Warrior General Games

Originally posted by Theo Wizzago
I built a punter that way. Was fun as hell. You don't need a boatload of speed... just enough. I think I ended up with 70-80+ (maybe with a little EQ help as well) which was enough to close the distance from the middle of the field to the edge. One thing that you want to do is get Closing Speed as your extra SA. Really helps (actually decent SA for any dot with less than 100 speed on defense). Also made sure to have at least one MT AEQ piece.
The thing is (trouble with the build) wasn't that it wasn't a good punter... did just awesome (oh... use the Boomer arch... better strength)... the trouble is, despite all the effort put into the build, most returners are stopped early before they reach you. I think I had 9 tackles in the whole career. But no missed tackles.





Obviously, you'd rather have the returner tackled downfield, but no matter how good a ST is,
eventually a returner will hit something given enough chances- i like the idea of a punter who can be a last line
of defense. I'm assuming just having decent agility and a bit of speed would be enough to make some of those tackles-
along with the strength i assume most P and K would be going for. What I wonder is if agility has any improvement
in kicking and punting at all? It definitely seems to make some improvements in throwing and tackle breaking ability...

I'm not sure if that 'closed build' comment was directed at my team or at others
-but it definitely applies to my team, and that's how its stayin: every league we've ever been in
has been competitive and cutthroat as hell, and they really don't need to see exactly
how fast our runners (and QB), receivers and DBs are or what builds our LBs are using...
i'd gladly make anyone a GM if they are interested in seeing what we are attempting to do
but no i'm not going to open any builds or encourage our players to do so...
heck right now we could use any advantage we can get lol. I'm pretty sure
most people would be hard-pressed to peg what Tif da Cat's atts are anyhow
and even i have no idea what she will do on any given play

Originally posted by darncat
Obviously, you'd rather have the returner tackled downfield, but no matter how good a ST is,
eventually a returner will hit something given enough chances- i like the idea of a punter who can be a last line
of defense. I'm assuming just having decent agility and a bit of speed would be enough to make some of those tackles-
along with the strength i assume most P and K would be going for. What I wonder is if agility has any improvement
in kicking and punting at all? It definitely seems to make some improvements in throwing and tackle breaking ability...

Agility helps with punting mechanics (I'm gonna assume this means helping in accuracy more than with distance but it could help both). As far as how much is important, I'd guess it's pretty much the same as Agility is with QB's (helps with throwing mechanics). You don't want it down in the 40's... but taking it up to 90 is overkill (IMO). 70-ish? Maybe low 80's tops? As for helping the punter get to and make tackles, not as helpful as Closing Speed would be (again, IMO). Picture in your mind how the play unfolds... the punter is the farthest dot away from the returner when the returner makes the catch. He's in the middle of the field and can watch which way the returner decides to go, slowly moving in that direction to be in position. His speed is likely 1/2 that of the returner though and once the returner reaches a gap in the last line of defense, the punter NEEDS a burst to 'close the gap' and make a tackle attempt... or, just as important, force the returner to shed speed to make a 'move' (juke, spin, whatever)... allowing the faster dots on defense to catch him from behind and make the tackle.
Either way, it's all about putting the punter in a good position first. Half the job is done by the play itself (having the punter start in the middle of the field). In the end you still want a punter's job to be Punting 1st... and the best deterrence to a return is the ol' coffin corner punt... so what you're really doing building this way (tackling punter style) is to scrub off a bit of his Punting skill and put it into tackling. Most punters end up with around 70 speed and 75 agility if build only for punting alone... so you're wanting to add to his tackling more than anything else.

in any event, even if were talking K or P i assume you still want to go w/ quad training? and not spend all the BT on SP

Originally posted by lexden11


Lex... I said 'around' I've seen them with less... and I've seen them with more. I just wanted to hit the middle area ABAP.

Originally posted by darncat
in any event, even if were talking K or P i assume you still want to go w/ quad training? and not spend all the BT on SP

Yes.

I have built ridiculously high quality Punters (5+ x’s MVP, etc) with around 50 agility and fkn 10 speed. 12 stamina, too.

Theo you’re delusional. If ANY “punt only” Punter is taking speed anywhere NEAR 70, that’s fkn hilarious and wildly excessive. If trying to make a special teamer/tackler out of the guy, that’s different, and accounts for probably 5% of all P builds, so too rare to mention.

Again, Theo I want what you smoke. Das good shit

Originally posted by YOM77
I have built ridiculously high quality Punters (5+ x’s MVP, etc) with around 50 agility and fkn 10 speed. 12 stamina, too.

Theo you’re delusional. If ANY “punt only” Punter is taking speed anywhere NEAR 70, that’s fkn hilarious and wildly excessive. If trying to make a special teamer/tackler out of the guy, that’s different, and accounts for probably 5% of all P builds, so too rare to mention.

Again, Theo I want what you smoke. Das good shit

You misunderstood, man (and I wasn't very clear in my post either). When I said 'around 70' I should've also said 'and/or' when talking about speed/agility. Obviously, if you're building an extreme punter only style, you''d just virtually ignore speed... but ignoring agility could lead to too many shanks and also screw with your 'coffin corner' attempts. Even you listed 50 as your end number.

And yes, mostly I was talking about a 'Punt Only' style build but a Punter that could (make a) tackle. My last punter had 70 speed. Also had 50 tackling. What you sacrifice is Punting, stopping it shorter than most do.

I thought it out and estimated the number of 70+ yard punts I might make (at or near Plateau) in my career vs how many 50 yard punts I'd likely make (all based on field position when punting)... and reckoned my 50 yard punts were not only more frequent but more important. Hangtime and coffin corner are much more important to the ST's than out-kicking the coverage just for a outside shot at maybe pinning them behind their 20. Besides... It's about winning and if you're building 80 yard punters then you sure don't seem to have any confidence in your team's ability to make your punter obsolete and a dust collector on the bench... much less needing to punt the ball that far. There are some teams out there that don't even HAVE a punter on them because they refuse to punt.

I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one who's tried this with Punters. Originally, I thought I could build a 'STOP/Punter' that could play on kick offs as well (saving some dot for defense) but I couldn't convince the ST coach to give it a try so I don't know if it would've worked. Someday I'd like to try it again... maybe.


(P.S. You couldn't handle what I smoke, bro. )

i hate punting lol- never met a fourth down i don't think about goin for lol
were i to make a P, i'd give him at least 70 agility
simply because i'd give any player i made at least 70 agility, cuz no slowpokes.
if i had to make the dot for the guy who sells hot dogs, i'd give his ass 70 agility too