
Reason: This will serve as a speed adjustment during the game in an intelligent manner. Fluctuating how long the defender is in back pedal.

Change: (Buff awareness when DB is still in backpedal)

• Provide Man Coverage and Zone Coverage bonus for defenders in backpedal.
Reason: While backpedaling the defender can still see the QB as well as the Wide Receiver. As the QB prepares the throw the defender can see this and react to the ball, if he’s shadowing a receiver the defender has to look for cues from the WR’s body language (IE putting hands up to receive, eyes getting bigger) to react to an incoming pass.

Punting

Change: (Punting Distance is still whacky)

• Reduce Punt Velocity
Reason: This is still over the top, Punting ranges should run between 30 yards at rookie and 50 yards at VET. This are consistent with human punt average and while an occasional “boomer” could be triggered by an SA; its still somewhat goofy the massive field position changes.

Change: (Add shanking punt dimension)

• Produce “Shanked” Punt on failure of punt consistency. Make this easy to pass it shouldn’t happen all the time but it should happen. The punt should come off the side of the foot at a 30-45 degree cross angle most likely hitting out of bounds with a 50% reduction in power. While your at it , produce a “rattled punter” mechanic on a toughness/heart check, once a punter has shanked one increase the likelihood he shanks the next one.
Reason: It happens and punt consistency isn’t exactly a great skill at the moment.


Edited by william78 on Feb 3, 2015 05:41:34
Edited by william78 on Feb 3, 2015 05:38:56
 
Lokiness
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A lot of great suggestions here. The community and devs should see this, so upvoted and bumped.

My favorite changes are the global defensive bonus and cutbacks for RBs, really good additions and probably very simple to code too.
 
william78
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Originally posted by Lokiness
A lot of great suggestions here. The community and devs should see this, so upvoted and bumped.

My favorite changes are the global defensive bonus and cutbacks for RBs, really good additions and probably very simple to code too.


TY, I would think the two global defensive settings would be the best place to start. Would also add that extra lever for guys in VET leagues to have something to do with their Toons other than watching how the Defensive coordinator employs them.
 
lebasquiat
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Originally posted by Lokiness
A lot of great suggestions here. The community and devs should see this, so upvoted and bumped.


 
InRomoWeTrust
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Like and dislike some of these. Part of the reason why we suggest against compilation threads (see Pallow's thread here) for +1 sake. Just makes discussion and 'voting' difficult.

I'd like to feel out the punting distance a little more before we kill it more. Especially understanding there are a glut of guys with 100 power which should result in the ultimate top end of the spectrum there.

I also think some of these are probably a layer too complex for GLB2's/Bort's intention. I don't know where that line stands today, but back around alpha testing there was sort of a feel that some things were GLB1 territory (the hardcore) and others were GLB2. GLB2 was sort of the every man's tactical game where as GLB1 was the gimme full control, even if it's over my head difficult.

Lastly, I think some of these would create stacking effects with morale penalties that are naturally supposed to make the same actions happen. There's a balance there for certain things to maybe be more impactful or associate with morale (rather than some uber stack that causes a wild/too strong change).
 
william78
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Originally posted by InRomoWeTrust
Like and dislike some of these. Part of the reason why we suggest against compilation threads (see Pallow's thread here) for +1 sake. Just makes discussion and 'voting' difficult.

I'd like to feel out the punting distance a little more before we kill it more. Especially understanding there are a glut of guys with 100 power which should result in the ultimate top end of the spectrum there.

I also think some of these are probably a layer too complex for GLB2's/Bort's intention. I don't know where that line stands today, but back around alpha testing there was sort of a feel that some things were GLB1 territory (the hardcore) and others were GLB2. GLB2 was sort of the every man's tactical game where as GLB1 was the gimme full control, even if it's over my head difficult.

Lastly, I think some of these would create stacking effects with morale penalties that are naturally supposed to make the same actions happen. There's a balance there for certain things to maybe be more impactful or associate with morale (rather than some uber stack that causes a wild/too strong change).


