Warrior General Games

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=4313602&page=1

Obviously the formula for punters is bugged in terms of punting quantity or total yards which is obviously going to be higher for the punters on the worst teams because they punt a lot more.

This is most noticeable in competitive leagues like WL and other leagues where there are less cpu games because KR/PRs and STOPs can rack up crazy unrealistic stats against CPU teams like 5ffum or 20 return TDs against CPUs in a 700-0 blowouts.

Because competitive leagues don't allow KR/PRs to have 10 TDs every 2-3 games the punters on bad teams who punt every other drive rack up crazy "total punt yards" and because they are always punting from their own 20 their punt yard avg is higher too than a guy who punts from the 45 on a good team and has to coffin corner it for 45 yards rather than booting it from his own 20 for 65yds.

This is creating very unrealistic and stupid looking ST MVP results which also is taking away local/national endorsements from those teams because you can only have a set number of endorsements.


I suggest that the formula not count at all "total" punt yards and focus more on things like coffin corners and then increase avg punt return yards (rather than total) and count tackles/fumbles/fumblerecoveries more for STOPS considering how important they are in the modern sim.

Not sure where to put this but the punters on the worst teams being in the top MVP voting definitely counts as "not working as intended"

There are a lot of issues in regards to MVP formula. Offensive MVP is always a QB or HB. My TE leads the entire league in receiving yards and is 2nd in TD's but he is not even in the top 10 for MVP.

All you can do is make a suggestion in the suggestions thread and move on with your life.

Here's the thing. Blowout Adjusted Stats are hurting returners in this situation because of obvious reasons. Yard totals, TD totals, etc.

The same theory, at least imo, does not apply to Punters because they perform no better in blowouts, they just perform more.

Now this:
Originally posted by chronoaug

I suggest

Indicates where I think this thread should likely go, but I'm really on the fence on this one. I think you're asking for a nerf to punters, the thread you linked most certainly is. I disagree with that. What I think is "not working as intended" (I can also put quotes around it and be snarky too people) is that the total punt yards or even total punts may be factoring heavily into the calculations and if that's the truth, then Punters winning MVP is an unintended result of Blowout Adjusted Stats working in their favor and against returners.

If it's decided solely on punting average, then punters most certainly deserve a shot at MVP. I have a punter averaging 46.4 ypp and I'm sure there are some closer to 50.

It is for this confusion and/or unknown/needs-to-be-tweaked formula that I think this deserves a closer look.

Likely a bug.

It's not just blowout adjusted because i'm talking about competitive leagues where there aren't a lot of blowouts like WL. The retuners obviously aren't going to get 60TDs on the season. But the MVP is setup that way due to the lower levels. IMO it should be next to impossible for a punter to win the MVP unless you start adding stats like % of punts inside the 10 or 5 yard line compared to touchbacks or something like that.

For KR/PR return avg needs to be taken into consideration more instead of just total yards and STOPs should have something in the equation other than just FFum or make the FFum more valuable and count tackles as well. Because STOPs are super important in top pro and WL now and the top teams usually have some great STOPs

I agree with everything chrono is saying... one thing I would like to add is that there needs to be a stiff penalty for missing tackles (if there already is it needs to be higher).

If everything that Chrono is talking is fixed (as it should be) then it will be near impossible for a non-returner to win ST MVP's simply because many use their speedy returners as gunners to rack up tackling stats even if they are missing 25% of the tackles.

Originally posted by VolBrian
What I think is "not working as intended" (I can also put quotes around it and be snarky too people) is that the total punt yards or even total punts may be factoring heavily into the calculations and if that's the truth, then Punters winning MVP is an unintended result of Blowout Adjusted Stats working in their favor and against returners.

That still sounds like a suggestion to me.

STOPs getting essentially zero consideration like they do now is definitely a bug. I also agree with chrono that punters getting so much love for raw punt yardage is also a bug.

Originally posted by Lensar
Originally posted by VolBrian

What I think is "not working as intended" (I can also put quotes around it and be snarky too people) is that the total punt yards or even total punts may be factoring heavily into the calculations and if that's the truth, then Punters winning MVP is an unintended result of Blowout Adjusted Stats working in their favor and against returners.

That still sounds like a suggestion to me.


You people are crazy. There is OBVIOUSLY a FLAW/BUG (whatever the hell you want to call it) with how the ST MVP is being awarded. Are you denying this?

Just because Chrono provides a SOLUTION to how this FLAW/BUG might be addressed does not make this a suggestion thread.

I am sick and tired of watching you guys close bug threads because the OP was thorough enough to provide a solution to the obvious bug that they have detailed.

Originally posted by beenlurken
You people are crazy. There is OBVIOUSLY a FLAW/BUG (whatever the hell you want to call it) with how the ST MVP is being awarded. Are you denying this?

The MVP selections aren't really selecting MVPs. You'd need to have people do that or a far more advanced rating system then what we have in GLB. They measure what they measure, which unfortunately is not going to always match what we might traditionally think of as an MVP.