I'm not sure how these make the game more complicated for players. Aside from some settings controls there is really nothing added on the player side.

Also ..not sure how many Punts we need to see? NFL Hall of Fame lists the record as 75 yards in the air - in Denver (thin air) with the wind at Steve O'Neals back and that one has held since 1969. We have kickers routinely hitting punts near that distance. 100 Accuracy in the game doesn't mean you never miss a pass; not sure why 100 punting power equates to NFL record territory.

Also one of the big reasons they are al together is for balance. Several of these suggestions tend to balance game play effects; for example letting players hitting the QB cause rattle balances well with giving mobile QBs more space to run or strong QBs the opportunity to attempt a pass while going down. Would tend to interact rather than simply playing whack a mole with whatever the latest changes are.
 
Makntak
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Some truly excellent suggestions, william78.

It strikes me that those of us who are into this game crave more complexity and control and the K.I.S.S. model that GLB 2 is notionally designed to favour is frustrating because we can all see shedloads of nonsense that we can do nothing about. You address a lot of that nonsense with these suggestions and it took GLB Classic what, 30 seasons and four years to come out of Beta?, so there's still plenty of time for Bort & CD to recognise that the hardcore userbase who spend most money on their game should probably be serviced with these kinds of ideas in order to keep us here and to keep us spending.

 
william78
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Originally posted by Makntak
Some truly excellent suggestions, william78.

It strikes me that those of us who are into this game crave more complexity and control and the K.I.S.S. model that GLB 2 is notionally designed to favour is frustrating because we can all see shedloads of nonsense that we can do nothing about. You address a lot of that nonsense with these suggestions and it took GLB Classic what, 30 seasons and four years to come out of Beta?, so there's still plenty of time for Bort & CD to recognise that the hardcore userbase who spend most money on their game should probably be serviced with these kinds of ideas in order to keep us here and to keep us spending.



I have no problem with them making incremental changes. I'm certainly not asking for perfection or that any suggestion I put out there is suddenly adopted. My biggest concern, which I've done a really poor job of explaining, is the mindset of how changes are made. When running QBs were over powered I made a lot of suggestions there to none of which were implemented - but the suggestion I came up with improved gameplay. I applauded even if it wasn't my idea. They didn't just "nerf" the running QBs though or make the goalline sets more counterable with lowering the blocking variables. Just changing the equation slightly isn't the type of answer I'm looking for.

The suggestions above, despite initial looks, don't complicate lives of players or coordinators. They just provide a more realistic solutions to the problem of "dumb toons" in terms of how they play in the sim. Other than adding a few decisions on player levers there is nothing here thats extra work. For example: Figuring out if your QB is a scramble to run guy or scramble to throw guy isn't that much of a challenge. If your CB is a feet at the sticks or an in your face press guy adds depth through settings, provides more realistic options to deal with mono-directional teams and provides fixes without just slapping it with a nerf gun.
Edited by william78 on Feb 4, 2015 07:02:54
 
william78
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To be much shorter:
Throwing a pass to the WR1 and WR2 against man coverage with a cover 2 shell should be hard.
Throwing a pass against a safety or LBer trying to cover the WR3 or WR4 should be fairly easy.
Ratting a QB should be about pressure generated not sacks recorded.
Firing the ball into double (or triple) coverage should be a more challenging completion.
Interceptions should happen when QBs make throws into the teeth of coverage more often.

None of that is addressed by simply make the QB have less passing velocity and make the ball harder for the wide receiver to catch.


 
bhall43
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Originally posted by william78
To be much shorter:
Throwing a pass against a safety or LBer trying to cover the WR3 or WR4 should be fairly easy.



Why even build players?
 
bhall43
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I also don't understand the realism you are trying to reflect by giving so many buffs to ridiculous skills based off a team running or passing 3 consecutive times in a row. Awareness sure. But all the other boosts make entirely no sense whatsoever. Not to mention those would be compounded by morale which already does those things.
 
william78
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Originally posted by bhall43
Why even build players?


All good I'm starting to get the feeling this game tent may not be big enough to include me into it. Not a complaint just a fact from responses I've seen in general. It started off big enough and I realize that some video gaming is certainly necessary; IE the number of 80 yard runs or 80 yard catches and runs. I'm good with all that. Romo said he thinks this is the best the sim has ever looked; to me its never looked worse because looking at marginal effect across the board the actual football chess match is way off and thats one of the things I really enjoy. Again, a football guy not really a gamer per say.

Nothing stops you from covering those WR's with a CB to answer your question about why even build players, aside from the coverage plays not being great because the CB's are essentially dumb. Just for general edification most of the guys we think as "Great" coverage safeties still have large completion against percentages with a mean average around 66.7% against all players and it goes even higher if they are covering a wide receiver one on one.

That really "average" safeties (non-superstar) and linebackers and able to contain WR's looks totally wrong to me especially when I see essentially run stuffing builds doing it. Those are the mismatches a regular football game would exploit.

Either way; wouldn't complain too much its been a good year and a half run - had some fun got a nice break at work. I just get the feeling I'm asking the game to go in a different direction than what I think is intended or what a lot of regular posters/mods really want. It was fun I've enjoyed my team and teammates, my wife (much to my surprise) liked the game after growing up in a country without american football; however given the current direction.... may just no longer be the game for me. I'm not going to make a final decision until I guess day 40 or so; I brought agents back so I'm committed for this season but don't think I want to return at this point. I think its just too much "video game" not enough football for me.


 
bhall43
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I am just saying if we are going to give these players natural disadvantages (granted I think they do based on weight anyways) you may as well just take out the man coverage abilities all together. What is the point?

Certainly a lot of things could be done to make this sim better but I don't know how easy some of the fixes really are from a coding perspective. I know that was one huge thing that pulled GLB1 out of beta was it got to the point where the perceived "easy" sim fixes from a coding perspective weren't all that easy and all that was being done was adding layers to problems.

I do wonder why we can't recreate the vision checks that allowed for cut backs in GLB1 over here? Then again defenders have the exact same problem it seems.
 
bhall43
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fwiw if the goal of GLB2 was to produce balanced offenses and defenses, I would have much rather this been a buy a team sort of deal where the players are all just there. Then each season as a coach I get options to place certain boosts to my team for home games.
 
william78
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Originally posted by bhall43
I am just saying if we are going to give these players natural disadvantages (granted I think they do based on weight anyways) you may as well just take out the man coverage abilities all together. What is the point?

Certainly a lot of things could be done to make this sim better but I don't know how easy some of the fixes really are from a coding perspective. I know that was one huge thing that pulled GLB1 out of beta was it got to the point where the perceived "easy" sim fixes from a coding perspective weren't all that easy and all that was being done was adding layers to problems.

I do wonder why we can't recreate the vision checks that allowed for cut backs in GLB1 over here? Then again defenders have the exact same problem it seems.


To your first point I'd say not really. The build should absolutely have an effect but just for example: Morgan Burnett in GB gave up 77.5% of passes thrown at him ; Earl Thomas gave up 56.5%. Even adjusting for video gaming I wouldn't mind if a SS* safety is giving up 40% or so while iso'd on the receiver, or if the build was 100% pass coverage I could see that. Having knock out guys stay with route running TE's or slot WR's and deflecting passes on a routine basis looks goofy.

Right now you have a better chance to complete a 25 yard pass running Chalice from Diamond sets against a cover 2 shell with a safety and CB on the WR than you do of completing a 6 yard crossing route to the WR3 against ZEB even if the defense doesn't rattle the QB.

I'm really more disappointed that the solution was a "nerf" rather than answering the question how do we make the passing more realistic? To me it looks much much further from realism today from a play interaction perspective.
 
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