There is almost an infinite number of factors that we could take into account when trying to have the sim determine who was the most valuable player in a conference. Improving it might be a very excellent idea, but it's really a suggestion, not a bug.

Simply put, a bug is something that is not working the way Bort intends it to. Only Bort truly knows what he intends, and he's also been known to occasionally change his mind on things as well, so it's definitely not an exact science. Punters who do a ton of punting rack up the stats (even after being blowout adjusted) and therefor get a lot of credit in the MVP rankings. Who is really to say if that is right or wrong?

If something isn't clearly broken, we can't mark it as a bug. I'm sure that sometime in the future, Bort will decide to take another look at the MVP system overall to make some enhancements to it, or to roll out an entirely new system. He'll definitely keep in mind any suggestions that are made (in the suggestion forum of course). Marking it as a bug isn't going to help bring about any change.

I'm pretty sure it is a bug as I don't believe bort intended the punter who simply punts the most to be regarded as the best punter or ST player in the league. It is not working as bort/catch originally intended. It's working as coded, yes. However, the is a problem with the coding preventing their vision from being the actual output


Now the rest of the thing is a suggestion in how the ST mvp should be worked and other alterations. What i'm claiming is a bug is the issue of sheer number of punts by being on the worst teams generating the large MVP impact. Pretty sure if you ask bort "hey, did you want the punter who punts the most because he's on the worst team to be ranked the best punter/st player?" i'm sure he would say something about how he wanted to give punters a chance but didn't realize that's how it would end up being counted.

I do believe it's a bug. It's not a random glitch but some of the bugs in this threads are not glitches but bugs or coding issues. Doesn't have to be something like a dot on an axis close to 0/0 so he spins around. Bort actually coded the blitzers not to sack the QB on screens but that was obviously not his intention therefore it was appropriate for the bug forum and Catch22 confirmed. I believe this falls into the same category

Originally posted by chronoaug
I'm pretty sure it is a bug as I don't believe bort intended the punter who simply punts the most to be regarded as the best punter or ST player in the league. It is not working as bort/catch originally intended. It's working as coded, yes. However, the is a problem with the coding preventing their vision from being the actual output


Now the rest of the thing is a suggestion in how the ST mvp should be worked and other alterations. What i'm claiming is a bug is the issue of sheer number of punts by being on the worst teams generating the large MVP impact. Pretty sure if you ask bort "hey, did you want the punter who punts the most because he's on the worst team to be ranked the best punter/st player?" i'm sure he would say something about how he wanted to give punters a chance but didn't realize that's how it would end up being counted.

I do believe it's a bug. It's not a random glitch but some of the bugs in this threads are not glitches but bugs or coding issues. Doesn't have to be something like a dot on an axis close to 0/0 so he spins around. Bort actually coded the blitzers not to sack the QB on screens but that was obviously not his intention therefore it was appropriate for the bug forum and Catch22 confirmed. I believe this falls into the same category

This right here!! ^^^^^

Lensar - Do you honestly feel that Borts intentions for ST MVP results at the WL level was to have the majority of the top 10 be punters and kickers? Come on man, admit its a bug (by your definition) already!!

Originally posted by chronoaug
I'm pretty sure it is a bug as I don't believe bort intended the punter who simply punts the most to be regarded as the best punter or ST player in the league. It is not working as bort/catch originally intended. It's working as coded, yes. However, the is a problem with the coding preventing their vision from being the actual output


Now the rest of the thing is a suggestion in how the ST mvp should be worked and other alterations. What i'm claiming is a bug is the issue of sheer number of punts by being on the worst teams generating the large MVP impact. Pretty sure if you ask bort "hey, did you want the punter who punts the most because he's on the worst team to be ranked the best punter/st player?" i'm sure he would say something about how he wanted to give punters a chance but didn't realize that's how it would end up being counted.

I do believe it's a bug. It's not a random glitch but some of the bugs in this threads are not glitches but bugs or coding issues. Doesn't have to be something like a dot on an axis close to 0/0 so he spins around. Bort actually coded the blitzers not to sack the QB on screens but that was obviously not his intention therefore it was appropriate for the bug forum and Catch22 confirmed. I believe this falls into the same category

Amen brother!

Also think it is counter intuitive for the mvp eq to be randomly assigned to someone in the top 5, but I digress.

Since this is a thread about the MVP formula than I will post a related question:

My TE is leading the entire league in reception yards and leads the league in TD's. How is he not even in the top 10 candidates? Why is it always a QB or HB? I am not saying he should be the leading candidate....but not even in the top 10?

Originally posted by whodey08
Since this is a thread about the MVP formula than I will post a related question:

My TE is leading the entire league in reception yards and leads the league in TD's. How is he not even in the top 10 candidates? Why is it always a QB or HB? I am not saying he should be the leading candidate....but not even in the top 10?



it goes by blowout adjusted stats, where he doesn't lead WR's for td's

Guys. This is about specifically the ST MVP issues. Not random suggestions or questions about other MVP things or how endrosements are handed out. Sorry to do that but it's true.